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Old 25-04-2012, 15:41   #16
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

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If you are not a cash buyer, better not to own any boat. That is my thoughts.
Maybe so, but that would eliminate most of the boats on the water at present :-) Bill
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Old 25-04-2012, 17:02   #17
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

You'd like to think that as an example that in 10 years time a 2000 model 40' FP Lavezzi or similar would still be holding together well and would be less than half the price it is today. It would then be 22 years old.

I somehow think that the price they are today, will be the price that they are in 10 years from now, for the same boat, assuming it's reasonalbly well looked after. Let's hope that they last that long and don't fall apart because my savings plan says 10+ years and the wife currently says no!
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Old 25-04-2012, 17:27   #18
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

Depending on your own skill level but all boats require ongoing upkeep. After 27yrs my boat is still looking good but it has been repainted several times & engines overhauled new sails & rigging so you do have to spend that 10% ( wife has a different amount ) on keeping up the boat in a good condition.
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Old 25-04-2012, 22:50   #19
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

Thanks to all who contributed. Where is this is going? I 'm wanting to use the boat as a holiday home every other month or so, but the 10% per an scares me a lot as in my reclining years my earning capacity is dwindling like everyone else'. No point whinging if that is what it is, but I have noticed that some get out of their boats after just a few years, so maybe that's the reason. Anyway I'm thinking of going two ways here: I seem to be liking the BroadBlue 385 more and more and I guess that's because of the safety and stability features that make me feel good, please tell me why, but I'm also smitten with the Gemini 105mc, go figure.
I know that they are chalk and cheese, but the Gemini is at least an inexpensive way to get on the water and 10% of a gemini is palatable.
One more thing, I'll be berthing at Hervey Bay, Qld and running up and down the coast.
Any comments on either choice or others would be appreciated.
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Old 25-04-2012, 23:33   #20
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

If you bought something like a Seawind 1000 at something like 200 to 250 k there is no way you will spend 10% of that per year. Amortising sails and standing rigging and motors over a 10 year period would be less than 3000 per year. Add in 2000 per year for running rigging, batteries and pumps etc and 500 per year for antifouling. Talk to a charter consultant and they will have a good grasp on what people spend on maintaining a charter boat which should be at the extreme top end

Only using the seawind costs as I know the gear prices.

To use something else, there is are lots of boats in that 200-250 range from a Kerr 43 foot aluminium cruiser to late model 10-11 metre schionnings. You can get good cheap GBEs that will do fine out of Hervey bay and for the coral coast for 100K

Its not the boat maintenance that will kill you, sails and rigging etc are reasonably economical, its the systems, extensive electrical systems, diesel inboards etc are where you will spend money.
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Old 26-04-2012, 04:29   #21
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

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diesel inboards etc are where you will spend money.
Money well spent.
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Old 26-04-2012, 04:52   #22
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I have had plenty of outboard issues over 35 years,yet to have an issue with the yanmar diesels,
Great economy and its very easy to have 600-800 litres on board.
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Old 26-04-2012, 05:53   #23
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

Dirkdig - you need to clean out your inbox - it's not accepting any messages.
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Old 26-04-2012, 06:06   #24
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I would have thought the fuel storage with outboards would be dangerous too?
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Old 26-04-2012, 06:47   #25
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

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I have had plenty of outboard issues over 35 years,yet to have an issue with the yanmar diesels,
Great economy and its very easy to have 600-800 litres on board.
I'm not knocking diesels, I sell plenty of boats with them, but they cost more to own and run than outboards, and for what the OP is intending to do, they may not be necessary.

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I would have thought the fuel storage with outboards would be dangerous too?
You don't have a tender on your boat? Fuel storage on my boat is quite safe, the tanks and lines and motors are all outside the habitable fabric of the boat. You know, a bit like the petrol car I drive.

But that is not what the point of the comment was - it is simply to say that I think 10% is more than necessary or reasonable. And certainly more than my experience with any boat I have owned. I am trying to work out how someone could in fact spend 60,000 on a boat, in maintenance. Your boat is worth say 600K to 700K, (arbitrary price point for a pre-loved 440) do you spend 60,000 year (allowing for amortised costs such as long term sail and rigging and motor repairs). Serious question. I wouldn't think you would.

And I don't skimp on my boat, but the majority of maintenance is in elbow grease not dollars. Just out last week - antifouling and polishing - shined up pretty well! If I paid someone to do it all it could have cost a couple of thousand or more but I did most of the work myself and only cost the materials. Of course that isn't an option for some people, so they have to factor that in.

My point is I think 10% is too high. Certainly for my and the OPs part of the world.
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Old 26-04-2012, 07:07   #26
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

Elbow grease is only cheap when its your own elbow. Boat ownership becomes costly when you can't/don't do the work. If you don't understand mechanical and tech systems, a simple whatever is $500.
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Old 26-04-2012, 09:10   #27
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

The fixed cost of insurance & marina fees for a cat... another $9000-$10000 PA. These are my major cost. Marina operators will charge 1.5 to 2 times the cost & it goes up every year!! Fuel is the least cost of all for my boat.

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Old 26-04-2012, 15:42   #28
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My expences without going anywhere are roughly
Insurance $4400
Antifoul $3500 including anodes
Berthing $9600
Service on the diesels $800
Genset $300
Sails $2500
Upkeep and repairs $3000
Polish and wax $2000 i use Dulon
Wear and tear items $2500

Thats about it i think.
I do a lot of the work myself and buy nearly all parts from overseas at 25 to 35% of what they cost here.

Depreciation currently i estimate at about $60,000 per year on my boat.

These are my real costs and i would minimise them if i could.

For what the op has said the type of cats he is looking at would be awesome around Harvey bay.
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Old 26-04-2012, 16:06   #29
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

Absolutely agree on the berthing and insurance, but they aren't maintenance. But even including them doesn't get the figures to 10% of your boat cost. My point is simply that the OP can by a boat for his area and enjoy it for not a silly amount of money.

I bought a multi marina berth many years ago and the amortised cost will be about 2500 per year. There are of course yearly fees of about 1250 to the marina company (a not for profit operation).
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Old 26-04-2012, 17:27   #30
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Re: How old is too old for a FRP cat

Thanks to all again, this sort of stuff is priceless for a beginner.

I didn't realise how much insurance, etc was going to be, wow. Definately wont be purchasing anything above 200k then.

Dilligara mention ally and now I'm keen to find out about them. Iv'e naturally looked at Seawinds, but the older ones (my $ bracket), seem very spartan. Are they as good as they say?

Also, there are new hulls getting around that require finishing. Is this out of the budget?
Ask $ is around 85-100k.

Cheers
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