HarryProa Cruiser 50

[lucdekeyser]

The Denney team is proposing the HarryProa Cruiser 50.

It retains all the features of the HarryProa Cruiser 60 in production at Ballotta in Peru and discussed already in an earlier thread a half year ago. The downsizeing does not seem to have required difficult compromises. Berths are still queen size. All else seems just proportionally smaller. The step in the galley has been eliminated. Surprising is the integration of a rather long tender over the full length of the deck. It doubles as an outboard sled. The discussion about the preference to switch props between the two different tasks remains relevant here.

For in the tropics, the same concerns: overhang over the windows and at least canvas protection over the more popular parts of the deck would not seem to contradict the design too much. Another suggestion was to use instead a sliding door and window to deck and a servery in the window like on Lagoons.

I think the wife would still prefer the HP Cruiser 60, but there is nothing essential missing on the HP Cruiser 50 that I can see. But then I pack light.

[Boatguy30]

Rob certainly has a whole great rational for these designs. I personally don't see how they improve on the standard catamaran concept except perhaps in cost, but it is possible to build a fast, roomy not to expensive cat out of many different materials.

[lucdekeyser]

A lower cost to build is attractive but more important is the cost of ownership over X years for the type of cruising done. This HarryProa is (already or only - depending on your perspective) in its second generation design. Although further simplification has eased the shapes to build and brought down drastically the number of parts to go wrong, its track record still needs to be confirmed over the coming years. For better or for worse, a number of makes of catamarans have already a track record. These make sense for a more conservative choice.
My impression is that the simplcity of the HP's make it inherently more safe for below average sailors like us cruising in European waters. Of course, the boat is only a part of that equation.

[Boatguy30]

Plus you pay dockage on 50 or 60' for about the room of a 40' cat. Not an issue long term cruising, but you start and finish at some point and may want to own over many years.

[lucdekeyser]

True. It would not be the smartest houseboat on a rental dock.

[rob denney]

Originally Posted by Boatguy30

Rob certainly has a whole great rational for these designs. I personally don't see how they improve on the standard catamaran concept except perhaps in cost, but it is possible to build a fast, roomy not to expensive cat out of many different materials.

It is commonly agreed that proas provides the most performance for the least money. And that they have drawbacks in terms of handling, righting moment and room.
Harryproas overcome the drawbacks without losing the performance or the cost benefits. The reasons for this are explained at The Harryproa Concept |

Beyond this, the latest harrys are special for two reasons.
First, they are simpler, quicker, cheaper and, uniquely, cleaner to build.
The hulls and and decks are infused in simple moulds made from mdf. These moulds do not require any filling, fairing or polishing.
The laminate is then laid up dry in the moulds, including variations in core and laminate, local reinforcing, holes for masts, beams and skin fittings, slots or self aligning joins for all the fit out, the plumbing and the electric cables.
This is then infused. A near magical experience for anyone who has hand laminated a hull.

The shelves (including edges, lips and cupboards), bulkheads (including hatches, doors, doorways), bunk tops (incl hatches) and the rest of the fitout are infused on a sheet of mdf.

The shelves etc are glued into self aligning slots in the hull/deck halves, which are in turn glued together, ready for internal and external high build paint.

There is no cutting, grinding or sanding of cured glass, wet laminating, filletting, taping or fairing.

The boats are quicker to build, there is less waste, close to no mess or dust and minimal exposure to toxic materials. The laminate is perfect, and the finished job is appreciably lighter than conventional methods.

Intelligent infusion contains no new skills, apart from the infusion itself. It is the culmination of a lot of small things put together to make building easier, cheaper and more enjoyable.
Infusion is a very easily learned skill, requiring a $250 vacuum pump and low cost materials from the hardware store. There are hundreds of 'how to" videos on line and the plans are very detailed.

All this is in sharp contrast to "standard cat concepts".

The second unique point is the tender. On the 50, it is 6.2m/21' long with a large outboard. It is hinged to the beams and stored in an open space on the bridgedeck, where it doubles as the in situ propulsion unit for the mothership, further reducing the weight and complexity of the build.

It has more speed, stability, payload, range and seaworthiness than a conventional tender and it's weight is central rather than rather than weighing the stern down in davits.

For those rare times that a smaller tender is required, the front half can be unbolted from the back to provide a conventional small tender.

For clarification of any of the above, or more information, feel free to email me at harryproa@gmail.com

rob

[ZULU40]

Originally Posted by Boatguy30

Rob certainly has a whole great rational for these designs. I personally don't see how they improve on the standard catamaran concept except perhaps in cost, but it is possible to build a fast, roomy not to expensive cat out of many different materials.

I think you would be interested in Cruiser 50 if you felt a circa 30ft+ cat was too small for the journeys intended, but a larger cat while giving you the sea ability had a lot of wasted accommodation you probably wouldnt use.

In any event the Cruiser is going to be faster to sail, and given that only one hull has dedicated accommodation, quicker and easier to build. Of course rigs can vary but as it stands easier to sail shorthanded too as cat schooners tend to be.

Looking at videos of other proas in action there is a certain sea kindliness to proas where cats have this kinda double beat cranking. I guess because the proas bows have different entry points into waves.

[lucdekeyser]

Originally Posted by ZULU40

I think you would be interested in Cruiser 50 if you felt a circa 30ft+ cat was too small for the journeys intended, but a larger cat while giving you the sea ability had a lot of wasted accommodation you probably wouldnt use.

It is not so much that you probably wouldn't use it, because if you have the volume, the temptation is just too great not to fill it up. The HP Cruiser is rather for those who want the seakindliness and safety of a longer boat without the disproportionally increased cost and weight usually associated with that in other boat types. There is nothing wrong with either. The priorities are just different.
And while longer boats are quickly hard to handle, the simplification of using a schooner rig with unstayed masts keeps that nice and easy. And for some this is worth the higher cost at marina's if that is what they use. Altough I see that the upcomming HP Cruiser 40F, Exhilarator, has folding beams and fold up bows.