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Old 03-02-2015, 06:19   #136
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

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Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
It wasn't that long ago that a newly built Cat with a magazine writer onboard suffered rudder failure after getting backed up in a wave. Now we are hearing about the mast going on this Cat because it hit a wave.
I've heard others say that, as well... Where is the cite for that? It's certainly not what Peter Johnstone has so far reported...

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Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
Is there just as much reason to critique the Gunboat construction as there was on the last one??
Shouldn't we be questioning the construction of the Hylas 70 that was dismasted after hitting a ledge in a light breeze on a picture-perfect summer afternoon in Penobscot Bay, as well?





Should Jongert be added to the list of builders whose standards of construction should be questioned?






It's likely we'll never know the real cause of this failure, the rig was cut away, after all... And, given the weather in that part of the Atlantic since the incident, it's no sure thing RAINMAKER will be recovered...

But, being hit by a 70 knot "wall of wind" 200 NM SE of Hatteras in January, seems not an unlikely scenario where most any boat might have suffered a rig failure, no?
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Old 03-02-2015, 06:23   #137
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

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Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
Oh man...
First.... The boat was CLEARLY taking on water.... Things can go from "manageable dewatering" to "we have less than 5 minutes" in a heartbeat...

When you call for help... They come when it is best determined by the professionals....



I'll send a PM and help explain the rules and etiquette...



+1x1,000x.....

(quote redacted for clarity)

I haven't seen any reports of it taking on water. Do you have a link?
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Old 03-02-2015, 06:25   #138
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

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Oh man...
First.... The boat was CLEARLY taking on water.... Things can go from "manageable dewatering" to "we have less than 5 minutes" in a heartbeat...
Hmmm, I've seen no confirmation of that... Where are you getting that information?
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Old 03-02-2015, 06:29   #139
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

from a quote by Coast Guard member on copter from crew member via Sailing Anarchy " we hit a large wave that came aboard from the bow and mast immediately split" '70 knot wall of wind' seems CYA
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Old 03-02-2015, 06:35   #140
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

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I haven't seen any reports of it taking on water. Do you have a link?
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Originally Posted by Jon Eisberg View Post
Hmmm, I've seen no confirmation of that... Where are you getting that information?
Sorry guys... no CONFIRMED report ... Only my opinion from the video... The sugar scoops are WAY down in the water....

Second guessing, could be from the weight change of the displaced rig, but I think there's more to it....

Didn't mean to say it as fact...
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Old 03-02-2015, 07:30   #141
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

I remember another Gunboat dismasted on ... her way to Hawaii?

That was not all that long ago. What's wrong with their masts and rigging anyway?

b.
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Old 03-02-2015, 07:36   #142
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

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from a quote by Coast Guard member on copter from crew member via Sailing Anarchy " we hit a large wave that came aboard from the bow and mast immediately split" '70 knot wall of wind' seems CYA
Any chance you could point me in the direction of that post?

I've been following both of those threads over there, and can find no such quote attributed to any member of the CG helo crew...

Perhaps you read or heard that somewhere else?
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Old 03-02-2015, 07:48   #143
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

Hard to say. The RIB is still on the davits. Deck looks intact around the mast step. Might be low in the water on the starboard side but could also just be an approaching wave.

Is that chunk of spar on the trampoline on the port side? One thing about carbon, it just explodes. Metal usually deforms before it breaks.
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Old 03-02-2015, 08:03   #144
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

The conjecture on this board is ridiculous, have you ever heard of racing yachts losing rigs? Why? Because they are pushing the envelope of safety margin for the sake of performance. To a degree this is what you have with Gunboat. The are putting a high emphasis on performance, part of that equation is the rig and the desire to keep the weight and windage as low as possible. Compound that with the loads that can go exponential and for which there is no real data when this very high performance carbon design multihull accelerates, you have a higher than normal risk of something failing. You can't have it both ways, if you want a greater margin of safety you are going to give up some performance. The question is where do you draw the line, and that is determined by the consumer. When you get to a certain level of performance in multihulls, things can get out of hand very quickly, and requires a lot of attention and quick reactions. Can there be too much performance for a cruising boat? Absolutely! The majority of the cruising market does not want or need this level of performance, it is way to stressful and dependent on qualified crew.
Advancements in cruising multihull design and more importantly construction has and can offer the cruising sailor faster passages, but the goal is to make that possible with less required by the crew not more.
Remember: "Performance in a cruising boat is measured by VMG divided by energy expended by the crew"
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Old 03-02-2015, 08:54   #145
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

Yes racing yachts do lose their rigs as do cruising yachts. Most recently Alex Thomson's Hugo Boss racer dropped its rig in the Barcelona around the world race in what was described as normal conditions so losing a rig is not exactly uncommon and can happen to any boat at anytime for a variety of reasons. Of course if it is determined that there was nothing wrong with it and it simply broke because it was not designed correctly, well that's another topic.
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Old 03-02-2015, 09:08   #146
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

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Originally Posted by Jon Eisberg View Post
Any chance you could point me in the direction of that post?

I've been following both of those threads over there, and can find no such quote attributed to any member of the CG helo crew...

Perhaps you read or heard that somewhere else?
Jon,
I had initally quoted that in this thread and it came from the text that accompanied the video on the Coast Guards site. But darn if I can find it now. It was there, a direct quote, but maybe it was removed because it was in error.
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Old 03-02-2015, 09:15   #147
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

The builder touts the boat as a circumnavigation capable cruiser but I am not sure I see what I would consider to be a single decent sea berth on board. Personally I think the athwartship kings sized beds would be terrible in a seaway. The other option I can see are the two "couches" on either side of the helm but they're more or less on deck.

Maybe I have it wrong. Do you not need lee-cloths on a cat in rough seas?
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Old 03-02-2015, 09:21   #148
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

We have never needed lee-cloths in pretty rough conditions. Athwartship berths are just the ticket for beam seas as they allow one to experience roll head-to-toe rather than side-to-side.

We have two queen sized berths on our boat - one fore-aft and the other athwartship. We just choose the one more comfortable for any given sea state.

Mostly it doesn't matter, though.

If you haven't sailed much on a catamaran, you may not believe that almost any type or style of berth is a "good sea berth". Just like you may not believe that you don't need galley straps and overhead handholds everywhere, etc.

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Old 03-02-2015, 09:21   #149
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

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Maybe I have it wrong. Do you not need lee-cloths on a cat in rough seas?
No. I've had plenty of my share of rough seas on long passages and have never concluded any such need.

Dave
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Old 03-02-2015, 09:28   #150
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Re: GUNBOAT Dismasting

In that case bring it on. This things got more space than a couple of my last apartments combined!
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