Gemini or Maine Cat 30?

[webejammin]

Here's a video of the Gemini 105Mc crossing the north Atlantic Gemini 105Mc - Transatlantic Voyage on Vimeo . We love our master queen sized salon bed and were not small folks I'm 6 ft and 200 lb's and my wife is not petite at 5' 9". The helm is not too many steps away from the bed, anyway you can just set up in bed and look out the bow window to see what is happening around you. In stormy seasons you can enclose the helm and not need to put on your storm geat to stay dry unless your going on deck. I have seen pic's where guy's has modified a boat trailor to pull one out on a boat launch for dry docking. We love having the screecher track and screecher sail, if it is set up correctly you can see under it well and it can be used in breezes up to 25kt's achording to the sailmaker Dave Bierig. It is conveniant having the disel in the cockpit where std maintance can be performed easly from all sides. The sonic out drive is easier than most folks think, there so easy it took me almost a year to find I didn't need to force anything to work well, it's about finess and keeping it serviced, it sure beats having your saildrive in the water all the time to rust off.

[smj]

Leave the screecher up in 25 kt winds? Dave Bierig must be smoking crack because that is crazy. The screecher is meant to be a light wind sail.

[webejammin]

I am just quoting Dave Bierig from when we bought a replacement screecher sail, we ordered a sewn on sail cover so it won't sun rot like the origional one did because the previous owner never put the cover on. We have not tried it in breezes above over 15 kt's going down wind or quartering off.

[Waterway Guide]

Although we liked the Maine Cat, we picked the Gemini due to the enclosed salon, more airy queen berth, and diesel motor...I think the better "cruising" choice. It has a GREAT yahoo group site...we've used it to solve every problem quickly (except the gel coat..that's a constant issue). Try to get one with the davits/hammock seat...I can't imagine ours without it.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by webejammin

... screecher sail, if it is set up correctly you can see under it well...

Possibly. I was taken out by Gemini factory guys, and I couldn't see beans. It could be they had a different sail? It could also be that they had it hauled in, close reaching in light winds.

Off the wind in 25 knots? Possibly. I've carried a chute on the PDQ over 20 knots, and she's full of fun, all double-digit speeds. Bit I wouldn't call it a good idea for the inexperienced and it requires concentration to stay safe. I learned flying chutes on the Stiletto and a beach cat, both which teach hard lessons. There is no question that capsize is possible with that much power. Cruising cats in this size range are good "8- to 10-knot boats" as the PDQ manual states; they will go faster, but that's not the point. I find 12 knots is about the point where I generally say "enough!"

[Canibul]

I've been looking at numbers. I was a little surprised to see how much more sail the Gemini carries in every position than the Tomcat.

Looking at that boat, I can imagine with two sleeping bags on the tramp and an air mattress on the stern seat, it could sleep a fair contingent at anchor.

I have no illusions as to how it would handle with seven aboard. But I could see us flying them all to meet us some nice snorkelling spot and not doing any sailing while visitors were there.

[Therapy]

We looked at lots before also.

MainCat cost too much and would not fit. It is a great boat though.

TomCat is pretty good too.
outboard outboards - steering and quieter
I have heard the board bangs a lot.
We liked the "openness" but it won't "lock up" very tight.
davits too low

So, as you know we ended up with the Gem.

You can't motor in 18". The leg draws more. Reality with full tanks of water and fuel (and beer) (and a dingy with motor hangin' out) it draws 20-22". The drive leg comes in at around 32" I think. (I have not taken a close measurement). They are well known to have gel coat cracks all over. Nothing structural though. But "ick" factor in eyes of beholders is high.

We like to be able to be in the cockpit in rain and still only get our feet wet (it always blows in some).

Getting out of the berth is not hard really (I am on the outside). Harder for her if I am there though because for some reason my hands bother her as she climbs over.

They are all compromises. We like ours. Just that some things have changed.

[Sand crab]

The Maine Cat is a better boat quality-wise. For instance it has vinylester instead of poly below the waterline. I havn't heard any bitchin about the build. Hard to beat the Gemini for lots of stuff arranged in a rather small space, though. BOB

[MidAtlanticSail]

We bought a Gemini new in 1999 and owned it for 10 years. In 10 years we did not put much money into repairs. The boat to our surprise held up well. It was comfortable for long cruises. The galley design and gas fridge worked out well. We usually ended up with everyone on our boat when we cruised with others because of the room at the table. The boat is not very fast for a catamaran, but the new designed MC's are faster. My wife loved the boat and still misses it greatly. The biggest issue I had with the boat, there is very little shade, so if you can not take too much sun, like myself. You can be in for some very hot days at anchor. I believe they can improve the design by adding hatches to the main window. That is why I eventually sold the boat, because we moved south and the heat is oppressive, and air flow became an issue. The sail-drive that some people complain about gave us little problem. The drive is not the best design and had only one serious issue, that I believe can be a saftey hazard. If the drive is not locked down properly (and there is no way to tell) it will pop-up and you now have a boat with no reverse. We came close to hitting bridges that didn't open on time and lossing reverse when going into strange marinas. It should be designed with a hydralic up and down so it is locked in just like most large gas outboards. That said, we went 9 years before we had to change the steering cables and the boot. We religiously changed the oil in the leg every year. If you buy a Gemini get covers for both wind shields. The sun will distroy them over time and they are not easy to change out. It is a two man project that will take 3 to 4 days the first time you do it. So make sure you do the job right. Currently we do not have a boat and we are looking at cruising boats again. One of the boats we are considering is the Maine Cat because of the air flow and shade that it provides. It looks like it would be a good choice for a boat that will be in hot humid climites most of it's life. But because of the price for used catamarans, we may go back to monohuls. I know they rent Maine Cats in the Florida Keys and we just might get one for a week to see who well they perform.

[Captain Bill]

Having been out on my friend's Maine cat many time sometimes for 2 weeks or more I would describe it as a great boat camping vessel. The gemini on the otherhand is better for long term cruising. The outboards of the Maine Cat offer some convieninces, but have significant limitations especially with regards to electricity generation. My friend had 3 days of rain in the Abacos a few weeks back and was having serious trouble charging his battery without the solar. A small generator is probably a good idea in a Maine Cat. The Gemini on the otherhand is probably a better cruising/livaboard boat. The choice is probably best determined by how you plan to use the boat.

[downunder]

Originally Posted by MidAtlanticSail

We bought a Gemini new in 1999 and owned it for 10 years. In 10 years we did not put much money into repairs. The boat to our surprise held up well. It was comfortable for long cruises. The galley design and gas fridge worked out well. We usually ended up with everyone on our boat when we cruised with others because of the room at the table. The boat is not very fast for a catamaran, but the new designed MC's are faster. My wife loved the boat and still misses it greatly. The biggest issue I had with the boat, there is very little shade, so if you can not take too much sun, like myself. You can be in for some very hot days at anchor. I believe they can improve the design by adding hatches to the main window. That is why I eventually sold the boat, because we moved south and the heat is oppressive, and air flow became an issue. The sail-drive that some people complain about gave us little problem. The drive is not the best design and had only one serious issue, that I believe can be a saftey hazard. If the drive is not locked down properly (and there is no way to tell) it will pop-up and you now have a boat with no reverse. We came close to hitting bridges that didn't open on time and lossing reverse when going into strange marinas. It should be designed with a hydralic up and down so it is locked in just like most large gas outboards. That said, we went 9 years before we had to change the steering cables and the boot. We religiously changed the oil in the leg every year. If you buy a Gemini get covers for both wind shields. The sun will distroy them over time and they are not easy to change out. It is a two man project that will take 3 to 4 days the first time you do it. So make sure you do the job right. Currently we do not have a boat and we are looking at cruising boats again. One of the boats we are considering is the Maine Cat because of the air flow and shade that it provides. It looks like it would be a good choice for a boat that will be in hot humid climites most of it's life. But because of the price for used catamarans, we may go back to monohuls. I know they rent Maine Cats in the Florida Keys and we just might get one for a week to see who well they perform.

Good shade and sun protection is a number one issue particually in the tropics.

[webejammin]

Our 02 Gemini 105Mc has a bigger shade cover for the cocpit than the older models and the cockpit hard dodger has 2 large hatches and when we replaced the plexiglass we got darker tint and no sun proplems. I don't know about beng too hot we have 100+ days and the air flow seams just fine with the 4 hatches open at anchor if there is any breeze and we also have 5 nice fans. I agree on window sun shades help keep the windows good lots longer.

[Dulcesuenos]

I looked at a Gemini just for comparative reasons ( looking for our next boat) last week this a model that 4 years old. There was horrid cracking everywhere. Not just tiny cracks but ones you could slide a business card into. The top deck on the port side had a weak area I thought I might fall thru If the cracks are that bad how can someone say water will never get into the glass and cause further issues?and the fit and finish was very poor. Maybe the earlier ones were better??? The hatches were also very flimsy and everwhere you walked creaked and groaned and this was a very low use boat. Sorry I did not see the appeal for an over 140k boat.

[Therapy]

Originally Posted by Dulcesuenos

I looked at a Gemini just for comparative reasons ( looking for our next boat) last week this a model that 4 years old. There was horrid cracking everywhere. Not just tiny cracks but ones you could slide a business card into. The top deck on the port side had a weak area I thought I might fall thru If the cracks are that bad how can someone say water will never get into the glass and cause further issues?and the fit and finish was very poor. Maybe the earlier ones were better??? The hatches were also very flimsy and everwhere you walked creaked and groaned and this was a very low use boat. Sorry I did not see the appeal for an over 140k boat.

It is really strange that all Gems seem to have that gel coat cracking problem. None to date have been noted to have any other problems than that though. Some places flex too like you said but none have ever broken. A couple of Mc's had some tabbing issues I believe.

Kinda like a Port-a-bote for a dingy. Those that use them got used to the bending and flexing and funky "billowing" of the floor. Many feel real fear like they are taking their life in their hands being in one. But from what I read (from people that actually use them) they are very, very tough, easy to push (motor or oars), track well, carry a large load and are stable. What is not to like? Oh, that pesky flexing that makes you feel unsafe. Oh well.

The Gem is admittedly a "price point" boat. At it's price it does a lot. And it seems to have some of the same type (different specifics but the same type) of problems as many other builders.

Sounds like I am selling a gem. No. Sold it in March. Not for what is being said (bad) about it here though.

Next boat. If low (relative of course ) cost I will be looking closely at Main Cat and Seawind 1000 too, but they do cost a lot more than a Gem.

[Mr B]

The diesel can be very quiet if insulated, Mine is,

I was in Fiji, +30 C. I just put a tarp over the salon, Kept the whole boat cool,

With wind generator and my solar, I am totally self sufficient for power,

I slept in the salon while travelling, as I didnt want to be far away from the helm,
I also spent a lot of time sleeping on the hammock on the back in all kinds of weather, Day and night, With my harness on, But it is a very smooth place to sleep, It doesnt leap around at all,

The only thing I need a Marina for is diesel, and stocking up with food, I have a water maker, so always have plenty of water,

The shower is run off the diesel, it stays hot for a day and a half, Takes 10 minutes to heat up properly, which also charges the batterys at the same time,

I ran the drive leg aground a few times and it hasnt effected it, The props stuffed tho, It doesnt like driving in sand and rocks, Night time and cant see where I am going,

I didnt have any problems seeing ahead, But I have a Genoa not a screecher, It must be a bit higher at the bottom,

I had no problems sailing the boat, a few minor problems, But it is a 10 year old boat, so to be expected.

I was at sea for 18 days straight, single handed. Fiji to Oz, So I have a bit of an idea how it handles Blue water,

I did come across one very shonky practice in the hulls,

Instead of a single full lenght peice of timber for the hull stiffener, It had 3 peices in it to make the full distance wrapped in a fibreglass box, and made out of soft pine,

I know this, because I have the floor and hulls cut completely out of my boat to repair it to full Australian survey, And I am not impressed with it,

When fully repaired in a month or two, My next trip will be up the Tasman Sea and across the north of Oz to the Kimberlys, Proberbly, single handed again, as my lady friend hates the boat, permanent sea sickness,

Cheers,
Brian,