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Old 07-11-2015, 17:53   #16
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

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Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post
Why? Australian tax dollars should be used to support Australian jobs. It's that simple. It's a different thing if we don't have the ability such as with our replacement air force jets, but marine vessels, we are quite capable of making.
I agree, as long as we can do it competitively. At what point does spending more than the cost of obtaining the vessels elsewhere become profligate instead of socially responsible? 1.5 x? 2 x? I'm not sure there's enough clarity for the public to really be in the best position to make that call with regards these submarines. I'd like to know the options and costs of those.
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Old 07-11-2015, 18:09   #17
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

We did an excellent job building the collins class subs
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Old 07-11-2015, 18:58   #18
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

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Ummm, guys.... As I look out my companionway, I keep seeing these flyine US military.g overhead, from Coast Guard San Diego. Three guesses where they come from. Zee fransch! Oh yeah, and the Chinese. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurocopter_AS365_Dauphin
"The Dolphin was manufactured by Aerospatiale Helicopter Corporation (later American Eurocopter; now Airbus Helicopters, Inc.) in Grand Prairie, Texas. Textron Lycoming (now Honeywell) built the Dolphin's LTS101-750B-2 turboshaft engines in Williamsport, Pennsylvania, and Rockwell Collins manufactured the HH-65's electronic systems in Cedar Rapids, Iowa.[1]"

As required by the DOD. In case you've forgotten, the USCG is a branch of the US military.
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Old 07-11-2015, 21:45   #19
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

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We did an excellent job building the collins class subs
We did Factor yes. The Collins for a diesel electric and Australia's first submarines were an exceptionally good job and no more than $40 million over budget.

Yes, there were some problems. But nothing significant that was not able to be rectified. The main problem with the Collins was the immature contract requirements such as 'it has to be twice as quite as the Oberon class'. And a lot of the armourants were outdated by the time they splashed.

The main problem that led to people thinking we built a poor class submarine was the typical Australian tall poppy syndrome. We like to knock. Well, when you do that on something as a major build like six submarines your going to damage the reputation of the builders. And in the case of the Collins Submarine they were exceptionally well built, close to budget and we should be proud of them. Not knocking them.
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Old 08-11-2015, 03:52   #20
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

Perhaps a read of the "Coles Report" is in order

An independent review which found the Collins Fleet to be amongst the worlds worst
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FROM MR COLES My November 2012 Report made a number of recommendations to transform the availability of the Collins Class submarines from one that was seriously underperforming to one that could achieve a level of availability that matched the International Benchmark.
and summaries from its initial release
Quote:
Australia's fleet of trouble-plagued Collins Class submarine is available for operations for barely half the time of comparable countries' navies, a long-awaited independent report has found.
And the navy has since done a sterling job of getting the lemons right according to a review by Coles last year
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Old 08-11-2015, 06:37   #21
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

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Perhaps a read of the "Coles Report" is in order

An independent review which found the Collins Fleet to be amongst the worlds worst

and summaries from its initial release

And the navy has since done a sterling job of getting the lemons right according to a review by Coles last year
I've just spent the good part of an hour and a half reading through his report. I won't pretend to understand most of the report, from the quick reading I had. But I could find no such statement in the report that he found them to be amongst the worlds worst. I'm not sure where your pasted reports are from either. Are they quotes of news reports?

He does quite strongly criticize the poor management centered around them and lack of ability by those tasked to bring them up to speed and have more than two at any time available.

Coles also found that they were quite acceptably well designed.

Like I said before, it's a shame that the Aussie custom of tall poppy criticism and of knocking anything Australian has damaged Australia's reputation. In any case, if you now claim they have done such a sterling job in bringing them up to speed, then why are you still criticizing them?
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Old 08-11-2015, 07:46   #22
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

ever heard of Austal, in Mobile, Alabama? They built a trimaran:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Independence_(LCS-2)





**btw, the best engineers in the world are from the Netherlands, followed by South Africa, and then I'd say, probably Oz. And I'm a US engineer, and hate to admit that
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Old 08-11-2015, 08:06   #23
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

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Now your just being pedantic. I didn't suggest every single thing has to be Australian. Far from it.

Australia is quickly following the United States. A country that once built the best car's in the world now hardly build any and entire cities have shut down with hundreds of thousands of it's citizens out of work and loosing their houses. Australia used to build all three major car brands including it's own. What car do we build now? None! And many thousands put out of work.

If we can build a quality product, and marine vessels we have repeatedly proven we can, then the Australian tax dollar should be spent at home, and the same for the U.S.A. Obviously, any components that don't meet the quality required or the quantity, are purchased from overseas.
It's off topic, and too many quotes even here to include... But it seriously chaps my hide when a country simply sources something of HUGE capital investment + jobs and all the trickle down... When they could keep the manufacture "in country"... REGARDLESS of which country we're talking about.... And goes without saying... If they have the capability of course...
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Old 08-11-2015, 13:42   #24
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

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ever heard of Austal, in Mobile, Alabama? They built a trimaran:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Independence_(LCS-2)



**btw, the best engineers in the world are from the Netherlands, followed by South Africa, and then I'd say, probably Oz. And I'm a US engineer, and hate to admit that
Austal is Australian as far as I know
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Old 08-11-2015, 13:50   #25
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

This is a cat we built and when I mean 'we', I mean my very own little state of Tasmania.

This one was self loading, so didn't need dock facilities. It was said, given her speed she could deliver more payloads than a Herculees aircraft.

So, successful was this vessel that the good old USA ordered three for their navy which are still in use today. Meantime, despite our Navy wanting more, our good old Liberal Coalition government scapped the program.
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Old 24-12-2015, 08:10   #26
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Re: Future Coast Guard candidate?

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Originally Posted by AD28 View Post
ever heard of Austal, in Mobile, Alabama? They built a trimaran:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Independence_(LCS-2)



I was going to mention this tri-hull warship as well. For it to go into our Navy there had to be a co-op program created with Austal to actually build them here in this country.

Under the old 'Jones Act' that Ocean Eagle trimaran would also have to have its keel laid in USA.

I personally believe this warship platform would be much better as a Coast Guard vessel, particularly considering her helo deck size and capability.
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