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Old 18-05-2013, 23:46   #31
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

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Originally Posted by Palarran View Post
Holy Cat's, what a frendly attitude you have with people trying to help you. I'd normally suggest a St. Francis 50 but am a little nervous about what your reaction will be.

Also, do you care to share any details on this cat that you where on that flipped. If it's very similar to a Privilege you would be the only person I've ever seen here on the CF who has been on a cruising cat that flipped. Was anyone injured? Where did it happen? Was the boat salvageable?
And who here that has had helpful advice that I havn't been friendly towards? Every person on this thread that has given me directions to a cat I hadn't already looked into has had nothing but thanks from me for addressing at least one of the questions posed. Those that have posted have been treated the same way they have treated me. So suggesting a boat shouldn't make you nervous.
In regards to the cat flipping. Me, Mom, Dad, Sister, Dad's two buddies went sailing. All I knew at the time was that two people were offering, they knew my folks, I was assured that the two men has been accomplished sailors and that it would be an exiting adventure. Side note: my dad was overprotective and wouldn't just go sailing with two nimrods, he had sailed with them before, so I had faith in his decision despite not being that great of a swimmer. So we went sailing. It was fun for a while but I got tired of my dad yelling at me, he was afraid that my monkeying around would wind up with me slipping overboard or something like that, so me and my sister went below deck into one of the rooms and started playing uno. Next thing I know the cat is heeling/pitching and Im freaking out. From what I remember of the experience, my sister was pulling me above deck. Which way we jumped off the boat I cant remember. The main memory I have is all of us are in the water (with life jackets on) and Im freaking out cause Im in the water and I cant swim.
We set sail from Savannah, if you ask me if we were going north, south, or whatever I couldn't tell you. I was just a joyrider at that point not knowing much about boats and sailing but was open to the experience. No one was inured. Least not that I noticed. Was the ship salvaged, hell if I know. At the time and those following I didn't give a rat's arse about the boat I was just happy to be alive. Whenever I would ask my folks what happened later on their responses were less than helpful. Their dead and I never had much contact with the two strangers to begin with so finding them years after the incident would require far more effort than its worth.
What Ive learned in life is, if you have questions, ask them. If you have concerns, share them with others who may have advice on the matter. Which brings me back to my original post. I had concerns about different boats, so what did I do? I asked questions on a forum full of boaters/cruisers/live aboard about their experiences with the boats Ive looked into. One persons story shouldn't be a deciding feature but having multiple people give similar testimonies are more than welcomed. Having responses from sources other than the builders or in some glossy review is a good thing. I am NOT a boat engineer. I have done a lot of research on boat building (call it therapy) of past and present, and am still learning. No matter how many years of experience you have you are always still learning. And from what Ive learned, Ive got questions, so I'm asking. Btw
"If it's very similar to a Privilege you would be the only person I've ever seen here on the CF who has been on a cruising cat that flipped" That statement does not compute. Its as if you started one thought and ended up somewhere else. If you had said "if its similar to priv you would be the first person here on cf who has been on a priv like vessel that flipped" the statement would make sense to me. Im not sure if Im understanding properly. Care to clarify? Preferably via pms. One thing about forums is that the posts should deviate too far from the original topic. So if you have any other questions, shoot a message or something to that effect.
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Old 18-05-2013, 23:58   #32
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

Hey R.M.

Checkout the Voyage 520 owners version. They customized the port side hull interior for us, the boat is fast and very comfortable. This model has been refined over the last 15 + years from the 470 Mayotte. They have improved the build process and learned what systems work right, then improved the ones that do not as they manage
the boats. This knowledge goes right back to the factory to improve the next build.

We had 600 watts of the thin panels on board installed(Aurinco). The panels have been great, I have seen 33+ amps charging. I wish we would have put 1000 watts. There is room and they will do it. our boat http://www.aurinco.com/Gallery_pic_w...K-Voyager.html
Until these panels Voyage didn't like installing solar because they didn't look good, the frames caught sail sheets and toes. I specified these thin panels, these are what my CEO liked. We can leave the boat unattended and not worry about emptying the fridge/ freezer, plus the batteries love having amps going in daily.

Good luck on your search.
Seaking
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Old 19-05-2013, 00:23   #33
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

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Hey R.M.

Checkout the Voyage 520 owners version. They customized the port side hull interior for us, the boat is fast and very comfortable. This model has been refined over the last 15 + years from the 470 Mayotte. They have improved the build process and learned what systems work right, then improved the ones that do not as they manage
the boats. This knowledge goes right back to the factory to improve the next build.

We had 600 watts of the thin panels on board installed(Aurinco). The panels have been great, I have seen 33+ amps charging. I wish we would have put 1000 watts. There is room and they will do it. our boat Gallery pictures
Until these panels Voyage didn't like installing solar because they didn't look good, the frames caught sail sheets and toes. I specified these thin panels, these are what my CEO liked. We can leave the boat unattended and not worry about emptying the fridge/ freezer, plus the batteries love having amps going in daily.

Good luck on your search.
Seaking
Muchas gracias. Esp about the solar panels. Im trying to learn as much about energy consumption, diesel engines, and mechanical aspects of boats so input on that aspect is tre good.
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Old 19-05-2013, 01:55   #34
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

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Originally Posted by Palarran View Post
........Also, do you care to share any details on this cat that you where on that flipped. If it's very similar to a Privilege you would be the only person I've ever seen here on the CF who has been on a cruising cat that flipped. ...............?
There is a Privilege 39 that has flipped. Actualy that term is probably incorrect. The boat became airborne whilst at anchor and inverted.

Mind you the recorded wind gust was in the order of 150 mph at the time. (Hurricane)

The boat was written off and the owners bought another Privilege 39!
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Old 19-05-2013, 02:04   #35
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

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There is a Privilege 39 that has flipped. Actualy that term is probably incorrect. The boat became airborne whilst at anchor and inverted.

Mind you the recorded wind gust was in the order of 150 mph at the time. (Hurricane)

The boat was written off and the owners bought another Privilege 39!
Wow. good to know it took a hurricane to flip/invert the priv. The more I find out about cats, the more I cant help but wonder which cat I was on that...malfunctioned. I keep hearing how stable and unsinkable cats are in comparison to monos, so I cant help but wonder what happened. Thanks for your input though. Im going to bed x__x.
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Old 19-05-2013, 02:19   #36
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

Privileges are heavy. Flipping is not an issue. But gee whiz. Gunboats are light so you got to be on your toes. So what do you want?
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Old 19-05-2013, 03:39   #37
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

You're probably already doing this, but I'd highly recommend hiring some expertise to help you with this decision/process. Despite the horror stories about some brokers, there are some good people in the industry who have a very broad view of the market based on selling hundreds of boats and can help you with the buy used versus buy new versus build options.

The place I personally would start with is the Multi-hull company, but I am sure there are other places as well. I don't know Phil Berman who runs it, but one of their brokers - Derek Escher - helped us buy our boat and we were very happy with his advice and support.

Mark.
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Old 19-05-2013, 05:26   #38
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

I have read that it was 170 mph wind that took Privilege airborne I really don't think that parallels between a seemingly "similar" design of that old boat years ago, and modern heavy well-built cats, are worth keeping in mind. They are nothing but subjective fears, and as such, don't have much to do with reality, yet they limit one's ability to make a good choice. If I didn't get rid of my subjective fears I would be buying a 35' mono

I am very much for comfort and all possible goodies I can get. I definitely will be installing good a/c (currently settled on MAR-IX Clima inverter units), plus loads of solar (aurincos), windgens, and seriously big li-fe bank. I really do not see any reason why I have to be uncomfortable in hot weather while being off-grid (I lived in Baja for 3 years and I know how hot it can get). In fact, I am hoping to install advanced heat recovery modules to provide fresh air (automatically with CO2 sensors) in addition to A/C, to keep air inside fresh and cool. I am well aware that many people will say all this is an excess and sailing is not about this, but I did my share of sailing with nothing but a kerosine lamp Besides, I want my Admiral to be happy. Happy admiral = many years of happy cruising, and that's what it is all about, for me. Definitely, not about overcoming difficulties and showing a human spirit strength - I had more than enough of it.
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Old 19-05-2013, 05:57   #39
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

guy i know designed an awesome cat--is fast, comfy, and his home..... he didnt like what he found in market so he went out and did it---is awesome.


never sailed a cat but i has a cat sailor....or is it a sailorcat....is biiig and beautiful and sails well....
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Old 19-05-2013, 06:45   #40
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

R. Manning, Mark's suggestion of getting an expert opinion is a good one, but I'd stay away from brokers. Look up Mahina Expeditions Mahina Expeditions conducts sailing and navigation training and expeditions in the South Pacific and offers offshore sailing seminars. They not only offer fantastic offshore sailing courses, but they also have a boat purchase consultation service. You will often see articles from John and Amanda Neil in the various sailing publications. I can already tell you that from the list you've made they are big fans of the Antares.
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Old 19-05-2013, 08:50   #41
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

John and Amanda have lots of monohull experience and expertize. Not sure how much time they have spent around or on cats. Another source of expertize is Bill Biewenga.
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Old 19-05-2013, 09:14   #42
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I believe John and Amanda spent considerable amount of time on my Antares at the Oakland boat show a couple of years ago and according to Rob and Jeff who own Antares they were extremely impressed with the build quality and functionality.
Having owned "Indigo" for 4 years I can attest to the superb customer service that Antares provide.
Paul

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Old 19-05-2013, 09:36   #43
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

Here's one I've not seen mentioned-Discovery 50. Made in England, very high quality. I imagine they would describe as a high quality blue water cruising catamaran. Very spacious 'between the hulls' owners suite in the owner version. But you need to be tall, I'm not! To see out of the front windows you need to be 6ft or more. Such as shame.

Just in case you didn't know, both Privilege and Outremer are bringing out new 45ft designs next year. Maybe both will be at the Cannes show. Obviously both are quite different characters but are certainly at the top of my personal short list. The new MD of Privilege was very proud of the drawings he showed us at the Montpellier show recently, the style is a lot like their new 53!
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Old 19-05-2013, 10:37   #44
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Catalysis View Post
I believe John and Amanda spent considerable amount of time on my Antares at the Oakland boat show a couple of years ago and according to Rob and Jeff who own Antares they were extremely impressed with the build quality and functionality.
Having owned "Indigo" for 4 years I can attest to the superb customer service that Antares provide.
Paul
I understand the concern about brokers, and have lots of respect for John and Amanda based on their writings and reputation, but based on their public profile I would not recommend them for giving advice on your questions with choosing a catamaran (totally different if you were looking for a cruising mono-hull).

You want someone who has experience with hundreds of multi-hulls and the market. The people with that experience tend to be brokers. I would not go for just any broker - I would interview them very carefully. I recommended the Multi-hull company because at least one of their brokers (Derek Escher) did a very good job 6 years ago of helping us sort out the market, then targeting a set of boats, and working with us till we found one that matched. I also know that they offer consulting services on a time and materials basis to help with searches like yours - which is very different to the classic broker arrangement where they only get paid if you buy something through/with them.

Sorry, I don't want to sound like an ad for a particular company. I have no relation to them and would happily point to other companies if I knew any examples. (Derek Escher didn't work for them when he helped us - he was an independent broker at the time).

Mark.
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Old 19-05-2013, 10:48   #45
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Re: Finding the right cat for me.

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Originally Posted by Catalysis View Post
I believe John and Amanda spent considerable amount of time on my Antares at the Oakland boat show a couple of years ago and according to Rob and Jeff who own Antares they were extremely impressed with the build quality and functionality.
Having owned "Indigo" for 4 years I can attest to the superb customer service that Antares provide.
Paul

Attachment 60976
Hi Paul, I was aboard your boat in Oakland last year and attended a seminar at which John Neil had nothing but praise for your boat. I did too good a job selling my wife on the Taswell we currently own, but after buddy sailing with an Antares I am now hooked.
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