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Old 13-12-2015, 16:00   #331
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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And how big was the wave?

I took a stroll on the moon last night just holding my breath.

Dave
not as big as you might think more of a chop really, 3 feet max .Because we have boards and I am really used to the Lake Ontario chop we really can get a great surf going . most of that trip was done at about 12-13 knots .
Obviously the pic is from a different day
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Old 13-12-2015, 16:32   #332
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

OK, I'll say that 18.3 at about 120 apparent in 15-20 knots of true wind is impossible. Better check yer instruments. 12 to 13 is very hard to believe on that deep an angle. This means your AWS would be down around 6-8 even at 20 TWS. Perhaps you were remembering your ice boat?

Further, boards are not useful surfing, and are rather detrimental. Ever see a surfboard with one?

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Old 13-12-2015, 16:49   #333
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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OK, I'll say that 18.3 at about 120 apparent in 15-20 knots of true wind is impossible. Better check yer instruments. 12 to 13 is very hard to believe on that deep an angle. This means your AWS would be down around 6-8 even at 20 TWS. Perhaps you were remembering your ice boat?

Further, boards are not useful surfing, and are rather detrimental. Ever see a surfboard with one?

Dave
Dont know much about surfing but I know that I can get my boat on the wave a little easier when I have foot or so of 1 board in the water . My wind estimate was just a guess at the normal cold front predictions may be it was more . I know we ended up with apparent wind at 90 after we started at about 120 then the head came off the top of the sail about 10 minutes later. speed on gps. this was 8 years ago
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Old 13-12-2015, 17:13   #334
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

Going downwind with main and jib, we keep the apparent wind at 90*. Off the top of my head, the true wind is about 140*, and the apparent wind speed a little less than the true wind. Any deeper than that and we start losing apparent wind fast.
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Old 13-12-2015, 18:12   #335
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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OK, I'll say that 18.3 at about 120 apparent in 15-20 knots of true wind is impossible. Better check yer instruments. 12 to 13 is very hard to believe on that deep an angle. This means your AWS would be down around 6-8 even at 20 TWS. Perhaps you were remembering your ice boat?

Further, boards are not useful surfing, and are rather detrimental. Ever see a surfboard with one?

Dave
Surfboards have fins. They provide grip to the water in the way a board would so the surfer can control the surfboard. There are single fins, two fins, thrusters (three) and so on .. depending on your break and style/preferences.
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Old 13-12-2015, 19:01   #336
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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Surfboards have fins. They provide grip to the water in the way a board would so the surfer can control the surfboard. There are single fins, two fins, thrusters (three) and so on .. depending on your break and style/preferences.

That's true, however they're usually down the back of the board somewhere, around about the rudder on a a cats location..
A fin mid board would be kinda hard to surf I'd imagine
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Old 13-12-2015, 19:25   #337
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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That's true, however they're usually down the back of the board somewhere, around about the rudder on a a cats location..
A fin mid board would be kinda hard to surf I'd imagine
It would, I can't imagine trying to snap the surfboard around with a fin in the middle. I wonder if the big wave surfers might find a high aspect ratio, small centre fin more stable. Hmm. ..

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Old 13-12-2015, 22:31   #338
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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It would, I can't imagine trying to snap the surfboard around with a fin in the middle. I wonder if the big wave surfers might find a high aspect ratio, small centre fin more stable. Hmm. ..

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Surfboard fins, rocker and rails combined = cat rudders

whacking a center board fin on them would counteract the second two and make the board a straight down the face suicide machine in big waves i reckon!

Im gonna add my incredulity to the PDQ doing 18 knots in 15 to 20 true aft of the beam too. Against the laws of physics mate!
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Old 13-12-2015, 22:36   #339
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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SNIP

Im gonna add my incredulity to the PDQ doing 18 knots in 15 to 20 true aft of the beam too. Against the laws of physics mate!
Not if there is a swift current.
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Old 13-12-2015, 22:43   #340
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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Not if there is a swift current.
He was on a lake though...
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Old 14-12-2015, 07:55   #341
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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Surfboard fins, rocker and rails combined = cat rudders

whacking a center board fin on them would counteract the second two and make the board a straight down the face suicide machine in big waves i reckon!

Im gonna add my incredulity to the PDQ doing 18 knots in 15 to 20 true aft of the beam too. Against the laws of physics mate!
Ok lets try again ,8 years ago while crossing lake Ontario on my PDQ 36 in a 3 foot following sea . with full main and screecher in I don't know how much wind or where it was coming from i popped the boat onto a surf and the speed on the GPS was18.3. and I will admit that it got my attention as the best we had done before was about 12
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Old 14-12-2015, 08:48   #342
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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i popped the boat onto a surf and the speed on the GPS was18.3. and I will admit that it got my attention as the best we had done before was about 12
Yes, that's believable and not uncommon. More common on longer hulls. It's a hoot in large ocean swell when sometimes you can sustain the surf for a bit. Then slow right back down to around 5 or 6 before the next one.... This is where having the boards up helps as the boat is not locked onto rails and can squirm a bit to keep heading downhill.

Dave
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Old 14-12-2015, 13:03   #343
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

The trip for the Outremer was the Salty Dawg Rally. The weather router is Chris Parker who I have used and liked in the past. He understands sailing and routes for your boats performance.

I would expect a non performance cat to be in the 140-160nm avg range. On our Conser 47 every trip from Hampton VA to the BVI averaged between 190-200nm per day with full winter cruising gear 3-4 crew all conditions. We had a 50nm made good day beating into the wind and steep waves averaged in once. Nasty conditions where you just have to slow down.

Our best 24 HR day was 350nm heading up the east coast US under main and small spinnaker with the current. Wind and waves were perfect. If only they could all be like that.

There are several new cats made today that will perform at this level or better with far greater space. They can be very costly and usually are.


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Old 14-12-2015, 13:19   #344
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

On that best day we never came off plane the entire time slowly climbing the next wave and accelerating down.

We once we out heading south from Ny to Key Largo 250nm off shore in 25-30' waves when I was younger and not as wise. It was a crazy rush but I am much smarter now and would slow down. The boat would jump off the top of the waves and literally skip down the wave face going back to a full plane between the waves as the waves blanked the sails and then accelerate up the back sides. Wind was blowing at around 35-40 knots for days on end. The hulls tracked amazingly though always in control. Speed peaked at 22-28 on each trip down. I did have the boats designer John Conser on board with us. Crew of 6.




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Old 14-12-2015, 14:10   #345
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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On our Conser 47 every trip from Hampton VA to the BVI averaged between 190-200nm per day with full winter cruising gear 3-4 crew all conditions.
You must motor pretty fast? "All conditions" would include the common high pressure ridges above about 25* N? We've never made that passage without at least a couple days of motoring. As a result our fastest passage (return trip) averaged 7.5 kts, 180 nm/day. Most average 6 to 7 kts.

All cruising cats of about 40 feet or higher can average 200 nm days - with the right weather. It's more about the weather than the boat. Once you get N or S of the trades honest 200nm days are the exception, unless you can and choose to motor at 8.3+ kts.

Dave
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