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Old 08-06-2011, 02:41   #241
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

BTW, 7609 was beaten by two fully crewed boats - he was essentially sailing single handed, his crew was his girlfriend and her daughter, neither of whom could sail.

He also beat every monohull, by between 5 and 25 hours......
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Old 08-06-2011, 03:31   #242
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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Originally Posted by catty View Post

Out of interest, I had a conversation the other day with another sailing cat owner after a lovely 60 mile spinnaker run. The owner who is best left unnamed commented that" it was a lovely sail as he only had to run one motor."

.
I'm sorry I simply dont believe that comment - if it was a spinnaker run then running one motor would be pointless as the apparent would not be sufficient to have the spinakker draw.

Your comment simply makes no sense

what boat where you on?
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Old 08-06-2011, 08:02   #243
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

12 knots in a Gemini while surfing is notable. He-be-jammin for sure. But averaging 10 knots over 1000 miles is astounding for a cruising boat. I remain impressed.

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Old 08-06-2011, 10:28   #244
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

I should have added that we do have the 420 Sq ft screecher sail out full with a full main sail wing and wing in 25 kt's of breeze on the Columbia River with only 4 to5 ft wind waves no big swells to climb. The sail maker suggest 25kt's of breeze is the max he would fly the screecher sail. With one of our 5 ft center boards down going up wind we can hit 12.5 kt's steady in a 27 kt breeze holding tight to the wind with full main and a reefed 150 gen rolled up to 120. I'm told not to use the full center boards on the ocean so we don't trip over big swells. We looked at the Seawind 1100XL but it was not setup for PNW winters as good as the Gemini 105Mc.
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Old 08-06-2011, 11:57   #245
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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I should have added that we do have the 420 Sq ft screecher sail out full with a full main sail wing and wing in 25 kt's of breeze on the Columbia River with only 4 to5 ft wind waves no big swells to climb. The sail maker suggest 25kt's of breeze is the max he would fly the screecher sail. With one of our 5 ft center boards down going up wind we can hit 12.5 kt's steady in a 27 kt breeze holding tight to the wind with full main and a reefed 150 gen rolled up to 120. I'm told not to use the full center boards on the ocean so we don't trip over big swells. We looked at the Seawind 1100XL but it was not setup for PNW winters as good as the Gemini 105Mc.

...........
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Old 08-06-2011, 13:39   #246
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

Jammin, I can accept 14 knots if you were flying a full main and a 420 foot screecher in 25 knot winds (with gusts to?) with 4-5 foot waves for an added push. Two thoughts come to mind, however: for 6 hours in those condition, I would have thought she would have been faster, not to mention safer and easier to sail on a broad reach, rather than wing on wing; and I wouldn't have had that much sail up in those conditions on a Gemini, regardless of what the sailmaker said the screecher could handle. Lets just say that you have much bigger......somethings, than I do!

Brad
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Old 08-06-2011, 17:04   #247
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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12 knots in a Gemini while surfing is notable. He-be-jammin for sure. But averaging 10 knots over 1000 miles is astounding for a cruising boat. I remain impressed.

Mike
Actually they averaged 9.5 knots for the 1010 miles, the 10 knots was over 24 hours.
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Old 08-06-2011, 17:53   #248
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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Actually they averaged 9.5 knots for the 1010 miles, the 10 knots was over 24 hours.
It is still a big fat.
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Old 08-06-2011, 20:05   #249
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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I should have added that we do have the 420 Sq ft screecher sail out full with a full main sail wing and wing in 25 kt's of breeze on the Columbia River with only 4 to5 ft wind waves no big swells to climb. The sail maker suggest 25kt's of breeze is the max he would fly the screecher sail. With one of our 5 ft center boards down going up wind we can hit 12.5 kt's steady in a 27 kt breeze holding tight to the wind with full main and a reefed 150 gen rolled up to 120. I'm told not to use the full center boards on the ocean so we don't trip over big swells. We looked at the Seawind 1100XL but it was not setup for PNW winters as good as the Gemini 105Mc.
Not to be a doubter, but have you verified any of this with a GPS? Were you going upstream or downstream at the time?

Your speed log could be significantly "optimistic" - I've never heard of anyone else getting even close to this kind of speed upwind. I know 18 knots is the downwind record, with 14 knots having been hit by several owners.

The best we've done is 11 knots in 45 knots of true wind between 130 and 150 degrees with just the genoa, I know I could have gone faster but didn't have a diaper change handy!

Cheers
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Old 18-07-2011, 22:27   #250
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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Bob Oram Design

Some performance figures …


“Out of the Bag’” (a 44C) has just done Chagos Archipelago to Rodrigues, Mauritius – 1010 miles – in 4 days and 10 hours. The best daily was 240 miles in 24 hours, giving an average of 10 knots. Experienced sailors will know that to average 10 knots, the boat has to be sailing at 12+ knots a lot of the time. This is with Bill and Gene aboard and in full cruising mode, 25 knots of wind , 2 reefs and little jib.
Other figures received recently were from Kees on “Tribute”, a much smaller Mango 38′. He achieved 215 miles in 24 hours on passage to Indonesia from Australia, which is an average of 8.9 knots. I’m not sure if Kees was single handling or not. Again this was with full cruising gear, 20+ knots of wind, miserable sea state and conservative sailing.



Some performance figures … Bob Oram Design

As you appear to have a keen interest in Oram catamaran performance, here is some more owner supplied data. Oram 42 Starfire.
Crossing from seisia to gove , 330 nm, 61 hours, reaching conditions, 5.5 knots av approx.

Hope this is of interest
Regards.
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Old 19-07-2011, 00:52   #251
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

Given that you don't provide any real information about the conditions, no, it's not of much interest really. For instance, if there was only 5-10 knots of wind from almost astern, then a 5.5 knot average would be good.

I crossed from Seisia to Gove at an average of just under 8 knots in an Oram 39c, in east-south easterlies (deep reaching, wind too far astern to be ideal) 10-15 knots.

BTW "Starfire" is a long superceded design.

How about your boat? (Assuming you have one) How does it perform? Any figures?
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Old 19-07-2011, 01:14   #252
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

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Given that you don't provide any real information about the conditions, no, it's not of much interest really. For instance, if there was only 5-10 knots of wind from almost astern, then a 5.5 knot average would be good.

I crossed from Seisia to Gove at an average of just under 8 knots in an Oram 39c, in east-south easterlies (deep reaching, wind too far astern to be ideal) 10-15 knots.

BTW "Starfire" is a long superceded design.

How about your boat? (Assuming you have one) How does it perform? Any figures?
Sorry 44c, I thought you would have realized that the SE trades are pretty consistent at this time of year. The crossing was in June so here is the records for Gove AP.Nhulunbuy [Gove], NT - June 2011 - Daily Weather Observations . Not sure of the exact dates but the mean is SE around 20 km/h. As you know the wind is always lighter at the airports in this region.
Here are the readings from Horn Island. Possibly a little more representative.http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/dwo/20...9.201106.shtml

Hope this helps.
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Old 19-07-2011, 03:01   #253
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

I worked on TI and Bamaga on a number of occasions for lengthy periods of time. Absolutely no way that Horn is representative of the Wind at Seisia. No way is Horn indicative of the wind at Seisia let alone Gove. No way. I have landed on Horn on probably or more 20 occasions and then gone over to TI. I have been in Bamaga and taken boats from Seisia to TI.

On a few occasions I did stay on Horn itself for the duration of my visit.

I mean its really funny that anyone would think that an island at the tip of the cape with no land mass between it and forever, would be representative of the wind on the western side of the cape when the wind is coming from the East South east and flowing over large land masses.

BTW do you sail in Km/h? Thats unusual - sounds like something a motor boat person or a car driver would use. In any event a mean of 20 km/h translates to under 11 knots - so their time in that case was okay. As usual I dont get want you are trying to achieve. Are you saying that was a slow trip, and extrapolating that to say all orams are slow?? I really dont understand your point. Further - could you provide the source for your Starfire figures please.

Below is a image of the Marine wind prediction from BOM on or about last friday for the gulf. Friends on mine did the Seisia to Gove run late last week and reported that the BOM Marine Wind predictions were reasonably accurate.
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Old 19-07-2011, 04:09   #254
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

I could also quote Lucas

During winter the Se trade persists similar in principal to the Coral Coast but with differences created by the the land mass of Cape York...... A moderate trade wind commonly warps into an easterly ...

But what would he know.
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Old 19-07-2011, 15:37   #255
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Re: Fast Cruising Catamarans - How Fast ?

Yeah, I thought a 5.5 knot average in wind around 10 1/2 knots well aft of the beam wasn't exactly terrible. Dave would have to be nearing 70 by now, and usually sails single handed too.....

But really Catty why are YOU so interested in Bob Oram's boats? I built one, live on it and cruise it, so of course I'm interested, but why your apparent obsession?

What about your own boat? (Assuming it exists.) How about instead of living vicariously and passing on details of other boats performances, you might fill us in on how well your boat sails on passages? Surely you've done some by now? So how did it go?
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