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Old 24-02-2012, 16:54   #121
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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Originally Posted by s/v Jedi View Post
What I find remarkable:
The main difference and the reason that cats are becoming so popular, is that cat are thought to be easier to sail. When somebody states: I might buy a sailboat but it must be easy and luxurious, most will answer to buy a cat.

cheers,
Nick.

NOPE the real answer is Availability more cats being built mostly for the charter market and then after five years they find their way onto the used boat market and of course some are built for private owners.
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Old 24-02-2012, 16:55   #122
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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Originally Posted by Lagoon4us View Post
Dan what is your boat now? A Maxi???? Cheers Frank
I'm curious too, as the only Maxi 77 I know of is a Pelle Petterson AB Maxi 77.
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Old 24-02-2012, 17:04   #123
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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I'm curious too, as the only Maxi 77 I know of is a Pelle Petterson AB Maxi 77.
I was betting a large one off ex racer as in a Maxi..... we could'a started a new thread called "Guess Dan's boat"?????
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Old 24-02-2012, 17:06   #124
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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It's difficult. If I come up with Hunter vs Prout, all the multihullers will protest and they are quick to come up with Gunboats and Outremers which are really racers when you look at their interiors.

So, how about Bene First 47.7 vs a Lagoon 38? 38 * 1.5 = 57 (1.5 being the factor used by many marinas) so the cat has the advantage but the First might compensate by being more performance oriented?

Also, it is always about upwind sailing; the rest is all a matter of guts on how much sail area you dare to hoist.

All the boats I sailed before Jedi were in Holland / North Sea area and there are very few cats there, so I can't compare. And as you say, comparing with a Sundeer is not average. But neither is the Gunboat and Outremer IMO.

I read from other reactions that interior volume means something (pingpong balls) but that does'n't work either, just look at a Hunter vs Westsail for example: very different ratios yet both monohulls.

May be price of new boat equal for mono vs multi?

On this thread not being about multi vs mono: it is of course; popularity is about comparisons.

cheers,
Nick.

OK i will buy that comparison compare a Lagoon 380 vis a vis my Bennie O461 - a cheeper to buy and maintain boat i am significanly faster on all pints of sail as roomy with three big cabins and a fore cabin that is miles better than anything on a L380. As easy to sail and my bennie is self tending a Cat is not and needs to be sailed to the numbers - i cannot see me 'allowing' the admiral to take a ocean passage night watch on a L380 without having severely reduced sail - and i really like the L380 - Lagoon's most popular cat ever was 800 built the last time i looked
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Old 24-02-2012, 17:10   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deckofficer

I'm curious too, as the only Maxi 77 I know of is a Pelle Petterson AB Maxi 77.
Yes. The Maxi 77 is a Pelle Petterson design. It is 7.7 meters.

Here is a picture reefed and racing.

If you are trying to get my sailing resume, I have raced over a year on J24s (3rd place 2008 Singapore Nationals), a year on a Benneteau First 40.7 (main trim, foredeck), various 30-50 keelboats. Probably 30 regattas and hundreds of club races. A dozen or so charters. 30 or so international passages and deliveries. I started sailng as a kid aged 8 or so. I started sailing seriously about 7 years ago.
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Old 24-02-2012, 17:12   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lagoon4us
I was betting a large one off ex racer as in a Maxi..... we could'a started a new thread called "Guess Dan's boat"?????
That misconception comes up a lot. I wouldn't know what to do with the space on a 77 foot boat - LOL

No need to guess. I have photos all over the place...
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Old 24-02-2012, 17:32   #127
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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I started sailing seriously about 7 years ago.
And probably never looked back.

I didn't ask for a sailing resume, but always appreciate getting one as it helps me know my fellow CF members better. That is why I started a thread in "off topic" for folks to share age progression pictures.

My sailing experience (sailboats) is a fraction of most the others here at CF, and that is a reason I hang here. Started sailing a Flying Junior that I shared with my older brother and sister in 1962~1966. Then no sailing till mid 70's, on a Rhoades 19 sailing from Newport Beach to Catalina. Again, another dry spell till buying my first serious boat, a 20 year old Cal 40 that I sailed solo from Long Beach to Mulege in 151 hours. Another dry spell after selling the Cal in Mexico till being the only person my parent's friend could get to lake sail a Balboa 26, leaded swing keel. This was late 80's, so huge gaps in my resume. Then CMA, and turning a passion into a profession. Now, retired, taking care of my dad. Next time out, hope to be long term cruising in a PDQ 36, but since I take such good care of pop, I'm not expecting to get out till my late 60's~early 70's. Hope my health is still good enough to pull it off.
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Old 24-02-2012, 18:16   #128
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

EVOLUTION ?
Here in Australia around the 70's there was a huge amount of boats built in backyards and boat-parks, this i think followed the hippy, self sufficient cruising ideal.

Ferro-cement mainly Hartley's. GRP were predominately Roberts. Steel tended to be Pugh's, Adams and Robert's as well. There were magazines called 'Build-a-boat' where dreams evolved, every toilet library in a boat loving house had a copy.

Boats sprouted in back yards everywhere,however there were also factory built yachts. S&S, Robert's (yet again), Mottle, Swanson to name a few. HOWEVER there were not many multi's.

To most the multi's such as early Crowthers and Nichols were dangerous due mainly to the press received whenever a 'mishap' occurred read 'FLIPPED' or broken up. In those days the cruising boats were the same boats used for racing they were simply stripped out, ie lightweight and driven by Gung-Ho crews.

Wharram's were seen as stuff of dreams, when you looked at Wharrams drawings the deck scene always was depicted as similar to a native village scene? (What was that about?)

Then strip plank and foam construction became the vogue replacing the homebuilt steel and ferro, now anyone could build a lightweight strong boat at home over a simple MDF mould. Designers pushed the catamaran idea in a big way it made sense, from there designs such as Tennant, Crowther, Schionning, Seawind etc went into commercial production there were no more disasters in our coastal races due probably to the learning curve of those early gung-ho racers.

The early baby-boomers now looked at these multi's as a viable fast cruising alternative that so suit's our Aussie coastline.

In the early days it was so difficult to sell a multi, if you did it was at a loss. In 1984 i sold my stunning round bilge steel 'Joe Adams 35' for $48,000 and bought a 4 bedroom house with the money, at that time a 36 foot tri would have sold for $26,000, THAT was the difference.

Why are multi's becoming popular? In my opinion they have evolved.

This was my observations in my part of the world, i think the story may well be similar elsewhere. Cheers Frank
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Old 24-02-2012, 19:41   #129
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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Originally Posted by s/v Jedi View Post
It's difficult. If I come up with Hunter vs Prout, all the multihullers will protest and they are quick to come up with Gunboats and Outremers which are really racers when you look at their interiors.

So, how about Bene First 47.7 vs a Lagoon 38? 38 * 1.5 = 57 (1.5 being the factor used by many marinas) so the cat has the advantage but the First might compensate by being more performance oriented?

Nick.
Of course the First is more performance orientated. Lagoons are primarily built for charter use. A better comparison would be an Oceanic, or just a plain Beneteau (whatever they call them). OR Hunter vs Lagoon.

Also , the heel angles you mentioned earlier are wrong. We RARELY heel more than 5-6 degrees. And whe we are, the mono's around us are well past 20'.

The fact is, we DO sail to windward, and stuff stays where you leave it.

We just sailed from Sydney to broken bay in a N/NE 15-20 knots, and this laptop was left sitting open on the table. It never moved.
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Old 24-02-2012, 20:44   #130
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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The fact is, we DO sail to windward, and stuff stays where you leave it.

We just sailed from Sydney to broken bay in a N/NE 15-20 knots, and this laptop was left sitting open on the table. It never moved.
Thats funny, I just checked the BOM observations for North Head and you may find it was closer to 4-10 knots for the last couple of days.
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Old 24-02-2012, 20:45   #131
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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Thats funny, I just checked the BOM observations for North Head and you may find it was closer to 4-10 knots for the last couple of days.
Maybe talk to somebody who was on the water?

Edit: even the BOM shows 10-14 knots yesterday afternoon.

According to my instruments we had a maximum TWS of just under 18 knots.
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Old 24-02-2012, 20:49   #132
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

I was in the US Navy Submarine Service in Pearl Harbor, 1966.
One of my best Navy friends from Sherman Oaks California (and his civilian buddies) were building a 40+ foot trimaran in a parking lot at the time).

I've always wondered, What happened with that? I need to know "The Rest of the Story".
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Old 24-02-2012, 21:06   #133
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

Ahoy Lagoon4us,
Yeah, back in the day, it was renegade to go with the multihull. But all those beach cats left an impression on those who got to sail on them. Why not go with a multihull on a bigger boat?
I was chased into Charleston by another catamaran during a SE blow and we were both going like mad, but I was scared by them, hooting and hollering as we went up the channel. It was very blustery and alive.
I get along well with my keel boat friends, and while I may have some reservations about easing the sheets when the gust come in, they may have some reservations when the sheet winches are under water!
The simpe fact is that when I am going along business as usual, the keel boats are having an adventure.
I think you are right, the vacation cruisers who rent a catamaran for a week or two tend to compare that sailing experience with any other boat they sail on for a weekend. When they look for a boat for themselves, they remember and choose a multihull. I don't think the boats have evolved that much compared to the boat buyers. Some of the older designs are still viable, and some of the charter designs are not the best use of space for a liveaboard cruiser.
It's hard to grasp the essence of the Wharram lifestyle, kind of jungle, mountain boating.
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Old 24-02-2012, 21:34   #134
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

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I always feel a bit unwelcome jumping in on multi threads. It's like if ya don't own one ya can't have an opinion...

Anyway my goal is a 39-40 foot leopard or lagoon. If I have an interest in catamarans does that make me bi-curious?

I regards to popularity I think it is obvious. As a boomer getting older I see a cat as a much more comfortable and stable home. I don't want to live below decks out of the weather or on deck in the weather. Cat solves that. A cat is also a decent motor sailor with redundant twin screws and plenty of electric power and place to mount solar.

In regards to most cat buyers being ex-mono owners? Same drill. We get older we go for the comforts. Also until the last 15-20 years this market was a specialty and most folks owned monos. The boomers got older, the marketing folks figured out what the boomers wanted to spend their money on and now there are a ton of cats with what we want. It's the free market economy...

As far as racing? With the exception of purpose built multis and maybe the gunboats there are scads better fast monos than fast mulit's "for the same money!"

If that is taken as criticism of cats and gets me ostacized, sorry...
Your comments as an explanation for the increase in popularity of multihulls is on target . I hope your planning (bi-curious ) yields fruit.

There are a percentage of posters who push the speed side of cats but that is not the reason for the increased popularity. There are outliers in both cats and monos and duscussing the relative speeds does not answer the question of the thread.

Its more about comfortably sipping drinks with friends at a great anchorage out of the sun and rain. I think that is main reason Nick has a Sundeer.

Great for afternoon drinks.
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Old 24-02-2012, 21:46   #135
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Re: Explanation for the Increase in Multihull Popularity

Why do so many multi-hullers "beat their chests," appearing defensive? They don't seem to be happy unless everyone else becomes "multi-hulled" (or wished they were) so to assure themselves they made the right decision. Give us a break!

How was your last haulout?

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