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Old 22-01-2007, 06:37   #16
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An elegant solution! Wow!! I think I might try this. I have a sloop, so rigging up the hardware might be tricky. Any ideas on the best way to rig this up on a sloop? My single forestay has a harken roller furler on it. It's got two tracks, which means I could technically try this out by dropping the furled genoa, then manually raising both genoas at the same time. Sounds difficult!

Any other suggestions on the best way to rig this if you have only a single forestay that already has a furled genoa?
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Old 22-01-2007, 07:24   #17
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Downwind sails

Catamarans behave differently than monohull boats when sailing directly downwind. Monohulls tend to roll from side to side with a double headsail rig, and a good argument can be made for tacking downwind in such a way that one headsail is more dominant in order to dampen or stop any tendency to roll downwind. Perhaps the larger gennaker on one side and a smaller genoa or jib poled out on the other side would work better in a monohull.

In a catamaran, there is no problem with rolling and so you have more freedom in the way you set things up, and there is no need to tack downwind when you are doing no bruising cruising.

I always used identical genoas with the eighteen foot spinnaker poles. The pull is balanced and symmetrical so it makes the autopilot happy. One genoa is on the Profurl, and the second genoa is flying with a loose luff. I can carry both sails 95% of the time in the trade winds, and because of the spinnaker poles, the sails are very quiet. We monitor the status of the downwind rig by sound rather than by sight. As long as the sails are quiet, we know the wind is aft of the beam. When we hear a ruffle of one of the sails, we know the wind has moved forward of the beam and we go into the cockpit to see what adjustments need to be made. Sailing by sound rather than by sight makes offshore passages much more enjoyable because we aren't spending hours each day staring at our sails and tweaking them. We simply set the downwind rig up, and let our ears tell us when something needs to be done. Of course, we always check around the horizon every ten minutes.

The other advantage of this double headsail downwind rig is that it requires very little tweaking. You set it up and let it run for days or weeks at a time. Occasionally, we vary our heading by ten or fifteen degrees as we sail offshore, but tweaking of the sails is rarely necessary.

My highest priority when sailing in the trades is to EFFORTLESSLY sail 150 to 160 miles each day, and I want to do it COMFORTABLY. It must be no bruising cruising for it to be ENJOYABLE. Finally, I must be able to do it SAFELY. That means I maintain good speeds without being overpowered and battling with sails that are out of control, and no one is going to get hurt. Things would obviously be different on a racing boat.

If the apparent wind gets up to twenty-five or thirty knots over the stern and the speed gets too high to sail EFFORTLESSLY,ENJOYABLY, COMFORTABLY, AND SAFELY, then I roll up the genoa on the profurl and then immediately unfurl it on the other side of the boat to blanket the freestanding genoa so that I can douse the genoa and tie it to the spinnaker pole. Then I will continue running downing using a single genoa that is on the furler. I have run downwind in fifty knots of wind using about 15% of the roller furling genoa.

If I do another circumnavigation, I may get a sail constructed that I can use for long tradewind passages. This would be a downwind twin headsail in which both genoas are attached to the roller furler through a single luff, and that would make it easy to symmetrically reef a downwind twin on a single profurl. My only reservations about this system is the high continuous loads it would place on the headstay for weeks at a time. I don't think it's a problem, but it's worth thinking about.

The final and more expensive solution is to have two furling headsails that operate independently of each other. That would be nice as it would give great redundancy and possibly back up the headstay which could be helpful when sailing offshore in remote locations.

Maybe we were just lucky, but when we used our double headsail double spinnaker pole rig, we never had to go forward at night to deal with headsails in our trans-Atlantic run last year. It's extremely rare to send crew forward at night to deal with headsails. In our entire eleven year circumnavigation, we haven't had crew forward of the mast at night more than ten times. It wasn't necessary because we sailed in a COMFORTABLE, EFFORTLESS,ENJOYABLE, AND SAFE manner and we still got in our 150 miles a day. We could have sailed like a bat out of hell with our spinnaker up, but it just wasn't worth the work or risk to people or to Exit Only. I believe in no bruising cruising.

Life is good.

Dave

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Old 22-01-2007, 09:03   #18
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Good points about the differences between mono and cats with this arrangement. Still, a great idea.
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Old 22-01-2007, 10:12   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssullivan
An elegant solution! Wow!! I think I might try this. I have a sloop, so rigging up the hardware might be tricky. Any ideas on the best way to rig this up on a sloop? My single forestay has a harken roller furler on it. It's got two tracks, which means I could technically try this out by dropping the furled genoa, then manually raising both genoas at the same time. Sounds difficult!

Any other suggestions on the best way to rig this if you have only a single forestay that already has a furled genoa?
go here
http://www.simetric.co.uk/twizzle_rig/video.htm
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Old 22-01-2007, 14:07   #20
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Any thoughts on how this would work with, say, a Gemini 105Mc Screacher (curved bow track) and standard genoa?
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Old 22-01-2007, 16:35   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxingout
The final and more expensive solution is to have two furling headsails that operate independently of each other. That would be nice as it would give great redundancy and possibly back up the headstay which could be helpful when sailing offshore in remote locations.

HITCHHIKER 35’ CATAMARAN

Australian designer John Hitch, actually designed a cat, the "HitchHiker " with twin heady's, and this is about where my knowledge end's.

You should be able to make out the sails in these pic's.

Dave
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Old 24-01-2007, 15:38   #22
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Kisscat - no mainsail

I came across this Australian company that recommend twin furling jibs and an inner staysail, connected to the forward hulls with no mainsail for their Kisscat design.
Kisscat - KISS Saling - Simple, Straightforward, Stressfree, Sailing!
(No pictures of the rig)

Not a pretty cat, but it has a pretty price.

Chris
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Old 24-01-2007, 15:56   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 420Hull58
I came across this Australian company that recommend twin furling jibs and an inner staysail, connected to the forward hulls with no mainsail for their Kisscat design.
Kisscat - KISS Saling - Simple, Straightforward, Stressfree, Sailing!
(No pictures of the rig)

Not a pretty cat, but it has a pretty price.

Chris


Actually a Oz/ Phillipines crowd, building in the latter

Kisscat is an Australian/Filipino partnership, dedicated to producing spectacular catamarans capable of fulfilling life long dreams, at a truly affordable price.

I would have to say they look very much like an older modified Kelsall design and his latest building method is the "KISS" which I believe stood for "kelsall infused sandwich system", but may not any more, as I don't believe he invented this technique..

Kelsall Catamarans - Sail Cat

DCP_1303 pictures from sailing photos on webshots

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Old 26-01-2007, 04:46   #24
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From “Cruising Compass” (Jan. 25, 2007 - Issue 26):

Boat Rat's Tip of the Week ~ ”Headsails for cruising couples”
”.... A smaller jib that can be shaped for the wind with halyard tension will work well for many cruisers and will take the headaches and back aches out of tacking. You probably will discover, too, that you sail more, power less, and have a better time on the water.”

Goto: Cruising Compass Presented by Blue Water Sailing (Jan. 25, 2007 - Issue 26)
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