Cheap Multis and Projects

[slowbat]

sailboat mast 30'

I little work and negotiation and you could get this tri for free

[magentawave]

I'd pass on the tri but the parts could be very worthwhile to someone!

Originally Posted by slowbat

sailboat mast 30'

I little work and negotiation and you could get this tri for free

[Redreuben]

Don't you love the way dealers have decided to rename plywood and epoxy hulls "composite". What ********.



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[Cavalier MK2]

The 48 Cross doesn't have the usual cabin. Those are large with 4 doubles in the wings and more. It looks more like the 44 which is itself a stretched and widened 42 with fewer accomodations for more speed These boats had the cutter rig. Norm did offer many variations and custom layouts though. It would be interesting to hear the story on this one.

[paxfish]

Originally Posted by Redreuben

Don't you love the way dealers have decided to rename plywood and epoxy hulls "composite". What ********.



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I am curious as to why a epoxy/glass covered plywood hull would not be called a composite structure?

[monte]

Technically it is, a composite of ply and glass, but then so is a wooden yacht a composite of wood and screws. Composite is usually reserved for a composite sandwich construction when describing yachts, such as foam or balsa core.

[paxfish]

Originally Posted by monte

Technically it is, a composite of ply and glass, but then so is a wooden yacht a composite of wood and screws. Composite is usually reserved for a composite sandwich construction when describing yachts, such as foam or balsa core.

So would you call a plywood core with epoxy/glass on BOTH sides composite construction? What if it were something else like a cedar core?

[monte]

plywood is heavy and therefore not used in the traditional sense of a composite material. Cedar is a traditional composite construction material. If plywood had laminate both sides its more likely it was done to keep it floating. If so my first cat was composite :P
The strength of traditional composites comes from the engineered design and keeping the skins separated by a light weight core. Plywood doesn't have the weight/volume to achieve that effect without being overly heavy. My first plywood cat was only glassed over to keep the water on the outside and it was HEAVY!

[Redreuben]

If you consider plywood and dynel "composite" good for you, I consider it deception. At the least it should say plywood composite to truthfully convey accurate information. Cedar strip is usually described as such.
Composite used to be reserved for "fibreglass" structures such as foam sandwich with various reinforcement types like glass, kevlar, carbon.
I would suggest anyone coming up against this "technicality" should call them out on their slight of hand.

[ZULU40]

Originally Posted by Redreuben

If you consider plywood and dynel "composite" good for you, I consider it deception. At the least it should say plywood composite to truthfully convey accurate information. Cedar strip is usually described as such.
Composite used to be reserved for "fibreglass" structures such as foam sandwich with various reinforcement types like glass, kevlar, carbon.
I would suggest anyone coming up against this "technicality" should call them out on their slight of hand.

perhaps at least some of the issue is the database type many brokerages and search engines use. Sites common too or affiliated with sailboatlistings.com offer materials choices of:

• fibreglass,
• composite,
• wood,
• aluminium,
• steel,
• other.

As a seller if you choose unwisely you might cut yourself out of potential customer search engine selection, then theres the issue of what to call a western red cedar strip sheathed in WEST epoxy and woven rovings or cold moulded with kevlar strengthening inside. If you want to class those as a wooden boat, that isnt being fair to its provenance and maintenance needs.

[paxfish]

Originally Posted by ZULU40

perhaps at least some of the issue is the database type many brokerages and search engines use. Sites common too or affiliated with sailboatlistings.com offer materials choices of:

• fibreglass,
• composite,
• wood,
• aluminium,
• steel,
• other.

As a seller if you choose unwisely you might cut yourself out of potential customer search engine selection, then theres the issue of what to call a western red cedar strip sheathed in WEST epoxy and woven rovings or cold moulded with kevlar strengthening inside. If you want to class those as a wooden boat, that isn't being fair to its provenance and maintenance needs.

That makes sense. Composite structures cored with foam or wood (balsa, cedar, plywood etc) have roughly the same expectations for maintenance, construction, neglect, fastening, etc. Some will hold up twice as long when the core is wet, but will succumb eventually if poorly built. There are thousands of Sea-Rays, Hobie Cats, J boats and Boston Whalers out there that can provide evidence of that.

Plywood might be the worst of these, as it tends to wick water further into the core faster.

[captqrunch]

"Composite" is a dodge. In the '80s and '90s, lots of wooden vessels from the '40s and '50s were at the end of their useful lives (and lacked competent ownership). They were abandoned in droves. As a result, marinas and insurers began to discriminate against wooden boats. And that is why wooden became composite.

[Sand crab]

Originally Posted by captqrunch

"Composite" is a dodge. In the '80s and '90s, lots of wooden vessels from the '40s and '50s were at the end of their useful lives (and lacked competent ownership). They were abandoned in droves. As a result, marinas and insurers began to discriminate against wooden boats. And that is why wooden became composite.

But vessels built in the 40s and 50s were not glass over wood with a few exceptions. They were just wood. The modern cored boats are composite.

[ZULU40]

people do not seem to be aware that balsa is a wood

and it is interesting to note, that one of the safest and most successful fighter aircraft used in WW2 was made from plywood,
the De Havilland Mosquito

[Sand crab]

A 60' cat for only $45,000! Is it wood or composite?
2006 Custom Catamaran Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com