Catana 42 or Outremer 42

[44'cruisingcat]

Originally Posted by Michelhhhebert

It seems to me that your choices are based on very little experience about cats,, you may want to give some thoughts to some other factors: most sailors spend 90 % of their time aboard at anchor or dock, a free flowing (no steps) cockpit to saloon is very high in the admiral's view, protected from the elements, air flow in the saloon, galley up is a must, clear view above the raised dinghy, square seating both in the saloon and cockpit is way more comfortable and easier to sleep or lounge in, an inline berth for ease of access or egress to do anchor watch without climbing over your mate, most cats will sail at least as fast as most monohulls so speed is not high on the list, yes the Catana and Outremer have a lot to offer but they require the most in compromises at anchor... but that's only my point of view... the important thing is to get outthere... have fun

Galley up is a must? No, not for everyone. My wife actually prefers the galley down. So do I.

I also would not be content with just sailing as fast as most monohulls......

[webejammin]

Originally Posted by 44'cruisingcat

Galley up is a must? No, not for everyone. My wife actually prefers the galley down. So do I.

I also would not be content with just sailing as fast as most monohulls......

Another vote for galley down. I also would not be content with just sailing as fast as most monohulls

[downunder]

Originally Posted by webejammin

Another vote for galley down. I also would not be content with just sailing as fast as most monohulls

Galley down is often done because of inadequate space in Saloon which would compromise galley. Possibly better off with galley down if space was compromised in saloon.

Personally I like galley up to be where the action is. Can't knock anothers choice though as is a personal preference. The galley down in 44C vessel looks good as do the Seawinds.

Cheers

[Michelhhhebert]

One of the BIG benefit of being on/owning a cat is to not be "stuck" in the cave, I do understand the compromise on the 105c and the long galley in the 44c, but if I was on the market for a cat, galley up would be very very high on my list. Ho and by the way I just made a small crossing between South Carolina and the Bahamas on my "small" Mahe 36 and averaged 8 knots even with the galley up... surfed at 13,6... not fast for a racing cat but acceptable and still faster than most monos, the slower speed in this case is more due to the LWL and cruising junk than a compromise for the galley up. I still think that the C42 and the O42 are not the optimum in comfort and flow once at anchor... but I'd love to sail on both.

[smj]

An 8 kt average on a 36' cat is fantastic!

[Barra]

Well I'm now officially biased on this comparison. I've just closed a deal on a Phisa 42 which is basically the Catana 42 ie Catana 401 mould lengthened to 42 feet by Phisa Did the test sail today in choppy 25 knot conditions and while I expected decent downwind performance it was the upwind that pleasantly surprised.

Downwind we surfed along at up to 12 knots with 2 reefs in (weren't pushing it at all) and upwind the forward bouyancy gave us smooth motion compared to other cats I've sailed in similar conditions. 8 knots at 45 degrees.

I like the outside helms myself as it leaves the cockpit clear and if you want to enjoy the sail it's defo the place to be. It's damn cold here in Europe so when we had enough of that on with the auto and back into the spacious cockpit.

Thumbs up the Catanlina as they tell me it's got a slight edge over the older Phisa design and if that's true then it's got my vote

Cheers

Barra

[sy_gilana]

Catana exposed helm, not a problem, lovely to sit out there I enjoy it, too much sun, come inside and let the autopilot work, use the remote steering, Put up an umbrella, good breeze in the shade.

In direct answer to the question, if you will spend 95% of your time at anchor and 5% actually sailing, then go for the more comfortable boat. If you are going to be actually sailing for more than say 10%, I would still choose the comfortable one, although I would envy the speed of the faster one (from my saloon while reading with my feet up) as they slide by huddled from the spray in their spartan cockpit.

[Tomahawk]

Originally Posted by Barra

lets just say i now know why outremers are so fast - they are built VERY light. I could flex the hulls by hand and knocking the composite felt very light. the catana sounded and felt very solid on the other hand.

my 2c

Dear Barra SMJ Sandcrab and everyone else..

I cannot own to being even handed as I have an Outremer 40/43.. In reply to Baras comment about lightness, one needs to judge by what is inside not the skin.. The Outr is built on two beams between the hulls shaped a lot like staples They are fitted to the hull from from the deck to the keel ... you won't budge or flex the joint without breaking the entire boat into very little bits.. The beams themselves they are made of encapsulated cold moulded marine ply of varying thickness depending on location.. the front beam has diagonal braces inside from the mast step to the the hulls to create a ridged box.. There are seven bulkheads down each hull (in 43 ft of boat) ...and longitudinal stringers between the bulkheads.. The phrase that comes to my mind is build like a brick S***T house... The Beams also have enough buoyancy to float the tub IF you manage to flip it..

Sure I can felx the skin between the ribs but that is not where is needs rigidity..

The photos from the cabin look fore & aft from the steps into the hulls showing the bulkheads either side of the steps then both faces of the forward beam and the crash bulkhead with the internal hatch.. the mess in the engine room looks at the solid forward face of the aft beam and webbed aft face as it attaches to the hull.. (the mess is because I am changing the sound insulation) ..

A big sailing difference is the mainsheet arrangement.. The Outr has a traveller and 4:1 block system on two 40 winches and clutches. The Cata has two winches which both attach to the boom in a triangle..

The Cata does have asymmetric hulls whereas the Outr has simple symetric hulls..

[Barra]

Good to know Tomahawk as it was disconcerting to be able to flex the skin so easily!

Like I said i had the outremer high on my list but as you say unless you go up a fair way in length the accomodations are a bit of a compromise. So ultimately wasnt an option on my budget if i was to keep the mrs happy. Im hoping ive found the right compromise between performance and comfort with the catana camp but time will tell.

You have hit on the one thing im not too sure about with my new Phisa/catana 42 which is the mainsheet set up. Im sure ill work it out as i get to know the boat but im way more comfortable with a traveller arrangement from mono sailing than the triangle arrangement on the catanas.

Can anyone with Catana experience provide some details on how they find the trianglular mainsheet arrangement on the catanas (including any handling tips)?

cheers
Barra

[threadkiller]

I am very interested in the same subject, the pros and cons, any tips or tricks.

Anyone with first hand experience?

[sandy daugherty]

I've sailed three cats with dual main sheets. I found it possible to tune the main well, but it was confusing at first. A traveler with winches and a mainsheet with a winch are easier to visualize because the forces are more rectilinear (?) while to two sheet system is cheaper, lighter, and doable. If I were building, I'd go with two sheets. If I were buying used, I'd let the previous owner take the hit on all that hardware!

[Tomahawk]

OK this should convince you which way to go.. I think I was on board when it was taken .. it was in the Outremer Cup 2010..

The spray says it all

[Cruising Couple]

Originally Posted by Tomahawk

OK this should convince you which way to go.. I think I was on board when it was taken .. it was in the Outremer Cup 2010..

The spray says it all

Impressive Tomahawk! Thanks for sharing this.

Darby

[Barra]

Thanks Sandy

It definitely isnt as intuitive as you say. What i did like about it was the inbuilt preventer in the set up ie deep downwind we shifted the leeward mainsheet to a padeye on the leeward hull - instant preventer and very cruiser friendly!

I guess ill just play around with it when i take delivery

[Barra]

Originally Posted by Tomahawk

OK this should convince you which way to go.. I think I was on board when it was taken .. it was in the Outremer Cup 2010..

The spray says it all

Yeah very nice Tomahawk. Its got me VEEERRRY itchy for my delivery! 2 months.....

not sure it seals the debate on the catana vs outremer though - they both have good performance i think though accept the race will be won by you and the post race drinks more comfortable on mine!

cheers
barra