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Old 28-10-2011, 15:24   #331
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

If you still want to use sails, this is the future of high performance cruising cats.

http://www.parasailor.co.za/dyn_docu...lor__smg50.pdf

If you are tired of sail maintenance, then something like the Walker Wing Sail might resurface in the future.

For folks like High Tracker, who appears to have a very good understanding of moment-arm and compression loading, I'm preaching to the choir. A-frames, 65 lb 20 hp electric hybrid drives, center mounted and sound insulated gen sets, all sails furling, will catch on just because they are a better mouse trap.
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Old 28-10-2011, 18:08   #332
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

High Tacker,

A few posters here have mentioned your website being hard to navigate.

A year or 2 back I found this site set up just to sell a boat.
********************* Formosa 51 for Sale - HOME

I don't know why the link has come up looking so strange, but it still opens up on my computer.

It impressed the hell out of me because it was so clear, informative and easy to navigate, to the point that I eventually chose the Weebly platform myself.

It's literally 'free and easy', and you might find it useful too.

Vic
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Old 28-10-2011, 19:00   #333
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High Tacker,

You have a fantastic cat! A-frame is the way to go, especially for a cat. No doubt in my mind, at all.

Structurally, why put a compression post on top of a suspended beam? Ludicrous! And from an aerodynamic point of view, why ruin the laminar flow across the leading edge of the mainsail with a bloody great turbulence creator? Also ludicrous!

If I had a decent budget and more time, I would be building aluminium origami hulls to finish up with an A-frame rigged cat. Or maybe twin carbon bi-plane masts. But I don't have the $ nor the time, so we compromised with cored FG hulls and conventional rig - although it is a rotating mast!

There are some excellent cat designers out there and Malcolm is one. Others who I would love to go for a sail with include White, Schionning, Kelsall and the Outremer designer (forgotten his French name right now
James Wharram would be good to share a beer with around a beach fire and listen to his stories.

Best of luck with the sale! If I bump into a likely candidate, I will send them your way.

PS. Congratulations to the ABs for beating the froggies!
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Old 28-10-2011, 22:23   #334
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

Interesting point about loading the cross beam structure Jimbo.
What is the cost difference between and A frame and conventional rig?
I would imagine that the long term maintenace costs for the A frame are lower because you don't have to replace the SS cables?
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Old 29-10-2011, 03:08   #335
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by deckofficer View Post
If you still want to use sails, this is the future of high performance cruising cats.

http://www.parasailor.co.za/dyn_docu...lor__smg50.pdf
In the round-the-world fleet I was part of, a lot of boats (cats and monos) used Parasailors. All the owners said they were wonderful but 'most' of the owners spent a lot time and a lot of money having them repaired in various ports. I say 'most' only because I can't with absolute certainty say 'all'. It certainly seemed as though they all wrecked them at one time or another.
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Old 29-10-2011, 11:49   #336
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

I was wondering how the euro's value is holding up in these shakey finacial times compaired to the US dollar? In case I wanted to buy a multi-hull from the Med, would it cost more or less than a year ago?
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Old 29-10-2011, 13:04   #337
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

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Originally Posted by webejammin View Post
I was wondering how the euro's value is holding up in these shakey finacial times compaired to the US dollar? In case I wanted to buy a multi-hull from the Med, would it cost more or less than a year ago?
$1.41=1euro 1.38 a year ago was 1.29 a couple of months ago.
Ecchange rates here and you can punch in past dates.
XE - United States Dollars - USD rate table
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Old 30-10-2011, 10:37   #338
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sand crab View Post
$1.41=1euro 1.38 a year ago was 1.29 a couple of months ago.
Ecchange rates here and you can punch in past dates.
XE - United States Dollars - USD rate table
Looks like prices are getting more even if buying out of the Med with US dollars.
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Old 01-11-2011, 05:30   #339
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

Interesting. We all want a bargain. Always have and always will. Good times and bad. And of course. there are always "steals" that some else just stole. There are lots of problems in trying to find a steal. 1. condition. It is very difficult to tell condition of a boat even when it is new. Used boats? Even after an very careful (and expensive) surveys by a skilled professional and by an experienced potential owner, unpleasant (and sometimes - pleasant) surprises lay waiting in the future.
2. Does it fit? Very few charter cats fit my idea of a comfortable caravan for a couple for an extended period. Maybe that is why Gemini's get our attention over and over - depite their obvious shortcomings. I recall my own hunt back in 01 through 04. Miles and miles of tramping around and looking at boats and looking at boats. I come at it another way. I would rather pay to much and get what I want and can afford than run around and around looking and looking and looking for a bargain. I recall my old man as he bought a John Deere to use on the farm from a not to distant neighbors auction. He said "when you buy a great one, you quickly forget waht you paid for it but when you don't buy a great one you remember every d-m penny it cost you."

Brian - it is simple to say "this is what I can afford to pay." Do you really care if the guy is offended. Your are making an offer. Don't bs around and waste his time and emotions. Make your offer simple and straightforward. My guess is it is real poor form to make an offer without spelling out the conditions. If you want to make a low ball offer and then survey you probably are not going to get the absolute bottom dollor. Or the fool deserves to let you steal it.. If I am selling and someone makes a low offer then they need to make a decent deposit and be prepared to survey quickly and make up their mind quickly. In any market to take my boat off the market while you now try to fiigure out what it is really worth to them sounds more like a fishing trip than buying. You want to really make me wiggle make me on offer that is firm. Make me an offer that involves really selling the boat for a specific price and you will find out what my real bottom dollar is. Don't worry about offending me then.

But also remember the "owner" may not really own the boat. The bank does and he has to get the banks premission to short sell.

Dragon Lady - I bought out of forclosure in 2004 so forclosure bargains are not new. I was there at the moment that the bank finally had all the paper in place after it ha finally decided it was time to get out. Just luck and lots and lots of looking and I bought my ugly duckling. Do enough hunting and waiting and looking and maybe you will find your bargain too. I hope you know what you are doing as well as we did when we did. We had been looking for this particular make and model for awile and had already been living aboard for several years.
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Old 01-11-2011, 16:12   #340
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What he said!
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Old 01-11-2011, 22:37   #341
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

Hey Y'all,

I'm gonna be more or less incommunicado for a few days, but if anybody wants to make me a crazy offer, leave a message at DAMSL — Catbird Suite
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Old 02-11-2011, 00:16   #342
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

High Tracker,

You know by my comments that I really admire Catbird Suite. My boat budget however is limited to a bit less than 1/2 asking price, and that would almost empty the cruising kitty and with the crappy returns on investments right now, I'd have to learn to cruise on $20 a day.
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Old 02-11-2011, 08:46   #343
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

deckofficer

Ouch! I'd have to get somewhat more than that. Can't you sell something? Or do you have a smaller boat, or a house, or a wife, or something that you could throw into the deal?

Hey, you can live in New Zealand on $20 a day. Fishing is good, staple groceries for two, veggies, coffee, etc., say, maybe $10. $6 for a six-pack of beer. That leaves $4 a day to save for special occasions. Oh, you might burn a couple liters of diesel per day to run the genset, and a very rare bit for the mains, which I generally use only when dealing with anchor or maneuvering in town. Good rowing dinghy, so you don't need fuel for that. Got a mooring in the river in town center, walk to shop.

But seriously. she'd be great in the charter biz, and would command a pretty good rate, so you could pick up plenty to live on from that.

Cheers, Tom
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Old 02-11-2011, 09:09   #344
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

By the way, I did post a classified ad in this forum, as some of you suggested. It says:

For Sale or Trade - 63' Malcolm Tennant Cruising Catamaran

The ad is now on page 3 in classified. But I note that this thread on the market for cats gets much higher readership.

I should add to the ad that I would trade down to a smaller boat and some cash, especially if the boat has a berth around San Francisco, ideally Sausalito, where I have family and am looking to spend my dotage there.

Cheers, High Tacker
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Old 02-11-2011, 11:30   #345
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Re: Catamarans - Current Market Situation

I wonder if Greese would be the place where a person could find a bargan to day sence the euro is on hold by the peoples vote to see if the world market will crumble. I'm starting to see why a lot of boat builders ar going to China they have all the money achording to the news.
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