Buying the right catamaran

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Andrew Grace

"10% love their brand of boat they sold, and 90% love the brand they own"

I suspect that a large proportion (the majority?) of cat owners who are on a second or subsequent cat, "trade up" to the same brand

[Dulcesuenos]

We've owned French, SA, and US built cats, just crossed the Atlantic on a 42 leopard, and have worked on several cats of varying makes and models. There are alot of variables, some cats have bad offshore tendencies, loud noise,pound, bad motion etc, some are quiet and smooth riding, adequate bridgedeck clearance, no sharp hull chines near the waters edge or sharp provisions waves can hit are large factors. It makes a huge difference if you want to sleep offshore or even in a rough Anchorage. Maintenance is another huge concern. Any cat or sailboat with a life of lack of maintenance is a huge headache. Some boats are built to better resist the common issues. Knowing what I know now my next boat will be a Catamaran, (if I can find one priced right) or a Manta.

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[salticrak]

Originally Posted by ausaviator

I get the feeling that 90% of cat owners love their brand better than all the others. Funny that!

This means in the end that no matter what brand you buy, you will probably be happy with your choice.

This may be ego related.Seen it with other toys too.To admit that what you bought is a pile of crap makes you some how a lower form of life. It goes as far as people glossing over faults and flaws of a particular item,championing only the good. Some sorta Stockholm syndrome?

[Dulcesuenos]

Originally Posted by Dulcesuenos

We've owned French, SA, and US built cats, just crossed the Atlantic on a 42 leopard, and have worked on several cats of varying makes and models. There are alot of variables, some cats have bad offshore tendencies, loud noise,pound, bad motion etc, some are quiet and smooth riding, adequate bridgedeck clearance, no sharp hull chines near the waters edge or sharp provisions waves can hit are large factors. It makes a huge difference if you want to sleep offshore or even in a rough Anchorage. Maintenance is another huge concern. Any cat or sailboat with a life of lack of maintenance is a huge headache. Some boats are built to better resist the common issues. Knowing what I know now my next boat will be a Catamaran, (if I can find one priced right) or a Manta.

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Meant to say Catana.

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[Firstbait]

If you want a heavy multi-hull you can add a sail to have a look at this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GLKTDFdlwE

a Nustar 50 me think.
If you want a sailing catamaran have a look at this
https://vimeo.com/153049623

[ozsailer]

G'day Peter,
I dont know who gave you the details about staying away from French Cats, but in my opinion thats just rubbish as well as just staying with Aussie Cats, once again rubbish !! There are some excellent Catamarans out there be they Australian. American, French, South African etc.

Having cruised a reasonable amount of the East Coast of Australia I think that I can safely say that the vast majority of time that you will actually do little sailing when cruising while passage making. Most times you will be motoring or motor sailing if you wish to make passage miles. Yes you can sail but dont expect to make destinations in a timely manner.

Talk to seasoned cruisers and if truthful they will tell you they motor sail at least 90 percent of the time. When covering passage miles here on the East Coast of Oz when you are timing the crossing of Bars or trying to make unfamiliar anchorages before dark you will require a boat that is capable of making 6 knots under sail or motor to make it a far more enjoyable journey. Also remember that sailing is only one component of cruising. 90% or greater of your time will be at anchor or in a marina berth so being able to live comfortably at anchor is a very important factor to consider.

The soundest peice of advise I could offer is actually sit down and work out what you actually want to achieve then work out what you want in a boat. Speed is not everything. There is a very good commentary in Youtube by a company based in American called the Catamaran Company. It gives a very good insight into some aspects of purchasing a suitable craft.

To clarify, I own a French built catamaran. We bought if for many reasons, great price being one of the key components but it was also based on lots of research. She is no dog when it comes to sailing with friends who sail similar sized Bavarias and Hanse will attest to . She is a well sea tested boat that has my full confidence. What suite us may not suite you. Regardless of manufactuer bridgedeck clearance is a must if you dont want to suffer from deck slam.

Keep an open mind and ultimately be happy with your purchase based on your own research.

Greg H
SV Sunshine.

[Factor]

Originally Posted by ozsailer

you will require a boat that is capable of making 6 knots under sail or motor to make it a far more enjoyable journey......sail similar sized Bavarias and Hanse will attest to :.

And yet on my Australian Catamaran that we cruised extensively on for 5 years we motored just 300 hours. If I couldnt sail at 6 knots in 8 -10 of breeze, I'd buy a power boat. And if I couldnt outsail a bavaria, I would - well you guessed it - get a powerboat.

People who think you have to motor all the time, simply haven't sailed a good cat.

[REsCat]

I completely agree with Factor and would add that we always keep our destinations flexible when possible and choose ones that give favourable wind angles.
We sail FAR more than motor/motorsail and we have no problems sailing slower if winds are very light. We also don't mind being on day passage the "whole" day and not "I have to be at so and so anchorage by noon! "

We see many more sailboats motoring/motorsailing than we do sailing(even on reasonable wind days) and well, It bothers me but I am getting used to it...
I understand that timing to get across bars or certain inlets with tide considerations requires motoring and we will do that if necessary.

As Factor says, It is possible to buy a cat that sails well, keep it reasonably light and simple and still be comfortable and enjoy the Cruising experience.

Bob

[sailjumanji]

Originally Posted by ausaviator

I get the feeling that 90% of cat owners love their brand better than all the others. Funny that!

This means in the end that no matter what brand you buy, you will probably be happy with your choice.

I think that is true, but also because some features and designs are specific to certain cats. My seawind 1000 has open salon and dual steering stations unlike any other in its size range. The seawind 1160 is similar open salon and steering stations that are not like other boats. I don't like the cats that have a separate station on top to steer - seems to separate you from guests below.

The Atlantic series of cats have cockpits forward of salon. So while I agree there is brand loyalty (having owned a seawind I also know how tough they are built which is another reason I would do back), I think there is also design favoritism.

[Mr B]

I have a Gemini 34 foot, its build no is 825, Every one of them has a sail number that tells which build it is,
It is only 14 feet wide so I can berth it at at Marinas as a single berth, Wider Cats get charged more,
They made nearly 1200 of this model boat, It is an American boat,
Yes it does slam going up wind, But I dont sail very often upwind, I like to sit back and relax and have a following wind, Where it sits flat and level,
I need 3 knots to get it moving, then it usually sits 2 knots below the following actual wind,
It is very similar to the Aussie Seawind Cat, In looks and shape,
It does 7 knots at 2500 RPM on the Westerbeke diesel,, 8 Knots flat stick going against the out going tide in an inlet, 3/4 US gallon per hour, So its cheap to run on the motor,

It was lightened by removing all the Cherry wood paneling inside it after the owner and his son of the company that built them delivered one to England across the North Atlantic,
Quite a few of these boats have done RTW cruises,
They call it a Coastal cruiser, but it has no problems handling Blue Water voyages,

There is a video of it on Youtube so you can see how it sails,
Anything after 2002 is the lightened version,
I bought mine to handle the southern oceans, Western Port Bay, Bass straight, Tasman sea, around Tasmania, Great Australian Bight,
And specifically for the Kimberlys, As it has a 600 MM draught, I can park it on the beach when the tide goes out,
I also needed an enclosed cockpit for the cold and rain we have down here, It is also totally removable for the tropics up north,

I bought mine in Fiji as I couldnt afford to buy a Cat in Australia, They are twice the price,
It has a queen and two double beds, It came with all the Bells and Whistles that you can put on a boat, I do mean every thing,
The only thing it was missing was an electric winch for the Anchor, But thats not a bother for me as its the only exercise I get on board,

As all Marinas are locked in OZ, the only way to see them is on the internet and then by arrangement with an owner of broker,

Yes I am very happy with my boat, and not just because I own it,

Go onto the Forums of specific boats you are interested in, Then you will find out any problems they are having with specific models,
There is an Owners Forum for every model Cat available, ,

[sailjumanji]

Originally Posted by Mr B

I have a Gemini 34 foot, its build no is 825, Every one of them has a sail number that tells which build it is,
It is only 14 feet wide so I can berth it at at Marinas as a single berth, Wider Cats get charged more,
They made nearly 1200 of this model boat, It is an American boat,
Yes it does slam going up wind, But I dont sail very often upwind, I like to sit back and relax and have a following wind, Where it sits flat and level,
I need 3 knots to get it moving, then it usually sits 2 knots below the following actual wind,
It is very similar to the Aussie Seawind Cat, In looks and shape,
It does 7 knots at 2500 RPM on the Westerbeke diesel,, 8 Knots flat stick going against the out going tide in an inlet, 3/4 US gallon per hour, So its cheap to run on the motor,

It was lightened by removing all the Cherry wood paneling inside it after the owner and his son of the company that built them delivered one to England across the North Atlantic,
Quite a few of these boats have done RTW cruises,
They call it a Coastal cruiser, but it has no problems handling Blue Water voyages,

There is a video of it on Youtube so you can see how it sails,
Anything after 2002 is the lightened version,
I bought mine to handle the southern oceans, Western Port Bay, Bass straight, Tasman sea, around Tasmania, Great Australian Bight,
And specifically for the Kimberlys, As it has a 600 MM draught, I can park it on the beach when the tide goes out,
I also needed an enclosed cockpit for the cold and rain we have down here, It is also totally removable for the tropics up north,

I bought mine in Fiji as I couldnt afford to buy a Cat in Australia, They are twice the price,
It has a queen and two double beds, It came with all the Bells and Whistles that you can put on a boat, I do mean every thing,
The only thing it was missing was an electric winch for the Anchor, But thats not a bother for me as its the only exercise I get on board,

As all Marinas are locked in OZ, the only way to see them is on the internet and then by arrangement with an owner of broker,

Yes I am very happy with my boat, and not just because I own it,

Go onto the Forums of specific boats you are interested in, Then you will find out any problems they are having with specific models,
There is an Owners Forum for every model Cat available, ,

Regarding the Gemini design same as seawind, the Seawind has a salon open to the cockpit. I thought the Gemini had them separated by a wall/door. Also at 19 ft 7 in wide, it is almost six feet wider than the Gemini. That adds a lot of space. And in the states, I have never been charged more because my cat is wider than a 14 ft Gemini. Always pay the same per foot rate as the monohull. Just am limited to either a t-head, or a slot shared with a narrow monohull and no center pole. That said, the Gemini is a nice cat as well. But there are design aspects that really differentiate them.

[smj]

We have owned two Geminis and two Seawind 1000's and there is no similarity.


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[tomfl]

Originally Posted by ausaviator

I get the feeling that 90% of cat owners love their brand better than all the others. Funny that!

This means in the end that no matter what brand you buy, you will probably be happy with your choice.

Not sure I agree.

I have a Seawind. True I am happy with the boat and think it is good value for the money, especially for me and what I do with it.

But if I could trade even up for a nice Chris White, Outremer, or some of the Farrier cats Ian designed I would do it in a New York minute. There are probably a dozen other cats the same would be true of.

I would love to have one of the little Gunboats, but if the truth be known don't have the long green to buy one.

[sailjumanji]

Tom, I am with you except for the farriers. I owned two of the corsairs and loved them. But the farrier cat is disappointing as its another one with salon all closed up, and you steer standing behind a bulkhead. One of the things that I like about the seawind and gun boat is open salon, dual wheels, great visibility, etc.

I really like the Atlantic 42 and not too expensive. Sail great. But the salon is more suited for cold weather boat and doesn't have the ventilation for warm climate.

[Factor]

Agree - farriers tris were/are great, his cats not so much. Sailed a few - a bit disappointing ergonomically and performance wise. Still better than most of the boats out there just not as good as I thought they might be. Also Agree on Chris Whites boats, very much like them.