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Old 11-08-2008, 15:28   #1
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Buying a new sail catamaran

How much sailing practical and theoretical training of a new catamaran do you think that you should be able to require from a serious boat manufacturers.


If I buy a Ferrari included an education that is never someone who says that I can not buy the car.
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Old 12-08-2008, 21:16   #2
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Boat builders required education of buyers?

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How much sailing practical and theoretical training of a new catamaran do you think that you should be able to require from a serious boat manufacturers.


If I buy a Ferrari included an education that is never someone who says that I can not buy the car.
You mean, should boat builders provide an education in yachting as a mandatory thing? No, partly because they are not qualified, and partly because it shouldn't be their responsibility.
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Old 13-08-2008, 01:04   #3
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[quote=freetime;192475]How much sailing practical and theoretical training of a new catamaran do you think that you should be able to require from a serious boat manufacturers.


Maybe not directly related to the question but during my delivery trip, our french skipper had told me that in France anyone can buy any wessel and sail/cruise without any kind of license or whatsoever. I am sure every country has its own regulations. In Turkey you need to have license for which you have to answer at least 15 question out of 20, regarding navigation, meteo, general seamanship (anchoring,etc), MOB, first aid, diesel engines, electricity, etc..
If someone is to circumnaviagate, does he/she need to have a license (or any proof of expertise) to go through British, US or Australian waters ??

Yeloya

NB: some charter companies require a license for bareboat charter while some others are asking for a "proof of expertise". What this can be ??
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Old 13-08-2008, 01:15   #4
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In the UK we have no requirement for a licence but we do have a voluntary RYA qualification scheme that goes right up to Ocean Master. Classes are well attended and the education is well past the compulsory licence level of other countries.

Nobody needs a licence to operate their own leisure craft below about 78 feet in UK waters. You do need a radio licence and that is OK from your home country.

We have a very good safety record much better than European countries with compulsory licences and there are strong arguments for not tampering with the system.
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Old 13-08-2008, 01:22   #5
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[quote=yeloya;193169]
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If someone is to circumnaviagate, does he/she need to have a license (or any proof of expertise) to go through British, US or Australian waters ??
In most European waters you need a minimum of an ICC (International Certificate of Competance) but strangely enough in the UK you don't. If you had a spare $10mil you could walk in to Sunseeker say and buy a 90ft very powerful power boat, open up the throttles and off you go! Now that is scary!!!
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Old 13-08-2008, 01:46   #6
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[QUOTE=Adaero;193173]
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Originally Posted by yeloya View Post

In most European waters you need a minimum of an ICC (International Certificate of Competance) but strangely enough in the UK you don't. If you had a spare $10mil you could walk in to Sunseeker say and buy a 90ft very powerful power boat, open up the throttles and off you go! Now that is scary!!!
We as a service to the customers supply a skipper with teaching papers to teach you the use of the boat so you are able to handle the boat well , safe and get optimum pleasure out of the boat.
A skipper also comes along for the trip from Durban to Cape Town or about 3 to 6 days weather permitting .
This is not a complete sailing course since we expect some degree of sailing ability from our clients but we make sure that the client knows their boat from the bow to the transom and know its limitations .

Greetings

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Old 13-08-2008, 01:47   #7
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90 foot is over the limit its just about 80 foot from memory.

You can still enter European waters with a vessel registered say in the USA without an ICC....... I think!
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Old 13-08-2008, 01:50   #8
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That was exactly the point I was trying to make. The same skipper told me to be very careful in French marinas, particularly when crowded. He has witnessed to many boats hitting each other even one skipper yelling" can anybody tell me how to stop this d***n thing ??"
It is really starnge that in some countries with huge marine history they don't have any compulsary license requirement. Having a license doesn't qualify you to be a "good" skipper but at least you have a minimum understanding of what's going on..

Yeloya
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Old 13-08-2008, 01:58   #9
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But the UK has a very good safety record and many boaters take the RYA route which is a much higher standard than any compulsory route.

The problem with compulsion is that the standard is very , very low. Answering 12 questions is not very much whereas voluntary education to a high standard provides a country with less accidents.

I boat in Europe and the impression given by your friend is by no means the norm. Insurance rates are low, accidents are low.

The lowest standard I have seen in boating was in the BVI when I bare boat chartered. Yet all of those people had to be qualified!!!
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Old 13-08-2008, 02:33   #10
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I maybe wrong, but I thought France was very strict when it came to size of engines and you had to be certified (I dont mean sectioned) to be able to use boats up to certain HP's, maybe therefore sailing boats are excluded as most only have small engines.
Does anyone really know which countries require what certificates?
I also agree with Adaero that if you sail to France without the ICC they can fine and cano impound your boat.
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Old 13-08-2008, 03:33   #11
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I think you are right - as an EU citizen I need an ICC in France but I do not think that is the case with say a USA registered boat - I am maybe wrong.
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Old 13-08-2008, 03:46   #12
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I think you are right - as an EU citizen I need an ICC in France but I do not think that is the case with say a USA registered boat - I am maybe wrong.
I am also not sure about this, but knowing the French I would be careful, probably the best people to ask would be the RYA.
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Old 13-08-2008, 04:04   #13
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I am also not sure about this, but knowing the French I would be careful, probably the best people to ask would be the RYA.
Anybody going into France waters needs the ICC no exceptions and it is being checked often

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Old 13-08-2008, 08:09   #14
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According to this link, ICC is only available to British Citizens.

International Certificate of Competence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Is there another certification that covers other nationalities (or is wikipedia simply wrong)?
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Old 13-08-2008, 08:36   #15
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I have my at home, i can check later today, maybe not with the words ICC? But it´s international and in 8 languages!
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