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Old 29-09-2008, 22:55   #46
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Reason 1288, mono owners seem to be a little more mature?
Bzzzzzz! Objection, your honor!

Generalization with little but circummstantial evidence!

There are lot's of immature posters. Some with single gonads and some with more (I imagine... I dream... never mind - I am not thinking about anyone else's gonads... any more.... damn...)
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Old 29-09-2008, 23:06   #47
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I think the original basis for this thread was resolved somewhere around post #16. The boat was heavier than Gideon originally said. Anything aside from that is off topic. If you do not like Gideon, or how he does business, don't buy his boat. Ignore his posts, and move on to better things. I can darn sure tell you that if Butterfly was the culmination of my dreams, and savings, I would be very hurt by all this talk about a builder that provided me with the end product that I requested. Unless I of course, wanted to express my own experience with that builder.
Fastcat built a boat.
A customer purchased that boat.
The customer has not publicly expressed any dissatisfaction with that boat.
A bet was made, and the facts are in. There is a winner.
Finally, As to Gludy. He chose to leave. He was offered to stay. He requested his account be closed. He started another forum, run the way he wanted a forum to be run. I applaud him for this, and wish him success. But, nothing was done to Gludy. He was not asked to leave. He was not forced to leave, and no ill will has been expressed to the success of his forum.
This is a matter of fact, not a matter for further debate, so, can we get back to talking about boats?
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Old 30-09-2008, 13:51   #48
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This is a matter of fact, not a matter for further debate, so, can we get back to talking about boats?
This thread is only about one boat and how much it weighs as opposed to how much it was supposed to weigh.

That is still not clear to me.

With "all the options" and "options we had installed" being the confusing things.
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Old 30-09-2008, 14:44   #49
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The boat was heavier than Gideon originally said. Anything aside from that is off topic.

A bet was made, and the facts are in. There is a winner.
Thanks for clarifying the issue Kai Nui.

I hope that Gideon will respect the wager, and as I have said earlier, let's use the money for a few drinks to all CF members who pitch up at wherever we can agree.
The owners of the boat have not chosen to persue the weight issue, so I think we should respect their decision, regardless of what we feel is just or not, and leave it at that.

I sincerely hope that they get the other issues sorted so they can get out there and do what many of us dream of, as soon as possible.

Hopefully all of us, including the builder have also learnt something along the way.

Did the exposure here help focus the attention of the builder? I don't know, but it sure didn't slow down the response, so let's just leave it at that.

Alan
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Old 01-10-2008, 11:21   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Therapy View Post
This thread is only about one boat and how much it weighs as opposed to how much it was supposed to weigh.

That is still not clear to me.

With "all the options" and "options we had installed" being the confusing things.
Hallo Therapy

I can clear that one up for you , a ready to sail FastCat 435 weights 6500 kilo.
This version is lengthened and made higher in order for the clients to be able to stand up straight allover. It has a hard top Bimini instead of the standard soft top. 3 x 5 meters in size and every option one can think of , besides that I have continued to improve the Butterfly with many additional extra,s like 3 more cabinets, bigger winches an extended bow and about 50 other items .We have also placed 4 additional portholes. 2 separate showers are build in forward with extra bulkheads and seats.
To give you an idea of weight , we just weighted a Hard top bimini at 124.6 kilo , that is without the supports on which it rests or the 2 x 210 watt solar panels of each 18 kilo. Raising the complete hull with 45 mm I have estimated at 135 kilo.
If The Butterfly has a sail away weight of 9 tons metric with 50 % water and diesel that still leaves plenty payload since the maximum allowable is 13250 kilo or still 4250 to go until the max allowable is reached.

Greetings

Gideon
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Old 01-10-2008, 11:49   #51
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As another FastCat owner I can throw in another weight figure: Just below 10 tonnes.
This was with very little water and diesel in my tanks.
Is this a figure that shocks me? No, I think it's a great figure. It's important to keep in mind that my boat is hull #1 and every boat after mine is lighter. I like to think that mine is more solid, containing amongst other things much more kevlar (icebergs beware!)
Dick and Karen have a lot more extras on their boat that I don't, but their boat still weights the same as mine. My boat is still a few tonnes lighter than a normal production catamaran, so I'm not complaining. All in all, they are happy and so am I.
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Old 01-10-2008, 12:06   #52
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a ready to sail FastCat 435 weights 6500 kilo.
I suspect that if you discovered World Peace it would be the wrong colour for some
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Old 01-10-2008, 12:33   #53
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SettingSail2009īs Fastcat is probably very well build. And as he say, little more solid than later hullnumbers.
But i am sorry to say i am so tired to read the word weight and fastcat in same thread.......
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Old 01-10-2008, 12:47   #54
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Here we go again!

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Originally Posted by fastcat435 View Post
Hallo Therapy

I can clear that one up for you , a ready to sail FastCat 435 weights 6500 kilo.
This version is lengthened and made higher in order for the clients to be able to stand up straight allover. It has a hard top Bimini instead of the standard soft top. 3 x 5 meters in size and every option one can think of , besides that I have continued to improve the Butterfly with many additional extra,s like 3 more cabinets, bigger winches an extended bow and about 50 other items .We have also placed 4 additional portholes. 2 separate showers are build in forward with extra bulkheads and seats.
To give you an idea of weight , we just weighted a Hard top bimini at 124.6 kilo , that is without the supports on which it rests or the 2 x 210 watt solar panels of each 18 kilo. Raising the complete hull with 45 mm I have estimated at 135 kilo.
If The Butterfly has a sail away weight of 9 tons metric with 50 % water and diesel that still leaves plenty payload since the maximum allowable is 13250 kilo or still 4250 to go until the max allowable is reached.

Greetings

Gideon


I'll give you 10/10 for persistency Gideon, credebility regarding weights and sailing performance will score a lot lower.

So now the weight difference between what you posted earlier and this is only around 3 tons?

Hardtop bimini is now 124.6 kg instead of 64 kg.

May I suggest you look at your own spreadsheet posted here:
How the Weight of a FastCat 455 Is Made Up


Your specification for a 455 includes the increased height you mention, see your own website.

Please tell us what figure you post we should believe, as this is confusing me.

Greetings

Alan
Attached Files
File Type: doc weights%20455[1].doc (139.0 KB, 53 views)
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Old 01-10-2008, 13:39   #55
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There is a cable TV commercial that has aired recently that uses a great quote:
statistics say, 99% of statistics can be made to say what you want, 50% of the time.
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Old 01-10-2008, 14:25   #56
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I'll give you 10/10 for persistency Gideon, credebility regarding weights and sailing performance will score a lot lower.

So now the weight difference between what you posted earlier and this is only around 3 tons?

Hardtop bimini is now 124.6 kg instead of 64 kg.

May I suggest you look at your own spreadsheet posted here:
How the Weight of a FastCat 455 Is Made Up


Your specification for a 455 includes the increased height you mention, see your own website.

Please tell us what figure you post we should believe, as this is confusing me.

Greetings

Alan

I should not bother really since I don't have a million for a boat but I remain inquisitive and confused.

I know which anchor I want................
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Old 01-10-2008, 14:59   #57
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This is pathetic.
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Old 01-10-2008, 17:14   #58
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whats a KG this must be a math thing.
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Old 01-10-2008, 17:26   #59
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Originally Posted by Nordic cat View Post
I'll give you 10/10 for persistency Gideon, credebility regarding weights and sailing performance will score a lot lower.

So now the weight difference between what you posted earlier and this is only around 3 tons?

Hardtop bimini is now 124.6 kg instead of 64 kg.

May I suggest you look at your own spreadsheet posted here:
How the Weight of a FastCat 455 Is Made Up


Your specification for a 455 includes the increased height you mention, see your own website.

Please tell us what figure you post we should believe, as this is confusing me.

Greetings

Alan
Here we go again... the boll is...
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Old 01-10-2008, 18:06   #60
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Clearly, many are disappointed that this is not resolved. I propose the following.
Gideon, post a number you will stand by, and call that the actual weight. No, exceptions, no add on's, no qualifications.
Alan, you post the number that you agreed to. in this wager.
From this, we call the winner. If one of you cries foul, argue about it offine until you agree on something, then feel free to adjust those numbers accordingly. after the fact. I am sure many, including myself, have reviewed the posts that have been made, and have come up with what each feels was the agreed upon wager, however, it is the two of you who have to agree how much the boat was proposed to weigh, and how much it actually weighs.
Then again, Gideon, I can be bribed. Maybe you need someone to do a VERY thorough product evaluation. Say, maybe 5 years Just send the next build over to me, and not only will I give you a very thorough review, but I would be happy to call you the winner of this wager. Keep in mind, I would need some operating capitol to do a really accurate review
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