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Old 22-07-2017, 14:10   #16
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

Just put your wife in the dinghy and let her and the dinghy help you make difficult turns...Works great on my 55 ft monohull when I have to reverse into docks.

Which incidentally is the only time she allows me to drive the boat...
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Old 22-07-2017, 14:21   #17
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

A back in every time. There are a few things....
  1. Practice. Don't just get in and be glad you did. Pull out and do it again, no focusing on docking some much as understanding how she responded.
  2. Don't be timid. When it is blowing you have to use the throttle with some authority.
  3. Plan. Always use the wind to your advantage. Perhaps approach the slip from the other side. Never think or it as a hindrance, think of it as another thrust vector against which you can push with your engines.
  4. Always have an escape plan. If she is just not going in, pull out and start over. Never try to save a bad approach. Docking in a breeze is a dynamic, moving thing, and if you are sliding the wrong way it is smarter to start fresh. Even after 25 years of sailing cats, I occasionally let my mind wonder and make a bad approach. I just start over before it gets bad, no problem.
  5. Learning takes time. I bet a few days of focused practice will accomplish more, faster, than buying a thruster. Study her, like you studied books in school.
The idea of adding weight or drag to a cat is counter to buying a cat.
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Old 22-07-2017, 15:14   #18
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

Ive run a lot of Lagoon 40 - 50'...never felt the need for a bow thruster. My suggestion is to first spend some time building twin engine experience. Hire a good instructor to coach you (note: not all good boat handlers are good instructors too). Those skills will serve you well whether you choose to install a thruster or not.

After building stronger skills you may well decide you dont need one.

Ive never encountered a cat with bow thrusters. Not that it cant be done, but it is rare.
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Old 22-07-2017, 15:27   #19
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

Quote:
Originally Posted by thinwater View Post
A back in every time. There are a few things....
  1. Practice. Don't just get in and be glad you did. Pull out and do it again, no focusing on docking some much as understanding how she responded.
  2. Don't be timid. When it is blowing you have to use the throttle with some authority.
  3. Plan. Always use the wind to your advantage. Perhaps approach the slip from the other side. Never think or it as a hindrance, think of it as another thrust vector against which you can push with your engines.
  4. Always have an escape plan. If she is just not going in, pull out and start over. Never try to save a bad approach. Docking in a breeze is a dynamic, moving thing, and if you are sliding the wrong way it is smarter to start fresh. Even after 25 years of sailing cats, I occasionally let my mind wonder and make a bad approach. I just start over before it gets bad, no problem.
  5. Learning takes time. I bet a few days of focused practice will accomplish more, faster, than buying a thruster. Study her, like you studied books in school.
The idea of adding weight or drag to a cat is counter to buying a cat.
This is very good advise.

For a dormant 9 year old thread, it got a lot of responses in a short time.

I have seen quite a few cat's with bow thrusters. A Catana 50 had hydraulic drop down thrusters. - very cool but must have weighted quite a bit and there were 3 mechanic's working on them for two days when I launched Palarran.

IMO, prop wash is way underutilized with Catamarans. The regular advise of "center the wheel and use the motors" is great, but a master pilot utilizing the rudders can make any difficult docking maneuver a work of art. I've seen it but am not there fully yet.
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Old 22-07-2017, 16:07   #20
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

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..
IMO, prop wash is way underutilized with Catamarans. The regular advise of "center the wheel and use the motors" is great, but a master pilot utilizing the rudders can make any difficult docking maneuver a work of art. I've seen it but am not there fully yet.
+1. Prop wash can be used quite effectively on cats too (as can spring lines). Except of course on cats with rudders in front of the props...like the 440 and 500. [emoji16]
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Old 23-07-2017, 06:40   #21
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

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+1. Prop wash can be used quite effectively on cats too (as can spring lines). Except of course on cats with rudders in front of the props...like the 440 and 500. [emoji16]
Hmm, the 440 and 500 don't have a reverse gear?
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Old 23-07-2017, 06:49   #22
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

^^ And outboard-powered cats (the props are not on the keel line).

Even so, the rudders can be used, though it gets a little complicated. I do use the rudders for the initial turn, and then center them. When the wind is blowing, this makes the turn quicker and more dependable.
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Old 23-07-2017, 07:00   #23
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

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Hmm, the 440 and 500 don't have a reverse gear?
They do of course...but you better hold on tight to the wheel as the reverse flow over the rudder tends to slam it over to one side (like backing on monos, but very strong due to position of prop). On a 500 I run the wheel lock cant hold it...requiring some added muscle to keep the helm straight...a PITA when doing lots of close quarters maneuvering. Having a crew member hold the helm helps. Trying to use reverse prop wash with that behavior would be challenging.
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Old 23-07-2017, 07:07   #24
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

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They do of course...but you better hold on tight to the wheel as the reverse flow over the rudder tends to slam it over to one side (like backing on monos, but very strong due to position of prop). On a 500 I run the wheel lock cant hold it...requiring some added muscle to keep the helm straight...a PITA when doing lots of close quarters maneuvering. Having a crew member hold the helm helps. Trying to use reverse prop wash with that behavior would be challenging.
Agree.....but the OP was backing into a slip, hence a spade rudder backing presents the same challenge.
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Old 23-07-2017, 15:13   #25
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

Cats don't need the bow thruster, except if one engine is down and you don't have a dagger boards..
We have installed many of them, various brands on monos but just one on Outremer 51. The only other one I have seen on a cat was on a 62 ft Gunboat.
If you still want to install one; the tunnel types creates a lot of cavitaion and loss of speed. Others are certainly better as a hydrodynamic drag a but if you happen to pick any line or whatsoever on it, you need to haul out the boat..


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Old 24-07-2017, 10:34   #26
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

I agree that a bow thruster is superfluous on a cat. That said, if you really are committed to the idea, I second the electric outboard concept that you can lock in place when needed and can be stowed away when not in use.
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Old 24-07-2017, 11:37   #27
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

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jenko,

I think the common wisdom is that cats don't need bow thrusters as the widely-spaced engines give you the same manoeuvrability. If it's an absolute need for you, I wonder if you could fit a swing-down electric drive (like Fastcat's GreenMotion) forward? Just a thought.

Kevin
But some cats only have one engine and a crappy drive leg. Others have twin outboard spaced too close to together. Once the bow goes you've generally had it.

I saw some pictures in the Prout owners group on Facebook of a nice bow thruster on an Escale I think it was.
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Old 25-07-2017, 00:56   #28
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Re: BOW THRUSTERS FOR MY CAT

We fitted a bow thruster to our old HT27 since it had a single outboard that didn't steer. No noticable difference in sailing and made berthing way less stressful. We were berthed in a marina. It was impossible to get the bow through the wind sometimes but the thruster made the difference, so they do have their place in the right situation.
Now have a cat with twin engines but learnt a lot from the HT !
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