Blue Water Cruising a Small Catamaran

[salticrak]

She's apples mate.

[Redreuben]

Mr Factor,
I too am an admirer of the Liahona, unfortunately the plans are not available as per his Catamarans. Any ideas ? Anyone ?

[rivonia]

Originally Posted by ausaviator

Hi Factor et al, it was not my intention to upset you. The last couple of days I've been having trouble with a situation at home plus a lack of sleep from our young child and a child on the way and I was indirectly venting by making my opinion heard and getting frustrated when it felt that others were disagreeing with me. I enjoy posting and entering in conversations here but I believe I over stepped the line by pressing my thoughts. Again my apologies if I pushed too hard, it not intentional and I never meant to upset anyone.

Brave heart! Humble pie. Well done and hope all is well with your family.

Peter

[Factor]

Originally Posted by Redreuben

Mr Factor,
I too am an admirer of the Liahona, unfortunately the plans are not available as per his Catamarans. Any ideas ? Anyone ?

Perhaps try Phil Day at Multihull Yacht Sales Australia. Phil probably doesn't have them but if anyone knows where they are its probably him.

[ausaviator]

Brave heart! Humble pie. Well done and hope all is well with your family.

Thank you Peter. I've been having a bad experience with a tradesman of all people. Amazing what it can do to your life. It culminated in me having to call the Police to have him removed from my house whilst brandishing a steel spirit level. My blood pressure is probably 160 on 100.

[rabbi]

Originally Posted by Cotemar

A 36 foot cat is a starting point. Anything smaller and you will not be able to get insurance.

This comment seems based on your own experience, and local to your country.

Insurance policies in the US have not necessarily much in common with insurance policies in other countries. The terms can be vastly different.

No problem getting small boat insurance here, just like for a bigger boat.

[tomfl]

Originally Posted by belizesailor

As others have posted size has little to do w seaworthyness...whether multi or mono.

SNIP

Big fast ULDB multis now set amazing records but, despite their impressive size they are actually more likely to capsize than my little Wildcat 35 for example

SNIP

Agree with this.

A few of other thoughts

The reason race boats are more prone to capsize is for lack of a better term they are over canvassed. They also tend to be what I call tender or twitchy or overly responsive to the helm. Not to say some folks think what I will called production cruising cats can't be over canvassed and twitchy.

The way a boat handles is sorta a given for any boat, but different folks may have different ideas about how over, or under, canvassed it is or how twitchy it feels to them.

To some extent how bad it does things like hobby horsing or slapping is also something of a subjective issue. A lot of what I will call monohull sailors tend to be more sensitive to slapping than folks who have experience sailing multihulls.

One thing I have learned is that a small change in the point of sail can result in a big change in how much slapping a cat suffers. Another thing I learned is that even a boat like my Seawind has a lot of options for sail trim that can make a difference in how it feels in a seaway.

I mostly single hand and one of the first things I do is set a course and then trim the sails so the boat almost self steers. Often times I can get to the point where a single finger on the wheel and tiny adjustments, of say less than an inch or two, are all that is needed to keep the boat on course.

But sometimes I have to play around with the traveler placement, working jib sheet adjustment, and screecher adjustment. Maybe even something like just having the screecher up with a single reef in the main. The nice thing for me is I can leave my ball in Boot Key and sail in Hawks Channel in 10-15 kn winds knowing the weather forecast and that TowUS is close by on CH16.

What ever boat you wind up getting keep in mind that learning how the boat handles with different sail combinations in different wind and sea conditions is best done under the best conditions possible.

It is much better to do your first reef in 2 foot seas and 12 kn winds than in 15 foot seas and 50 kn winds.


Another thing to remember is you need to feel very comfortable using the autopilot and GPS. The book for my GPS is at least 3/4 of an inch thick and I am still learning how to use it. The autopilot is easier to operate but it is important to get a feel for how well an autopilot works, or does not work, in different seaways.

As for the choice of boats almost everyone agrees boats as a rule are much more capable than the people on them.

[Cotemar]

Originally Posted by rabbi

This comment seems based on your own experience, and local to your country.

Insurance policies in the US have not necessarily much in common with insurance policies in other countries. The terms can be vastly different.

No problem getting small boat insurance here, just like for a bigger boat.

The insurance problem arose when I wanted to bring my new FP Mahe 36 from France to Newport Rhode Island, USA. All five insurance companies told me that this is the smallest boat they will give insurance on to make an Atlantic crossing.
As it was the insurance was $6000 usd just for the crossing.
My normal yearly insurance is just $1000 usd

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by belizesailor

As others have posted size has little to do w seaworthyness...whether multi or mono. (...)

As others have posted, it does, and heaps.

b.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

As others have posted, it does, and heaps.

b.

Although these statements appear to be diametrically opppsed they are not. There are in fact many small seaworthy vessels..Jester and Serafin come to mind as notable examples. And, yes increased LOA and displacement can make for a more sea kindly vessel.

However, it is design and build quality, not size alone, which determines the sea worthiness of a given vessel (whether multi or mono).

[boatman61]

Love these Threads about small... saw this a while back and had a look... decided not to say anything after the 20 odd posts saying 36ft was small... I'd been gonna say a Tiki 26...
Silly Boatman...

[salticrak]

I have skin in this game, for sure.

[Factor]

Originally Posted by Cotemar

The insurance problem arose when I wanted to bring my new FP Mahe 36 from France to Newport Rhode Island, USA. All five insurance companies told me that this is the smallest boat they will give insurance on to make an Atlantic crossing.
As it was the insurance was $6000 usd just for the crossing.
My normal yearly insurance is just $1000 usd

I would always suggest at least getting a quote from Pantaneius. They will - as I have said - insure boats smaller than 36 - along with many other companies, and their prices have been very competitive.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by Factor

I would always suggest at least getting a quote from Pantaneius. They will - as I have said - insure boats smaller than 36 - along with many other companies, and their prices have been very competitive.

Then this must depend on where you are.

Here, in the EU, I asked P to insure our boat prior to our first crossing. This is what happened:

- P was unwilling, claiming our boat too small,
- P suggested that we quote a higher than actual value of our boat (by 100% ! ),
- based on this higher and not correct value, P offered us the highest quote of all companies that we shortlisted.

My experience with P from other people's boats is that it is the most expensive insurance. I must admit they do pay up when an accident happens.

b.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by Factor

I would always suggest at least getting a quote from Pantaneius. They will - as I have said - insure boats smaller than 36 - along with many other companies, and their prices have been very competitive.

Apparently they used to offer some excellent rates and covered smaller, lower value boats, but that policy has apparently changed. They would not cover my W35 last season.