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Old 17-03-2014, 16:58   #1186
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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Originally Posted by atoll View Post
portugal and its islands have a rugged coastline,exposed to the atlantic,consequently ALL vessell movements require reporting and clearance from the marine police.

What , no they don't


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Old 17-03-2014, 17:03   #1187
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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Originally Posted by atoll View Post
just got this from jp about the fine he got.,

"Good evening Alex , I sure will send a bottle wan off this days after I
sorted out Phil's problems .( i asked him to send me a bottel of aguadente in return for all the phone calls i made)

And yes I have some problems with M Police because I was so honest to tell
dem watt I was going to do , and then the port captain ask me to com over to
is office , were I was told that I toot a sailboat as no conditions to tow a
boat !!!!

so I wanted to organize a inspection the following off my boat ,
witch a seed why not now , but he mend a official inspection witch had to
pay for , so I sad how match , and he sad something around 20 E I ting , but
when day started to make some phone calls to find out et turn out to be 150
E wish I toot was a bit over the top ,

so I just walked out off the office ,pist off wasting so match time there for noting

.So when we came in day were
waiting for me to tell me that I ignored the order of the Port Commandant
not to live for the rescue and towing the boat .

In de mean time there rescue
boat was out all day looking for Phil ( spending 2000 l of fuel !!!! )
not organised , so day are a bet hurt in there ego I think .

We rescued,salveched and tow already a dozen boats in before , without any problems ,but this Port Captain is new and want to sow off are watt I don't now .

I can comfurm that without the tracker its a deverend madder if you looking
for a boat in the nord Atlantic as you now ,, from all the things we did
here all ready there was wan case we cout not find the boat .

So you can post this comment on the forum if you want .

Best regards JP & Judi
Wow, I love this guy. I could just about here his voice, the way he typed it up. Also a very honest and interesting view into the workings of a local port captain who is new in his job and trying to assert some control. Sorry JP got caught up in it all.
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:04   #1188
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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well ann i hate to disagree but the portugese coast guard were taking it seriously apparently,and all the info they had was what phil had relayed to them via his securite.



read JP' message

In my experience , many European coastguards would react to that Securitate message and begin a search. They tend to act as early as possible. The RNLI would be no different.

JP should definitely have informed the local cg radio to inform them that he was attending a rescue , even out of courtesy.

Lessons learned an all that

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Old 17-03-2014, 17:07   #1189
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
He had electricity during the day from the solar panels.
Sounds as if the problem could be is solar panel and inadequate amount of solar panels.

750-1kw should be standard on cats thesedays and certainly helps out batteries and autopilot.

An owner issue not of Boatmans making.
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:14   #1190
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

I once lost all electrical power at 0200 120 miles off of Charleston. I did securite calls every 30 minutes while I was doing the repairs. It was mostly because I had no lights and no radar and container ships kept coming over the horizon. All I had was a hand held radio and GPS. I considered the calls informational so the big boys didn't run me down. I had no idea that in some parts of the world that would trigger a search. I like it when I learn something new.
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:17   #1191
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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Sounds as if the problem could be is soar panel and inadequate amount of soar panels.

750-1kw should be standard and certainly helps out batteries and autopilot.

An owner issue not of Boatmans making.
So, explain how a boat that looks like a solar farm would help with batteries that have died (i.e. won't hold a charge)?

No matter how many solars panels you cover your boat with, none of them work at night.
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:19   #1192
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
In my experience , many European coastguards would react to that Securitate message and begin a search. They tend to act as early as possible. The RNLI would be no different.

JP should definitely have informed the local cg radio to inform them that he was attending a rescue , even out of courtesy.

Lessons learned an all that

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he did inform the authoraties beforehand as he stated in his message.

and it was from the capitanirie in horta that i originally found out about the securite in the first place,they were already searching for him on the 13th! apparently ,unknow to us mere mortals on CF.

and in reagards to reporting the rules are more relaxed in the algarve,but i have had a bollocking twice from the portugese for not reporting in in less visited places,one of those times was in horta!
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:24   #1193
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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he did inform the authoraties beforehand as he stated in his message.



and it was from the capitanirie in horta that i originally found out about the securite in the first place,they were already searching for him on the 13th! apparently ,unknow to us mere mortals on CF.



and in reagards to reporting the rules are more relaxed in the algarve,but i have had a bollocking twice from the portugese for not reporting in in less visited places,one of those times was in horta!

If he informed the authorities did they not tell him they were searching. If he informed them appropriately they have no grounds to fine him.

I do find in Portugal, that the rules can get applied rather precisely. It's not my favourite place to visit as a result.

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Old 17-03-2014, 17:30   #1194
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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Originally Posted by Captain Bill View Post
I once lost all electrical power at 0200 120 miles off of Charleston. I did securite calls every 30 minutes while I was doing the repairs. It was mostly because I had no lights and no radar and container ships kept coming over the horizon. All I had was a hand held radio and GPS. I considered the calls informational so the big boys didn't run me down. I had no idea that in some parts of the world that would trigger a search. I like it when I learn something new.
That's how I would have played it. Around these parts, Securite is used when a large vessel is going through a tight passage to warn others coming the other way. It has nothing to do with needing rescue! I assumed Boatie's reason for it was just that he had no lights at night and didn't want to be run down.

Otherwise, you put out a pan-pan or a mayday. Even a pan-pan is just a warning that things are starting to go south and you might need some non-emergency advice/assistance. I wouldn't necessarily expect a rescue to be launched even for a pan-pan.
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:30   #1195
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Atlantic Delivery

As an aside I do find it strange Phil couldn't raise a main given the reasonably calm weather. There must be more to it then that.

Another thing makes me question the value of tracker devices, that also don't have some form of bi directional comms. Far too easy for those concerned ashore to read more into things then might be the case. I mean had he a sat phone all would have been clear.

When I did deliveries , after my first " went middling for 4 days " the wife forced me to buy a second hand iridium. Brilliant for keeping those ashore informed. All delivery skippers should have then , and I know many that do

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Old 17-03-2014, 17:30   #1196
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

<< If he informed the authorities did they not tell him they were searching. If he informed them appropriately they have no grounds to fine him. >>

Cripes, Dave, read/decode what J.P wrote, willya

Your first sentence is missing some words, in any case, so it's indecipherable, and you don't have J-P's excuse...

There's little enough 'signal' as it is, without you adding your weight to those amplifying the noise.

And yes, I too am agog to hear details of what was stopping the main from going up
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:33   #1197
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

Ann its easy to say we all got worked up and wasted the owners money but you conveniently leave out that atoll informed the owner that things weren't right and the OWNER decided to take action on his investment not all of C.F. Even more to point lets say we (more specifically Atoll because hes the actual hero here) did nothing absolutely nothing not a Damn thing and the weather turned and they got into trouble and had to set off their epirb. At that point lives would be risked rescuing them in rough weather and the owner may have lost his boat and phils life could have been at risk. In this case they got an easy tow of a mostly disabled vessel safely and anti climatically back into harbor. And if something bad had happened and nobody did anything we including you would be saying......oh we should have tried to help why didn't anybody help? Now its too late. More could have been done.

I said it before and I'll say it again Atoll you did a phenomenal job and made the best move possible. I commend your forethought, ability, and willingness to take action. I hope someone like you is there to make the difficult call should I ever possibly need help.
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:34   #1198
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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Originally Posted by atoll View Post
he did inform the authoraties beforehand as he stated in his message.

and it was from the capitanirie in horta that i originally found out about the securite in the first place,they were already searching for him on the 13th! apparently ,unknow to us mere mortals on CF.

and in reagards to reporting the rules are more relaxed in the algarve,but i have had a bollocking twice from the portugese for not reporting in in less visited places,one of those times was in horta!
And: 'Nobody Expects the Portugese Inquisition'...
The Spanish Inquisition (Monty Python) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Devolving into absurdity...

And that 'ol moon was just showing behind Pico a bit ago, but is dark now, weather coming (clouds earlier were looking thick)?
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:41   #1199
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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So, explain how a boat that looks like a solar farm would help with batteries that have died (i.e. won't hold a charge)?

No matter how many solars panels you cover your boat with, none of them work at night.
Agreed that stuffed batteries seem to be a fair bit of the problem but Boaty did indicate he was getting some juice (only) from solar. Strikes me that solar was his only method of charging batteries and I note than many similar vessels from that USA/Europe with minimal solar. From my experience so far on French built catamarans they all need more solar than is generally supplied from the factory. Don't you agree.

For a large cat that amount of solar is hardly considered a solar farm
(more like standard). There are heaps of similar cats these days with that amount.

Electric issues strike me as one of the biggest issues for cruisers and as I follow CF the more this issue is reinforced. One of if not the best and cheapest sources of this is solar.

Boaty was coping well with the issues he had and in no way was my observation a criticism of him.
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Old 17-03-2014, 17:50   #1200
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Re: Atlantic Delivery

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That's how I would have played it. Around these parts, Securite is used when a large vessel is going through a tight passage to warn others coming the other way. It has nothing to do with needing rescue! I assumed Boatie's reason for it was just that he had no lights at night and didn't want to be run down.

Otherwise, you put out a pan-pan or a mayday. Even a pan-pan is just a warning that things are starting to go south and you might need some non-emergency advice/assistance. I wouldn't necessarily expect a rescue to be launched even for a pan-pan.

Around these parts, it's entirely at the behest of the maritime authorities and even the local lifeboat whether they should launch or not. Often authorities will launch simply because they feel they should react early. Many tines the lifeboats have give out just to standby and aid a vessel home.

You do not decide what the reaction is , that's the authorities job. Lifeboats would prefer to launch for 10 underwhelming reasons then be not there for one that turns out to need them.

Hence even if you just called up to appraise them of your issues, and not issue a dstress, urgency or safety call, they still will usually launch.

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