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Old 18-06-2014, 16:59   #1
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Asking too Much?

I have been following 10 older Catamarans (Britsh designs) that have been for sale in the U.K. and Europe for 11 months now. Some in excellent condition and some seaworthy but in need of TLC.

None have sold. All things being equal, there is no reason for at least four of them to be hanging around except.......... I believe the price asked is now unreasonable for older models. The best of all of them is now on sale at @50K sterling. ($84K) and, in my opinion, it should be 10K sterling less. None of them is less than 20 years old.

I offered my cash price on one 6 months ago and the owner was offended!. I said to him to replace one engine and replace the sails and I would give him his full asking price. He asked for one day to price up the items and then came back to me shouting that I was trying to rob him! LOL What is wrong with people. He still has the boat and is getting sicker and sicker and the boat is not getting any easier to sell with the lack of maintenance.

Im not looking to steal from someone, but there has to come a time for people to wake up and realise that the prices they are asking are unrealistic. If it was just one or two vessels sticking, then I would accept it was me, but 10?
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Old 18-06-2014, 17:06   #2
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Re: Asking too much?

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Originally Posted by weavis View Post
I have been following 10 older Catamarans (Britsh designs) that have been for sale in the U.K. and Europe for 11 months now. Some in excellent condition and some seaworthy but in need of TLC.

None have sold. All things being equal, there is no reason for at least four of them to be hanging around except.......... I believe the price asked is now unreasonable for older models. The best of all of them is now on sale at @50K sterling. ($84K) and, in my opinion, it should be 10K sterling less. None of them is less than 20 years old.

I offered my cash price on one 6 months ago and the owner was offended!. I said to him to replace one engine and replace the sails and I would give him his full asking price. He asked for one day to price up the items and then came back to me shouting that I was trying to rob him! LOL What is wrong with people. He still has the boat and is getting sicker and sicker and the boat is not getting any easier to sell with the lack of maintenance.

Im not looking to steal from someone, but there has to come a time for people to wake up and realise that the prices they are asking are unrealistic. If it was just one or two vessels sticking, then I would accept it was me, but 10?

Bear in mind you are dealing in a region emerging from a recession. Owners have stuck it out thus far. Hence they believe the " lift" is around the corner. Hope is a very powerful human emotion

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Old 18-06-2014, 17:16   #3
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Re: Asking too much?

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Im not looking to steal from someone, but there has to come a time for people to wake up and realise that the prices they are asking are unrealistic. If it was just one or two vessels sticking, then I would accept it was me, but 10?
I noticed the same thing in the U.S. market.

I honestly think it's because of the housing bubble, which put people's expectations of prices at a certain level that is difficult to let go of. For a while, the housing market buoyed other luxury items.

I think some people are getting more realistic now, and markets are calming a bit. If you make an offer now, somebody might accept it. Then again, if you're hooked on a particular boat, there might be a reason why. In boats, there is a lot of subjective value.
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Old 18-06-2014, 17:21   #4
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Re: Asking too Much?

I don't believe that there is any offence in someone asking too much for a vessel or someone offering too little. "No, Thanks" is quick and easy.
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Old 18-06-2014, 17:29   #5
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Re: Asking too much?

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Originally Posted by letsgetsailing3 View Post
I noticed the same thing in the U.S. market.

I honestly think it's because of the housing bubble, which put people's expectations of prices at a certain level that is difficult to let go of. For a while, the housing market buoyed other luxury items.

I think some people are getting more realistic now, and markets are calming a bit. If you make an offer now, somebody might accept it. Then again, if you're hooked on a particular boat, there might be a reason why. In boats, there is a lot of subjective value.
Subjective value is not working for these people.
I went back and looked at the vessel I made an offer on as quoted above, and cannot in all conscience make a cheaper offer now....it has deteriorated enough for me to no longer be interested except at a low price as i would need to spend another 3K sterling to bring it up to where I could have had it a while back. I konw its a Catamaran and Catamarans cost more, but come on people... its a 20-30 year old vessel and they are still wanting top price.

I did however note that for a little more, some older F.P.s are entering my peripheral vision at affordable costs and have a lot better potential and value in them. I might just have to spend a little more than I want in order to get a better value vessel.
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Old 18-06-2014, 17:33   #6
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Re: Asking too much?

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Bear in mind you are dealing in a region emerging from a recession. Owners have stuck it out thus far. Hence they believe the " lift" is around the corner. Hope is a very powerful human emotion

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That's my take on things.

When I was boat shopping (2007) there was a 30 footer here well neglected. Asking 30k I offered 10k after doing a spreadsheet pricing all the stuff needing fixing.

Flat refusal. The boat has deteriorated a lot more and just sold for $4k.

Boats are an emotional item.
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Old 18-06-2014, 18:19   #7
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Re: Asking too much?

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Originally Posted by letsgetsailing3 View Post
I noticed the same thing in the U.S. market.

I honestly think it's because of the housing bubble, which put people's expectations of prices at a certain level that is difficult to let go of. For a while, the housing market buoyed other luxury items.
.

I think you are correct, My boat the PO paid 30K more than I bought it from him for, he kept it three years and used it very little, but as he was a check book sailor put several thousand into it.
Was for sale for quite awhile, I made an offer 15% below his asking and slightly below other offers he had had awhile back and he took it.
I think the reality of what the boat was costing him to sit plus he had finally realized he had over paid finally set in.
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Old 18-06-2014, 20:15   #8
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Re: Asking too Much?

Weavis,

It's funny how sellers respond to low offers. I made a pretty low offer on my current boat about 2 1/2 years ago, and offended the seller so much that he would not counter offer. Really? So I looked at 30 more boats and realized that I wanted the one that I was shut down on. So I had to make nice with the seller, but things really never returned to "normal". I even told the guy,"look, its only business, I'm not trying to insult you or your boat".

After a long, contentious sale, Odyssey was mine. The seller even had the nerve to tell me he "felt sick" for selling her. Even though she had been rotting away in her slip for over 7 years. She has now sailed over 1500 miles to be stationed in La Paz, Mexico, where she is having the time of her life! I am going to send the former owner a bunch of pictures of Odyssey in action around Mexico. Maybe he will sleep better...

Just my two cents, your mileage may vary.

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Old 18-06-2014, 20:34   #9
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Re: Asking too Much?

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I am going to send the former owner a bunch of pictures of Odyssey in action around Mexico. Maybe he will sleep better...

Just my two cents, your mileage may vary.

Cheers, Bill
Nah - Sounds like Schadenfreude and he will likely get sick all over again and throw up thinking about his own personal "woulda, coulda, shoulda."

Unless you are a bit sadistic and still want to annoy him. Then I'd say go for it -
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Old 18-06-2014, 21:02   #10
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Re: Asking too Much?

I do take offense at low-ball offers. When they are way below the asking price, like 1/3, you are essentially implying that the seller might be desperate to sell it so cheap,
or is a fool for asking 3 times more than it is worth. Either one is insulting.
It is really just wasting my time to offer 1/3 the price, or worse when people try to justify it explaining to me why I'm a fool.

If their asking price is out-of-line, just wait for them to lower their asking price, they will eventually if they really want to sell it, otherwise they don't really want to sell it,
and realize that once the price is low, there are MANY that will buy it, not just you!
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Old 18-06-2014, 21:22   #11
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Re: Asking too Much?

We offered 110 on a boat listed at 129 a 36' cat. The owner said no countered at 117 we said no. Boat sold for 85k 8 months later. Another 38 mono. Few years ago we offered 90 on the owner was firm at @114. Sold for 79 and a broker got a cut which he wouldn't thru our orig offer. We've all seen many people die and their family was left selling for lots less due to their emotional tie. There's a guy in fl who's been at 179k on a 1978 44 mono for the last 6 years...

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Old 18-06-2014, 22:17   #12
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Re: Asking too Much?

Some times Momma say's Sell that thing !! and he say's I'm trying honey I just dropped the price 500 bucks !!!
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Old 18-06-2014, 23:18   #13
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Re: Asking too Much?

Its funny this post came up.. I was just discussing this with a coworker..

I have been watching Cats for a while and I have to agree that there are a ton that are overpriced. I know one Privilege 39 that is 25K overpriced.. Its been on the market for over 6 months and has had 1 offer fall through, they still didn't drop their price.

Personally when I'm selling something, I set firm dates where I drop the price by a set amount. When the date comes, I drop the price, when the next date comes I drop the price, ect.. I do this for everything, including the 2 houses I have sold. I would rather sell it, then have the stress of trying to sell it, if I get less than I wanted, oh well.

One thing people don't realize, your boat is not worth that you want or need to get out of it.. Its worth what the market will pay at that particular moment. If its not selling, then its too high for that particular market at that moment.
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Old 18-06-2014, 23:55   #14
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Re: Asking too Much?

Don't waste any more time... Buy a Sunreef.
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Old 19-06-2014, 01:17   #15
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Re: Asking too Much?

A friend of mine in Honolulu owned a 50' sailboat, I never saw it, so I have no idea what it was.

One day, he saw a 65' boat for sale a couple of rows over that really caught his eye. It was Italian made, sleek design, but laid up a little heavier for trans Atlantic crossing. It was owned by a newlywed Swiss couple. The husband's parents died suddenly while the couple were circumnavigating, so they locked up the boat, hired a broker and left for Switzerland to take over the family's bank.

My buddy looked the boat over, it looked in good shape, but there were no sails visible on it. The broker told him to make an offer, so he did - $70K. The broker told him the boat was $165K new, and was less than 2 yrs old, so forget it. The broker never really tried to sell it, and it sat, neglected for the next 2 yrs. The teak weathered, lots of growth below the waterline, etc. The broker finally called teh couple and asked them what they wanted him to do, and they were shocked the boat was still sitting there. They told him to take any offer, no matter how low, just sell it.

The only person who ever looked at it was my buddy. The broker called him back and told him they were very interested in selling, he could have it for $70K. He went over and looked at the current condition, and his counter offer was $60K, thinking he was going to have to replace all of the sails. The broker immediately accepted his offer, and he ended up with 2 boats in the same yacht club. When he got the keys to thte boat, he was shocked to find out that there were 2 complete sets of sails down below, one set was used to get from Europe to Hawaii, the 2nd set was brand new, spares. He redid the teak, I rewired the boat for 110v, added a larger battery bank, plus an inverter/charger system and an integrated sound system for the entire boat.

Sometimes, it pays to be in the right place at the right time.

Right now there's a good deal on a 56' Marquises. "ANAHO" 56'
1993 FOUNTAINE PAJOT $275,000.
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