AMI Renaissance 320 catamaran

[Epiphany]

I am considering purchasing an AMI Renaissance 320 catamaran. They are not the prettiest boat ever launched but my wife likes the layout so that improves the appearance. (If mamas happy...) I have found out that there were only about 12 built and that it appears they are a "rip off" of a Richard Wood design. I would like to know how well they were built. How they sail and any other info out there about them.

[snort]

I only know about the one in San Diego, which sank either two or three times.

[Boatguy30]

There happens to be one for sale by a pretty nice guy that has owned the boat only a short time. I am building a Woods design and there were 2 AMIs for sale in St Augustine when I was deciding whether to build or buy. both of these AMI have since been back on the market.

they are said to sail OK, but Richard will be the first to tell you this overall weight of them is FAR beyond what the hulls were designed to carry. I have no idea bout quality of build, but quality of design is extremely marginal with little margin for cuising payload. You will note that the knuckle on the hull is almost at the waterline in an AMI but is intended by Richard to be well above say 4-6" when FULLY loaded.

cheers,
Jeff Goff

[Epiphany]

Originally Posted by snort

I only know about the one in San Diego, which sank either two or three times.

Do you know why it sank?

[Epiphany]

Originally Posted by Boatguy30

There happens to be one for sale by a pretty nice guy that has owned the boat only a short time. I am building a Woods design and there were 2 AMIs for sale in St Augustine when I was deciding whether to build or buy. both of these AMI have since been back on the market.

they are said to sail OK, but Richard will be the first to tell you this overall weight of them is FAR beyond what the hulls were designed to carry. I have no idea bout quality of build, but quality of design is extremely marginal with little margin for cuising payload. You will note that the knuckle on the hull is almost at the waterline in an AMI but is intended by Richard to be well above say 4-6" when FULLY loaded.

cheers,
Jeff Goff

I had noticed the knuckle. I assume it is intended to increase the interior volume above the waterline while reducing the wetted surface. If so it seems ahead of its time on a 20 year old design. Having it so close to the waterline does seem a bit problematic. I assume Woods designed to hulls to carry a simpler and lighter super structure. I am curious as to how you boat turned out. Can you post a photo?

[Dulcesuenos]

Just curious why you would say quality of design is marginal for cruising pay load? Of course woods is rough on most of his competitors in terms of his reviews, and im sure hes miffed they didnt use him to design their boats but he did sell the molds so he should get over it. Ours is fully loaded with most everything we own and the knuckle is above the WL. She performs just fine, of course any cat will sail faster unloaded than loaded, we wernt sure what to expect on our Berries trip so we had both water tanks and diesel tanks full, 4 full jerry jugs and 4 jugs of extra. Water, diesel total of 76 gal , water total of almost 90, 4 dive tanks, two sets of scuba gear, tons of ground tackle a dinghy in the davits generator, icemaker, more fishing gear and a months worth of food in two fridge/ freezers and 2 coolers, and we still sailed in 6-8 knot range crossing the stream. Very close friends of the original owners found us and chatted for hours about the boat. They cruised together for several years The prior owners used to have it very loaded and they would blow by their friends lagoon 37 after 3-4 hours of the Lagoon having a head start. They used to call her the "pesky mosquito" their words not ours. Not sure how many sub 36' boats are as nice, can handle as much and still have the performance. These Ami's were very well built and incredibly strong. Only reason we are selling is we want to expand our cruising grounds and their will be 3 of us, and the wife wants to go big! I have a great Cruising world article on the AMIs but it is PDF form and not sure how to post.
To add to this, the picture at Woods site shows one of his boats with the same knuckle on the hull and even though its on the windward side its just above the water maybe 3-4" on only half his boat. And im sure its not loaded at all. ours would at a minimum be equal to that or better.

[Boatguy30]

I'm still working on my boat, will be launched sometime in 2014. check my blog.

I'm somewhat biased in my comments (as is an owner/seller) since I dismissed all production designs in the size I wanted due to inadequate payload and had
Richard finish up this custom concept for me. The gear being related in the previous post is really an unsafe load for these hulls.

Richard designs his boat to have the lower edge of the transoms an inch or two clear of the water at max load. I just had a glance at some Eclipse drawing an you're at about 6" of knuckle clearance at load waterline.

I don't think that Richard ever owned a set of Sagitta molds, but I could be wrong. If you are serious about the boat, you should really contact him and pay him for a consultation.

anyhow, not looking to ruffle any feathers but you are wise to seek out much advise on this very unknown design.

[snort]

Originally Posted by Epiphany

Do you know why it sank?

I think that particular boat just really liked the bottom of the slip.
On at least one occasion, I believe a seacock was left open.

[Dulcesuenos]

Interesting how in the picture in the link near the bottom of the page showing an obvious waterline / "scumline " the line is closer to the "knuckle" on the eclipse pictured there than on our boat by a good 2-3"s.
http://www.sailingcatamarans.com/eclipse.htm

Ours must be special, lol

[Dulcesuenos]

Here is an actual review of these boats in a CruisingWorld article

http://freepdfhosting.com/ab7de12dc0.pdf

[Boatguy30]

Here is a link to the other one that "sold" on EBay, but now seems to be listed with a broker. wonder if it actually changed hands or not?

1995 32ft Renasance Catamaran in Sailboats | eBay Motors

BTW, I believe the Eclipse in the pics is also the one on the for sale page; looks very heavy with heater, twin diesels, stainless winches.

EBay listing suggests that AMI weighed 10,000 at haul out vs. AMI and Richards designed displacement of about 6500 for the Sagitta hulls. You'd get about 600 lbs per inch of immersion as you get up toward the knuckle so the math is about right for 6" or so above original designed waterlines.

[Dulcesuenos]

Not sure what date that link is from but the winning bid on Aug2 was $75099.00
He didn't sell as i believe it was still below what he wanted.

[Boatguy30]

Who knows the price was Green which means sold on Ebay, maybe he didn't honor the bod or the guy couldn't get the cash.

Anyway, out of courtesy to other owners I will refrain from making any more observations on this thread. I have discussed the history in detail with Richard. I believe the molds are stored near to here.

PM for anyone desiring further info.

[Dulcesuenos]

If we don't sell her well keep her and love her. Boatguy i know your in the "woods" camp it is funny how he "knocks"most other cat designs, not all but many. Even you has heard, thought Prout 37's were good sailors and Woods said it was a terrible sailing boat.
Deans have been all over the world he doesn't like them either along with several others. Our EndeavourCat 30 weighed close to 8900 on the scales. I have no doubt the AmI 320 is a heavier boat than the ec and the eclipse. It is a cruising boat. It has a great sea motion and doesn't bob about like a wooden cork. If Richard believed so strongly in boats he builds whyd he abandon one in a storm only to have it survive...

[Boatguy30]

Not sure on the prout thing, I think they sail pretty poor unless super lightly loaded.

Richard had a number of problems, mostly an undersized sea anchor with a poorly setup bridle. I have never asked him about it, but I think the decision was largely made by his girlfriend, now wife that I believe contributes significantly to there nice lifestyle.

anyhow, nothing wrong with the boat after all. wonder where it is now?