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Old 15-01-2009, 07:53   #1
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alternative to catamaran

Would this be considered an alternative for the mono hull lovers who realize a cat is the future especially when cruising?

-lifting bulb keel for accessing shallow waters / double rudders also
-wide extremely stable hull design
-very stable sailing as result of deep bulb keel and modern design hull
-big open cockpit with access to galley /inside yacht
-easy access to water at stern
-very fast off wind as result design and lifting keel
*fast and pointing high in heavy weather

shoot and let me know your thoughts on this please

Eric.(mono hull lover tending to go the cat way)
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Old 15-01-2009, 09:11   #2
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Broad beam? Is that a third of the length or a half.
Unsinkable? That'll be the tilting, liftable, detachable keel.
Vertical bows? to make sure splashes come over the top to make it seem exciting and dangerous.
Knock off rudders? Where are the spares, Oh you don't run aground ever.
Sun deck? maybe the bows if no-one wants to tack.
Are you serious or just trying to make sure your leaning the right way - Upright!
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Old 15-01-2009, 09:32   #3
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Other than the very shallow keel, its somewhat similar to a modern ocean racer.

Beamy, double rudders, open transom, plum bow.
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Old 15-01-2009, 13:36   #4
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This has a lot of similarities to the new Moody 45. There was supposed to be one at the Annapolis show this year but it was still in Europe. The person in the booth told me that they'd been swamped with people who had come to the show to see it.

I don't particularly love the look of the Moody 45 but it's great to see some "out of the box" design thinking!

One interesting side note, a Yachting World piece on the boat said that Bill Dixon, the designer, had found that the wide stern gave the boat positive stability at 180 degrees. Better righting than a typical monohull (if the glass holds - but that's another thread)

Dixon explains: “As the boat rotates, the aft buoyancy pushes the bow down, turning the boat upright again. We’ve double and trip-checked it and it’s true.”

And while I respect the catamaran fans on this board, I don't think the catamarans are "the future" for cruising. You need to compare equal cost (not length) and two modern designs. Too many posters try to make their case for the cat by comparing a 30 year old 42' monohull design with a brand new 42' cat design.

In the end, people value different qualities in their boat. I love my monohull and have not seen an equal cost cat that meets my needs or desires nearly as well.

Carl
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Old 15-01-2009, 13:45   #5
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Oh yeah. Then there's the PowerSail. A New Zealand built boat that is really "out of the box" thinking: a monhull with lifting keel, water ballast, lifting propeller pods, rudders than pivot to stop stern squat and goes 18 knots under power.

I haven't heard much about it recently. Has anyone ever seen this boat?

POWERSAIL NEW ZEALAND - Innovation, Technology and Passion

Carl
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Old 15-01-2009, 13:53   #6
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As with selecting any boat, there are always tradeoffs. What is or is not an alternative is in the eye of the beholder. For example, your alternative will heel. (I'm surprised no one has mentioned that yet.) For my wife, this would be a deal breaker. If it's not flat, she won't go. For her, there is no alternative.
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Old 15-01-2009, 14:31   #7
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Is it:

Unsinkable?

Beachable?

Twin engined for redundancy?

Offering good privacy like in seperate hulls?

Possible to carry a 12ft dinghy on the davits?

Easy to bring a MOB back on board via the transom steps in bad weather?

and will it cruise comfortable at more than "hull speed"?

Unless it fulfills all of these criteria, then it is missing the stated mark IMO.

When comparing a cat to a mono, then maybe the volume instead of length should be considered, then the price difference lessens, but Yes, cats are more expensive, as they require stronger fittings, rig, sails etc.


The boat at the beginning of the thread, looks quite nice and has some nice features, but these will come at a price that will make a standard
cat seem more reasonable in price.

Alan
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Old 15-01-2009, 15:26   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericvanduyn View Post
Would this be considered an alternative for the mono hull lovers who realize a cat is the future especially when cruising?

-lifting bulb keel for accessing shallow waters / double rudders also
-wide extremely stable hull design
-very stable sailing as result of deep bulb keel and modern design hull
-big open cockpit with access to galley /inside yacht
-easy access to water at stern
-very fast off wind as result design and lifting keel
*fast and pointing high in heavy weather

shoot and let me know your thoughts on this please

Eric.(mono hull lover tending to go the cat way)
Been tried before by Dufour. Not such high performance but very similar concept. Disappeared without trace very quickly. Moody now trying the same. I predict the same outcome.

So, in answer to your question... No
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Old 15-01-2009, 15:34   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic cat View Post
Is it:

Unsinkable?

Alan
excuse my naiivety here but what makes a cat unsinkable and a mono not
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Old 15-01-2009, 16:31   #10
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Ballast. Without ballast many mono's wouldn't sink either. Not to say all cats are unsinkable, but most modern, cored construction ones are.
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Old 15-01-2009, 16:53   #11
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Area of enclosed space behind seperate water tight compartments versus weight. Cats CAN have (though most do not) large water tight compartments forward in their bow lockers and aft. Area of say a PDQ 44 water tight compartments I would guesstimate around 200 cu ft per side in areas beyond the hull living compartments. That would be 12,000 lbs of lift for a hull weight of around 10,000 loaded. If hulled I believe they calculated they'd sink by only 18 inches. Couple that with far less weight for a good catamaran than a monohull with a traditional lead keel and your talking about a boat that can take a hole in any area of the hull and still have that hull (not to mention the other) above water. A mono would have by contrast a large aft cabin, a large v birth and far more weight. One monohull maker has made their boat with a double hull with lots of foam between the hulls to give them positive floatation (etap?) but I haven't heard of any other.


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excuse my naiivety here but what makes a cat unsinkable and a mono not
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Old 15-01-2009, 16:54   #12
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Looks a lot like an Open 50.
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Old 16-01-2009, 05:02   #13
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There's no such thing as unsinkable. Uncontrollable fire will sink anything.
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Old 16-01-2009, 08:32   #14
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A better way to put it would be that some boats are made with sufficient protected reserve bouyancy to be able to withstand a breech in any single part of the boat without a threat of sinking.
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Old 16-01-2009, 08:57   #15
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A meteorite will sink anything, too. Well, maybe not a catamaran.

CarlF: If you don't want a catamaran, you don't have to buy one. But since this is the multihull thread, one needs to ask why you would want to tell us why you don't want to buy one.
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