Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 22-05-2008, 02:01   #16
Marine Service Provider
 
Factor's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Brisbane Australia
Boat: Corsair Dash MKII
Posts: 4,084
Quote:
Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
Anyone is free to open a thread, specific to any brand (Glutenschnapel 46). Anyone else is also free to add comments to that thread. Those comments should be, at least loosely, related to the subject; but the management team cannot police every off-topic posting. Should any posting be egregiously off-topic or inappropriate, we will take action, when we become aware of such offense.
I am aware of that

Quote:
[2] Should I understand that my (or anyone else’s) opinion is only welcome, in your world, when it complements yours?
Didnt say that - didnt say that at all - didnt even go close to saying that, where on earth did you get that from, what I said was that when someone is discussing the MAHE 36 or whatever, in terms of being a resource for others, we shouldn't get to much into comparatives with other sorts of boats eg mono, and indeed probably not even stray too far in the multi world. What I said was having repetitive arguments over the same issues in these threads is counter productive.

Quote:
The management team will not police politely submitted opinions, no matter how offensive some over-sensitive souls may find those alternative viewpoints.
Rubbish. I have been the subject of infraction for a polite opinion.

Quote:
[3] Neither can we police “facts”, .
no one is asking you too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MidLandOne View Post
I have seen people give their genuine views, to which one assumes that they are entitled, in some cases from a position of knowledge but just been shouted down by a few.
The issue is that when someone says - eg cats dont tack, and that poster is challenged that such a statement isn't true and mythical, its the second post that is belted down.
__________________

__________________
Factor is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 03:43   #17
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Colombo
Posts: 1,059
Quote:
Originally Posted by Factor View Post
The issue is that when someone says - eg cats dont tack, and that poster is challenged that such a statement isn't true and mythical, its the second post that is belted down.
I would certainly agree with you that a claim that cats don't tack is uninformed (but there is certainly room for discussion as to how fast they can tack, but lets not go there ). But, without mentioning names , a response to a post stating

"Cat's tack ever so slow" of

"Oh no - here we go again, we the optically challenged being lead by the visually impaired, honestly does anyone actually believe the anti multi mythology still?"

is just a non constructive possibly rude dismissive reaction, and ignores the context in which the claim was made (Americas Cup, where many believe such a claim may, in fact, rightly or wrongly have some validity) so perhaps should be "belted down".
__________________

__________________
MidLandOne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 03:53   #18
Marine Service Provider
 
Factor's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Brisbane Australia
Boat: Corsair Dash MKII
Posts: 4,084
Thats it - you win. I am over this. I make a reasonable suggestion about trying to quaratine the trolling behaviour and even that thread gets hijacked into a mono multi thread - see you all later.

OH and the Cat one the AC against the kiwi mega boat. But like hell why let the facts stand in the way of your bias.

If you are looking for me I will be over at the mono area telling every thread that their boats sink.
__________________
Factor is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 04:52   #19
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 976
Images: 6
Well I will be blunt...treat the forum as normal conversation amongst friends......errr on the side of politeness .If you wish to "stir the pot" (my earlier post) Feudal bluntness (this is my patch and I will push the point) is fun and can be productive, BUT you must be willing to take responsibility and hold out the olive branch straight away if you want to do this. Other wise a pointless, point scoring exercise is the result.....wings get torn off. People get angry the whole forum degenerates and the aim of sharing information and having friends is a lost cause. The most wonderful thing about the debate of multi versus mono is telling their failings NOT their attributes. Both sides should be saying what their boats problems are. If you are serious about passing on information IT IS THE BAD BITs TOLD BY THE OWNERS OF THOSE BOATS THAT COUNT. Not relentless bagging by either side. That is why I have an objection to a forum title that will ultimately be mono bagging multi and visa versa. ITS CRAP. None of our boats are perfect...just different.....


and factor I am disappointed.....quarantining is just apartied I have a ferro boat...you reckon multys cop it ??? lighten up and be gentle. I have gained so much INFORMATION from this site. It is the internet. It will only work if it is treated "LIKE you would treat a normal conversation".
__________________
cooper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 05:09   #20
cruiser

Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,525
Ok, I'm not even involved in this mono vs. multi, even though I had asked that exact question on the board before buying my multi and switching after 20 years of mono sailing.

I'm not on either side yet, as I'm a new multi owner and haven't made up my mind.

This whole area of discussion is sad though. Factor was at least trying here. He has a good idea. We should (unfortunately) have a "quarantine" area in the multi part of the forum to slide the "mono vs. multi" posts into.

This way, we could keep the larger debate apart from intelligent conversation regarding the multis. I know I miss a lot of good information on a type of boat that is new to me because I don't feel like wading through the garbage in there.

If you set up a new category inside the multi area called "the great debate" or something, and moved every mono vs. multi post that turns into a long, boring argument into there, maybe people would either a) stop, or b) choose their words carefully.

A statement like "multis can't tack" is fairly uninformed (especially since I spend a lot of time tacking mine). Talk like this belongs in the "the great debate" thread, and should be quarantined or moved into "the great debate" thread, especially if the topic of the original poster is something like, "Which Cat to Buy", or "How Do I Tack My New Cat?"

I think we ought to try setting up a "clean up" thread called "the great debate" or something and banish all the mono vs. multi crap into it. It could be a subset of multi area.

Also, I think it would be a good idea to have a moderator that is a multi owner on as a moderator, and task them with keeping the multi area of the forum clean. They could evenhandedly move posts and annoying threads that drag on and on about the debate into "the great debate" thread or section, keeping the multi area on track. I believe some multi owners have volunteered to do this?
__________________
ssullivan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 05:20   #21
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,580
Images: 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by cooper View Post
...treat the forum as normal conversation amongst friends......ere on the side of politeness.
... People get angry the whole forum degenerates and the aim of sharing information and having friends is a lost cause...
Or, as a couple of other fellows put it:

"Be polite; write diplomatically; even in a declaration of war one observes the rules of politeness." ~ O. von Bismarck

"We should be too big to take offense and too noble to give it." ~ A. Lincoln
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 07:28   #22
...

Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 483
Quote:
Originally Posted by Factor View Post
Thats it - you win. I am over this. I make a reasonable suggestion about trying to quaratine the trolling behaviour and even that thread gets hijacked into a mono multi thread - see you all later.

OH and the Cat one the AC against the kiwi mega boat. But like hell why let the facts stand in the way of your bias.

If you are looking for me I will be over at the mono area telling every thread that their boats sink.
Don't give up Factor, I am with you on this one all the way.

It is still a shame that there are too many negative people who like to stir things up and when you make a sensible suggestion you are made out to be the trouble maker.
__________________
ireaney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 08:48   #23
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Eastern Seaboard
Boat: Searunner 34 and Searunner Constant Camber 44
Posts: 949
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssullivan View Post
I'm not on either side yet, as I'm a new multi owner and haven't made up my mind.
...
This whole area of discussion is sad though. Factor was at least trying here. He has a good idea. We should (unfortunately) have a "quarantine" area in the multi part of the forum to slide the "mono vs. multi" posts into.
I kind of split here, too. But in a different area, I think.

I agree with Gordon that anyone can start a tread on any type of boat, and I did so on Searunner Trimarans because of the one that LarryH had/has up for sale and I was considering it. I think that thread turned out well and the conversation has remained pretty much on topic. Maybe this is because tris aren’t really all that popular; I don’t know. Parenthetically, titles of the threads are particularly important in either case.

On the other hand, I think Factor has a good point too, at least as I understand it. A bit of organization and facts would be nice because otherwise it’s like herding cats. I would love to a place where I could read just about the hypothetical, Turtle 60. And having all the reviews of the monohulls together and all the multis together makes a lot of sense when it comes to searching.

But here’s the rub as I see it. Few of us are really broad of experience in terms of the performance of boats. So when I say on the Turtle 44 thread that I liked it lot but my old Thunder 45 had better windward performance it’s meaningful to me but not that many others. But it does open up the window for someone to agree and say how he never had that problem with his mono/cat/tri Whizbang 45.

Wheels pointed out on a similar line of questioning I had (and I am heavily paraphrasing here) this forum is more about the lifestyle of cruising rather than being a reference library. Maybe the solution is to have a more fact based area with little tolerance for off topic posts as well as the general area more along the lines of “Yeah, Sailing!” I don’t really know. The down side is that if you over limit it you have a one post forum.
__________________
Regards,

Maren

The sea is always beautiful, sometimes mysterious and, on occasions, frighteningly powerful.
Maren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 13:16   #24
Senior Cruiser
 
Alan Wheeler's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Marlborough Sounds. New Zealand
Boat: Hartley Tahitian 45ft. Leisure Lady
Posts: 8,038
Images: 102
We have thrown the subject...(ummm the original subject that started this thread in the first place that is) around for the last couple of days. We have come to the conclusion it would be unworkable. That last dozen posts here shine a light on just one of the reasons here. But the main issue is trying to keep thread down in size. There are hundreds of makes of boats out there. Thousands if you want to include models of each make. It would be better to simply ask the question as a regular post as has been done before and let it run it's course.
__________________
Wheels

For God so loved the world..........He didn't send a committee.
Alan Wheeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 13:28   #25
Moderator Emeritus
 
Pblais's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Hayes, VA
Boat: Gozzard 36
Posts: 8,700
Images: 15
Send a message via Skype™ to Pblais
Quote:
It would be better to simply ask the question as a regular post as has been done before and let it run it's course.
Long threads tend to create new courses that often lead to instresting but unitended desitinations. One thread can not carry the full story on most topics. If the topic isn't going where you want feel free to start a new one. We can make as many as we need (you have the button). If you see a thread that isn't going where you want, jump ship and start a new one. Leave old battles to die on their own. A new thread lets other add on without the old wounds from the past. It gives people a way to let go.

People don't fix as easy as boats. We can't do much but clean up after the mess has been made.
__________________
Paul Blais
s/v Bright Eyes Gozzard 36
37 15.7 N 76 28.9 W
Pblais is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-05-2008, 13:29   #26
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 6,890
Just one little question....Who is going to do all this work?

My understanding is that our great moderators and helpers are upaid volunteers.

Maybe it is more practical that the Original Poster does his own housekeeping and politely requests non contributing posts to play elsewhere
__________________
Pelagic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2008, 09:26   #27
cruiser

Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
Just one little question....Who is going to do all this work?
Why don't they bring an extra moderator on to handle this issue, specifically, since it's the only problem board really has?

I can think of some people who have wanted to be a "multihull moderator" and who might be able to clean up the mess.

It's as simple as setting up moderator privs and limiting them to multihull cleanup duties.
__________________
ssullivan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-05-2008, 09:44   #28
Registered User
 
SeaKing's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Shady Side, MD
Boat: Voyage 470 "SeaPaws II"
Posts: 509
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Wheeler View Post
We have thrown the subject...(ummm the original subject that started this thread in the first place that is) around for the last couple of days. We have come to the conclusion it would be unworkable. That last dozen posts here shine a light on just one of the reasons here. But the main issue is trying to keep thread down in size. There are hundreds of makes of boats out there. Thousands if you want to include models of each make. It would be better to simply ask the question as a regular post as has been done before and let it run it's course.

Understandable on the number of boats and the unworkable solution it presents. So in another direction, what about the SEARCH feature. What is the story on it, is it fixable or are there plans to get it going again?
__________________
SeaKing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-05-2008, 05:15   #29
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,580
Images: 240
The “Custom Google” CuisersForum search engine is an excellent tool.
Goto: google.com/coop/cse?cx=014551797412114848894%3A2lb6ozabif0
Link: Cruisers & Sailing Forum
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-05-2008, 13:23   #30
Moderator Emeritus
 
David M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: San Francisco Bay
Boat: research vessel
Posts: 10,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssullivan View Post
Why don't they bring an extra moderator on to handle this issue, specifically, since it's the only problem board really has?

I can think of some people who have wanted to be a "multihull moderator" and who might be able to clean up the mess.

It's as simple as setting up moderator privs and limiting them to multihull cleanup duties.
(I think Sulli wants to be that guy.)
__________________

__________________
David

Life begins where land ends.
David M is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Coast Guard Suggestion JusDreaming General Sailing Forum 6 28-11-2008 14:27
Suggestion for going from CT. thru N.Y. & up the Hudson Kasidah Sailor Logs & Cruising Plans 1 16-05-2008 21:10
forum suggestion seagypsywoman Forum Tech Support & Site Help 2 26-06-2005 14:59



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:31.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.