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Old 28-04-2010, 23:45   #46
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What thread? What question? If I ask a question then listen to peoples opinions then make my own assumption, its only because I think may have learned something and I am putting my thoughts up for scrutiny. Im not trying to tell anyone "how it is". Are you telling me there is something wrong with this?

I have listed a few boats in this thread of varying length and engine size. On forums like this its pretty easy to find people that are pro this or anti that, no matter what the subject is. Be that be multis, monos, production boats or old racers. I'm trying to gain an understanding so I can make up my own mind. Its impossible to have any opinion (no matter how well or ill founded) that wont clash with one group.

I wish I could just sail around on every boat until I know everything. But that isn't gonna happen. I am hoping to learn from other peoples experience before I jump in the deep end.

Now you say you aren't pointing at me, but mention how cruises have a rep as smelly bums right after I say I can go with out fresh water showers if need be.

Now can I try to get back on topic. What sort of fuel range should a cruising boat have to make a crossing over the pacific via the ITCZ?
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Old 29-04-2010, 00:47   #47
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the pacific via the ITCZ?
The IRCZ is the most written about area in sailing history: The Doldrums.

The first time I was on a boat saing into the Doldrums in the Atlantic I was lookiing forward to this mystical area with great relish! Would we be becalmed for weeks? Could we drift through it in a few days? Could we bounce form squall to squall? Would we see a pirate ship or a Marie Celeste appear out of the gloom?

The skipper put the engine on.

What a waste.

In the Pacific we sailed through it! I was determained! We acheived it easily and without much problem

So you don't need any fuel at all




I took this photo in the ITCZ near Panama. It shows the uplifting of air that is the Doldrums. The photos has been 'nicked' by a weather website to help illistrate how weather works. I'm pretty honoured by that!


Mark
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Old 29-04-2010, 00:53   #48
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If you and your boat are good sailors and have lots of time you can cross the entire Pacific on as little as 20 gallons.And most of it would be used charging your batteries.I have done that more than once.All my engines were under 20hp.
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Old 29-04-2010, 00:55   #49
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Nice pic Mark. Is it wise to rely on wind in this area though? Should you have a certain range of fuel just in case? Also I tried to find a Beneteau Oceanis 361 as you suggested but I cant find any under 100K. Also most are in Europe which is not ideal for me to sail back from. 50K is really more than I can afford already.

nonam I like your style.
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Old 29-04-2010, 01:28   #50
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Thanks Ramona. That is right in my price range and looks like a great boat. Has sea births heaps of electronics. I guess a minimal amount would need to be spent providing the major parts are in good condition.

Not sure how I missed it.

It would appear as though it should be a good resale, but I think Aussies like brand names and I doubt anyone here would have heard of finngulf. Either way any nice 34 foot yacht has to be worth 60K.

Look at what people are asking here 33usd for half shares in a similar style 34 foot yacht with less gear SWARBRICK & SWARBRICK 34 boat details - BoatPoint Australia

Finngulfs are available in Australia but they are at the high end of the market. They also have lead keels and not cast iron like those mass produced cruisers.
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Old 29-04-2010, 01:33   #51
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Thanks Ramona. I just had never heard of them and could not find any for sale to approximate value. It does look like a quality yacht and I did notice the lead keel.
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Old 29-04-2010, 01:36   #52
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The IRCZ is the most written about area in sailing history: The Doldrums.

The first time I was on a boat saing into the Doldrums in the Atlantic I was lookiing forward to this mystical area with great relish! Would we be becalmed for weeks? Could we drift through it in a few days? Could we bounce form squall to squall? Would we see a pirate ship or a Marie Celeste appear out of the gloom?

The skipper put the engine on.

What a waste.

In the Pacific we sailed through it! I was determained! We acheived it easily and without much problem

So you don't need any fuel at all




I took this photo in the ITCZ near Panama. It shows the uplifting of air that is the Doldrums. The photos has been 'nicked' by a weather website to help illistrate how weather works. I'm pretty honoured by that!


Mark
A family of three small child left for the Marquesas from Mexico before us in fact over six weeks before they still had not arrived when we departed so a little caution is wise!
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Old 29-04-2010, 01:48   #53
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"Now you say you aren't pointing at me, but mention how cruises have a rep as smelly bums right after I say I can go with out fresh water showers if need be"
If your offended then bad luck but they are the facts and the result effects myself and other cruisers all over the world. I made a comment about cruisers who's personnal habits reflect on the whole cruising community. I also made the point that you do not even own a boat at this point and it was off the subject. Me thinks you protest too much!
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Old 29-04-2010, 01:50   #54
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I tried to find a Beneteau Oceanis 361 as you suggested but I cant find any under 100K. Also most are in Europe which is not ideal for me to sail back from. 50K is really more than I can afford already.
nonam I like your style.
Caribbean is the place. They are listed about $70,000 but market is lower. Try through Moorings Brokerage they do ex-Sunsail and Moorings boats. About 5 to 8 years old good life ahead of them. Need survey to sort the good from the chaff.
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Old 29-04-2010, 01:57   #55
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We had salt water 'showers' every few days, then rinsed in a very small amount of fresh. Washed all our dishes in salt and rinsed in fresh. Cooked with 1/2 salt, 1/2 fresh and on the 27 day passage did 1 clothes wash in salt with a rinse in fresh. There were 3 of us on board and we used 350 litres.

Most people can't survive just showering in salt water as eventually your skin dries up and you get covered in sores (don't ask me how I know this!).
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:23   #56
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Why don't you sail from Hawaii... do a tad of work and you've a beaut boat.. and save money to upgrade..
It's Island hopping by comparison..... And... you can shower every day.... Why make sacrifices...

1977 Formosa Ketch sailboat for sale in Hawaii
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Old 01-05-2010, 16:12   #57
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Dennis,

FWIW, on Insatiable I (old IOR 1-tonner) we had 46 USG water and 45 USG fuel and a 35 HP diesel. Made the trip from MExico to Maruesas (about 3000 NM) twice southbound and Bora Bora to SF once (about 6300 miles via Hawaii, and all to windward). Never had problems woth water or fuel capacity. Didn't wash clothes, didn't worry too much about hygiene under way! But, one can get a useful wash with the proverbial helmet full of fresh water, and you don't wear very many clothes in the tropics so the laundry bag stays fairly small. Having a salt water source in the galley saves lots of water (pre-rinse dishes, wash in salt, rinse frugally in fresh). Catching rainwater when available also helps in the ITCZ (lots of squalls). With a boat that sails well in light airs fuel is not a big worry. When we arrived in Atuona, Hiva Oa the first trip we had used less than 20 litres since leaving Cabo San Lucas. Don't remember about the second trip. The voyages were 21 and 19 days respectively...

The ability to generate your electricity without running the engine is critical to fuel usage. We had a towing generator on the first trip, and added 80 watts of solar for the second one, and had a wind vane for steering (no power usage).

The point is, huge fuel and water capacity is certainly NOT required to make these long passages, but self discipline and some preplanning IS required.

And I don't think that your queries are unreasonable...

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Church Point, NSW, Oz
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Old 01-05-2010, 23:18   #58
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Didn't wash clothes, didn't worry too much about hygiene under way!
Most cruising couples do worry about hygiene and comfort. Most are older and have long ago done the backpacking lack of hygiene style travelling. When I read comments like these I do get amused as many postings suggest that their wives will divorce them unless they can shower regularly and many use the wife also for the reason they buy cats as they will not put up with a boat that does not sit flat. I for one would not put up with no shower (fresh water) and enough to regularly hand wash clothes and I am a male. Cruising is meant to be comfortabel and enjoyable not an endurance test.
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Old 01-05-2010, 23:57   #59
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Didn't wash clothes, didn't worry too much about hygiene under way!
Most cruising couples do worry about hygiene and comfort. Most are older and have long ago done the backpacking lack of hygiene style travelling. When I read comments like these I do get amused as many postings suggest that their wives will divorce them unless they can shower regularly and many use the wife also for the reason they buy cats as they will not put up with a boat that does not sit flat. I for one would not put up with no shower (fresh water) and enough to regularly hand wash clothes and I am a male. Cruising is meant to be comfortabel and enjoyable not an endurance test.
Meyermm,

Wow, I didn't know that you knew "most cruising couples". That's quite an accomplishment -- must take up a lot of your spare time.

Now, the point about "most are older" -- older than what? Ann and I are in our seventies, still cruising full time, still doing longish passages, and we now have lots more water capacity. We still get by on 10 litres of fresh water per day for the two of us. My point was not that we are nasty, smelly or such, but that when one is worried about supporting your water needs in a smaller boat, and if one does not want to have the investment in or maintenance of a RO unit, it is feasible to make long passages without the daily shower or doing laundry at sea.

As far as being divorced if I don't provide such luxuries at sea, well, it hasn't happened yet, and we've been cruising full time for 24 years now.

I recognize that your are a male, and that a daily shower is important to you, and that you are wanting to do laundry at sea. So be it -- if these requirements don't prevent your going cruising, good onya, but the OP is interested in what the possibilities are for passage making in less than ideal vessels. I think that my points might be helpful to him in his decision making process, for we have actually done exactly what he was asking about. So far we have failed to succumb to loathsome diseases due to our lack of American style hygiene, and have managed to not offend our friends, both cruising and shorebased. Your milage may vary.

Jim and Ann s/v INsatiable II lying Church Point, NSW Oz
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Old 02-05-2010, 02:06   #60
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Meyermm,

Wow, I didn't know that you knew "most cruising couples". That's quite an accomplishment -- must take up a lot of your spare time.

Now, the point about "most are older" -- older than what? Ann and I are in our seventies, still cruising full time, still doing longish passages, and we now have lots more water capacity. We still get by on 10 litres of fresh water per day for the two of us. My point was not that we are nasty, smelly or such, but that when one is worried about supporting your water needs in a smaller boat, and if one does not want to have the investment in or maintenance of a RO unit, it is feasible to make long passages without the daily shower or doing laundry at sea.

As far as being divorced if I don't provide such luxuries at sea, well, it hasn't happened yet, and we've been cruising full time for 24 years now.

I recognize that your are a male, and that a daily shower is important to you, and that you are wanting to do laundry at sea. So be it -- if these requirements don't prevent your going cruising, good onya, but the OP is interested in what the possibilities are for passage making in less than ideal vessels. I think that my points might be helpful to him in his decision making process, for we have actually done exactly what he was asking about. So far we have failed to succumb to loathsome diseases due to our lack of American style hygiene, and have managed to not offend our friends, both cruising and shorebased. Your milage may vary.

Jim and Ann s/v INsatiable II lying Church Point, NSW Oz
Well I am glad you agree as you are in your seventies but I was thinking more along the lines of fourty+. As for knowing them all well lets just say that every where I seem to go long term cruising people on the whole have been fourty + so yes I am really confident about the age group. American citizens are not the only ones who like to live comfortably and as I am Australian and have always been used to showering regularly and now that I think of it coming over I had a crew made up of Swedish, Canadian, German and English and you may be surprised to hear that they also were very keen on regular washing both themselves and clothing in fact it became a heated topic at one stage. Your entitled to your opinion just as I am mine. You do seem unduly sensitive to my post though?
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