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Old 12-11-2014, 11:40   #76
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

The C&C will cost more to ship to the East Coast then it's worth. The Hunter looks like it's in good condition. Neither Hunter nor Tanzer are the first names to come to mind when I think trans oceanic sailing in that size range.

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Old 12-11-2014, 12:01   #77
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

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Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
Keep in mind it really has more to do with the sailor..Web Chiles is heading around the world again in a Moore 24.
And I have a friend preparing for a new record n a single hand continuous around the world in a wilderness 21.

I'd choose the C&C from the OP's list.

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Old 12-11-2014, 12:16   #78
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

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And I have a friend preparing for a new record n a single hand continuous around the world in a wilderness 21.-steve
If by continuous you mean non-stop that means around Cape Horn. I wish him luck, it will be needed.


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Old 12-11-2014, 12:55   #79
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

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If by continuous you mean non-stop that means around Cape Horn. I wish him luck, it will be needed.


I dont recall our conversation about his route but... yeah. lots and lots of luck indeed.

He has sailed around the horn and single handed a 60+ footer in 30' seas so if anyone can do it, my money is on him.

still...

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Old 12-11-2014, 13:02   #80
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

Newt, yes you are correct, it was more or less the milk run, but most of the time it was a real joy. Was it cramped! HELL YES, but for some of the people that are stating that it is unsafe, dont know what they are talking about. By the time we got to Tahiti, most of our friends had what we called "2 foot itis". Almost everybody wanted a little bit bigger boat. That included many of the folks in the 30+ range. Very little to do with safety, but everything to do with comfort. After over a year in FP we, like so many cruisers , ran out of money, and sailed up to Hawaii. That tested boat and crew. After a wonderful experience of drifting for a couple of days in the doldrums, we got into the NE trades. They kept building until we spent 6 days close hauled under double reefed main and storm jib. I would have felt better if I had a third reef for the main, but never felt unsafe. The 26 foot boat only had one tiny leak from a port light, so we were dry down below, even though the trip was like submarining our way north, rather than sailing. If I took out the 2 days of almost no wind, we still averaged a little over 100 miles a day. Yes, I lost weight on that passage, but the boat performed flawlessly. After 2 years of full time cruising on the Contessa, we were both fed up with the space, and we had tossed all of our cold weather gear over the side long ago. The thought of the cold, and the tired condition of our main kept us from sailing back to San Francisco. The boat would have done fine, but we were tired. 2 boats later we had a Peterson 44, that we purchased to have the room to raise a family on. It didnt work out that way, but it would have been roomy enough. As much as I like the Valiant 40, I suspect that by the time your kids are preteens, you also will have 2 foot itis. I hope not for your sake, but it is a normal reaction to limited space. As far as the OP goes. The odds of him ever crossing the Atlantic are very slim. He is a dreamer, but I started out as a dreamer, and if he gets in enough coastal cruising before he leaps off into the deep blue, he may do OK. I keep emphasizing coastal cruising, because you can get your butt whipped, and still not be too far from a safe harbor. The worst beatings I have taken in sailboats have been going up the California coast, both in my own boat, and doing deliveries. If we have convinced the OP to do more homework (get experience) then CF will be serving its purpose. If we have scared him off with the"chicken little" attitude about small boats, then we have done a dis-service. Just my opinion. ______Grant.
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Old 12-11-2014, 13:14   #81
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

Thanks Grant. Spoken by someone who has been there, done that. I watched a youtube of someone coming across on that little boat across the Atlantic and then up to New York- solo. He looked pretty bent out of shape by the time he arrived at the big apple. I should note however, he was alive and able to still sail.
As for my Valiant- I never sleep as well as I do on that boat in a passage. When the swell is up, I keep my bunny suit on and face plant right next to the mast. My co-captain wakes me up four hours later when my shift starts....
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Old 12-11-2014, 13:19   #82
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

I had the great pleasure and privilege of Alessandro Di Benedetto this summer in Horta during our crossing. Very interesting and inspiring guy. He circumnavigated non-stop and unassisted via the three capes in a Mini and is now an IMOCA 60 driver. He also did a Japan to San Francisco crossing on an 18 foot plywood cat.

Like Webb Chiles, Alessandro is an exception from the norm and I recognize the 'stunt' aspect of this kind of sailing but I think it's worth noting and I think there are lessons to be learned from them.

Three years into our two-year plan I don't regret our choices for a forty footer. I was never naive or unrealistic about our goals and the fact that we are somewhat delayed isn't directly a consequence of our decision, but rather due to the way things in life just work out sometimes.

Three years ago I hadn't crossed the Atlantic. I hadn't spent four days running one-on-one-off watches under a storm surfing down city block-sized waves. In waves that big I am not sure if I see much difference between a 30, a 40, or a 50 footer. Really.

I think the bigger difference lies in the performance of the boat. When I look at Webb Chiles and his current choice I can understand the logic behind small and lightweight as a safe boat strategy.

Regardless of size. I'll take a boat that surf easily over one that doesn't any day of the week. My max surf on our crossing was like 11.6 knots on a boat that didn't surf so great, it was a little scary. I've surfed +14 on smaller boats that surfed more easily and felt a lot safer.

Which make me think for a minute. Small and lightweight has a lot of upsides. It means manageable. We have a neighbor with a really nice fifty footer. When he saw the forty foot IOR boat we were doing our crossing on before we left his comment was "Don't you think that's a little small? I'm thinking about getting a bigger boat"

He wasn't being a dick, or trying to be funny. He was sincere and I didn't feel slighted. Older gentleman. All I could think to myself was that I didn't want to be him out in the middle of the ocean alone with his wife when his electric winches and autopilot fail and he has to reef the main before a squall rolls in.

Besides being manageable small means cheap. I hate to say it but three years into our project. For the money we have into it. I don't regret it and we'll get where we're going eventually, but $5k for the Capri, or something like it?

I could have been cruising for the past three years. Paid. Sure it would be a little rough. Rougher than facing another winter living aboard in the northeast? I'm not so sure. Unsafe? Doesn't have to be.

Just a couple thoughts. Now I will go back to enjoying living aboard my forty footer.
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Old 12-11-2014, 13:22   #83
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

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Webb Chiles

Yeah, that's right. The man is on his 6th circumnavigation and he's doing it on a 24 foot ULDB.
He also crossed oceans in an open 18' Drascombe Lugger (and sank one too), but it's still not probably not anyone else's choice for Atlantic crossing.
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Old 12-11-2014, 14:57   #84
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

I hope we have not scared the OP away, and he is still reading. I write this for the OP, the waanbees, newbees, and dreamers, and all of the rest of the readers that dont have much experience. I dont write this to discourage anyone, but to show some examples of how dreaming, rather than gaining experience can lead to bad choices. My first cruising boat was purchased by a fellow that had done all of the research and reading. He purchased it from England with almost all of the essential gear to be a world cruiser. Hull and anchor chain with Loydes of Londan certificates, storm sails, windvane , inboard diesel, etc ,etc. He had done very little sailing. I met the mans cousin , and he told me the history of the boat. The man had sailed it a few times on San Francisco bay, and took a knock down on another boat. Scared him so bad that he never sailed again, and sold the boat. I was lucky to buy that boat, since I didnt have much experience, and could have bought almost anything. I started out with baby steps, day sails on SF bay, then Halfmoon bay and back, then on down the coast and back. Coming back up wind was always the learning (miserable) part of the trips. My next boat (37 foot steel boat) was similarly equipped when I bought it. The broker told me that it had been owner built(and it looked it) by a fellow that took years to finish it, and then took off , single handed across the North Atlantic (OP are you reading)? Three days out he hit a gale and got beat up. Sailed back to the first port he could find, tied up to the first dock he could find, found a broker and said SELL IT. I understand that he never went back on the boat. Dreams disappear very fast in the reality of ocean crossing. My point is for all of the newbees to get experience on small boats, and/or other peoples boats , before you think you are buying a boat to cross an ocean. Coastal cruising gives you much experience, and much of ocean crossing is simply being stoic enough to put up with fatigue, and cold until conditions get better. I greatly benefited from all of the time and money that the previous owners had spent before they had the stuff scared out of them. Buy a weekender and sail the hell out of it, before you spend the bucks on something that you(as an inexperienced sailor) think is OK to cross oceans in. Just another 2 cents worth. _____Grant.
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Old 12-11-2014, 15:53   #85
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

Some great advice being shared... Hope OP is reading and applying info from experienced folks to his dream.
- cheers
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Old 12-11-2014, 16:37   #86
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

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i know people have done it in less but when i do it id like some peace of mind in the sence i got some reviews from some long time sailors, thanks.

Tanzer 25 | sailboats | Saint John | Kijiji

27' C&C Mark II | sailboats | Vancouver | Kijiji

T25 with Volvo Diesel | sailboats | Oakville / Halton Region | Kijiji

hunter 27 | sailboats | Owen Sound | Kijiji

No....
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Old 12-11-2014, 23:04   #87
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

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Cool boat! Thanks for posting. Any more info on this?
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Old 13-11-2014, 07:08   #88
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

Boats the size of the C&C 27 and Hunter 27 are not small boats, they are fairly substantial boats, there is a big jump between a 24 and 26 in volume in coastal cruisers, if you look at virtually any production boat 25ft and under they are small with small headroom etc, but when you make the jump to pretty much any boat from about 26ft on up you have another foot + beam and 6ft headroom and are up in the 5000+lb displacement and this is a pretty substantial boat to work with. Most coastal cruisers in the 26 to 30ft size range are structurally sound enough for offshore cruising but obviously need some upgrades, including well known ones such as the Vega, Contessa as neither of these are built specifically for offshore and have the same weaknesses as any other coastal cruiser such as weak rudders and compression post designs, but once you have done the upgrades they can be every bit as seaworthy as many sub 40ft boats but probably not as comfortable. I am speaking only as a boatbuilder, not an atlantic crosser.
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Old 13-11-2014, 08:01   #89
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

The real issue here, as some have pointed out, is not the boat, but the skipper. I haven't crossed any major oceans (I have crossed the Baltic and the North sea). But I can say that after 2-3 days at sea in nasty nasty weather, you will find out if you are a stay the course kind of person or a quitter.

You will not know this for certain until you have tried it. I will say that getting "adequate" training is not enough. If you decide to try this - get your boat and after you think you have had adequate training, go sailing in gale force winds and 5-6 meter waves.

If you think that is fun, then you might make it. Around here where I live, the benchmark is "Go sailing around the Orkney Islands in a gale. Did you like it?

yes - you can sail almost anywhere you damn well please

no? - stay coastal sailing in good weather.

No matter what size boat you are on.
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Old 13-11-2014, 08:10   #90
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Re: Would You Cross the Atlantic in Either of These?

The Open 16 boats look like a very cool boat!
And while I would love to have one to sail, for a long distance voyage there is a lack of comfort. Notice below the trip from Spain to Florida took 87 days. He did set two records though!

Specs on his boat and numerous videos are found via the link. The videos show the boat to be a wet ride.

Still, only 16 feet!
-------------


Small boat transatlantic


PALM BEACH SHORES, Fla. - Extreme sailor Harald Sedlacek is getting ready to sail back across the Atlantic. About a month ago, he finished his 87-day trip from Spain in a boat made from a new recyclable material made out of volcanic fibers.

"We test a new product, it's the first boat that exists, I built the boat," he said.

Sure, a lot of people have sailed across the Atlantic but nobody has done it like Harry has. It was in a boat the size of a Ford Fusion. It was a non-stop trip and he did it solo.

"I make two records, one was from coast to coast with the smallest boat and the second record was that I do 5608 nautical miles without stopping. "

Sleeping quarters were tight. A 6.5 by 2 foot space with a bar bisecting it in the middle.

He mainly ate cereal, noodles and candy bars for the 87 day trip and almost ran out of supplies because the trip took longer than expected. "I lose like 20 pounds on the whole trip."

Harry had to work for his water, pumping a device to make fresh water from the sea for an hour and half every day.

His biggest challenges were being alone on such a small boat for so long and the weather. "The most what I was afraid was the 4 times when I hit with my mast the water. I had 45 knots of wind and big sea."

Flipping the boat 4 times wasn't enough to scare him away though; Harry sets sail for Europe this Friday, this time taking the northern route and following the Gulf Stream.

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