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Old 08-08-2009, 08:46   #76
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But I can Sympathize if you don't like the cheap ply wood

Find Wind that is a interesting comment as the Formosa's decks are made of plywood as a core. Have you purchased teak veneered marine grade plywood, I assure you that there is nothing cheap about it.
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Old 08-08-2009, 09:11   #77
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I think the bottom line is that cruising sailboats of any type don't make any kind of practical sense. Unless you live like a wild man, it's almost always cheaper to fly somewhere and rent a nice hotel room, than to gear up and sail there. This is in conrtrast to say, driving cross country in an RV, which really is a cheaper way to go. Cruising sailboats are not RV's, at least not to (many of) their owners. They're instruments of art, history, and culture.
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Old 08-08-2009, 09:48   #78
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I think the bottom line is that cruising sailboats of any type don't make any kind of practical sense. They're instruments of art, history, and culture.
and that about sums it up... wood or no wood, we all must be a bit off our rockers to have these holes in the water into which we invest so much in so many ways!
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Old 08-08-2009, 10:04   #79
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I hope nobody takes offense, but they are toys. A pleasure boat is purely there for ones.....pleasure. Who is to say a toy should look this way or that way? Try telling Mattel that.
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Old 08-08-2009, 10:21   #80
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Sailboats, particularly monohulls, seem to have primarily wood surfaces in the interior. It turns me off and I can't understand why buyers seem to prefer this. I'm sure there are some good reasons but I can't fathom them.
There is no explaining personal preferences--hence the Heinz 57.

However, wood, and particularly structural plywood, has a strength-to-weight ratio roughly equal to steel or aluminum. The energy ratio to produce a panel of given stiffness is 1.0 for steel and .02 for wood. To produce a given compressive strength is 1.0 for Steel .002 for wood. Better, however, is it's strength-to cost ratio which far surpasses other materials and particularly synthetic matrials such as honey-comb cored fibre reinforced panels. It is relatively easily obtained, easily worked, and easily repaired. If one dislikes the natural colour it can be painted in the Herreshoff manner--up to mid-height; or, entirely (although it would be wise to apply an adheasive covering to the panel and then paint that rather than the wood itself so that a future owner that prefers the look of wood will have less difficulty removing the paint!) If one prefers Christian's clorox bottle analogy, one can obtain thin plastic paneling at Home Depot, Lowes, etc. and apply that as a surface. As for yacht builder's however, I suspect to ensure their survival, they will stick to what is efficient, reliable, cost effective; and, evidently, preferred.

FWIW...
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Old 08-08-2009, 10:22   #81
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I hope nobody takes offense, but they are toys. A pleasure boat is purely there for ones.....pleasure. Who is to say a toy should look this way or that way? Try telling Mattel that.
Even though I have a house, not a home. Imagine is my home, and I could never think of her as a toy. Toys to me are dispensible, but a sailing home is not. It gives me life, and daily as she is used she teaches me about life, and myself. I do not see Imagine as an accesory, but as a necessity. Just as some of us prefer all wood, some wood, and no wood. We all look at our vessels, or vessels that are wanted differently.

The house is 1 mile from my work, and Imagine is 20 miles away. I go to the house to mow the lawn, and a swim, but rarely more than 2 nights a week am I sleeping there. I can go months without sleeping there, and I care not. I go one night not sleeping on Imagine, and I am in a hurry to return to her.

I think when you find the right boat, and start cruising her David. You will slip into a different point of view, and then again maybe not?.....i2f
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Old 08-08-2009, 10:35   #82
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Ok...excellent points imagine2.
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Old 08-08-2009, 18:07   #83
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Find Wind that is a interesting comment as the Formosa's decks are made of plywood as a core. Have you purchased teak veneered marine grade plywood, I assure you that there is nothing cheap about it.
I was talking about interior woodwork, as in the Formosa has Teak interior.

I am aware of the manufacturing process of the decks of Formosas as in, my fathers boat had Fiberglass at the base, then Marine Ply wood, then foam, like Styrofoam, then more fiberglass, and then finally Teak on top. and I agree, there is nothing cheap about the product.
But i was not talking about the deck.
sorry for the confusion.
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Old 08-08-2009, 19:02   #84
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As a full time cruiser and live-aboard for four decades I spend much time out in the bright cockpit and I like the darker interior, but not necessarily wood. Here are a couple of exterior photos of my 36 year old boat with little or no wood:


Most of was appears to be similar to wood in these interior photos is plastic:



Form may follow function, but it doesn't have to follow by a single path. 'take care and joy, Aythya crew
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Old 10-08-2009, 02:06   #85
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Sparohok, Stillraining has it right... my boat's interior is my living room. You say you'd rather have wood in your living room than on your boat, so there you go.
On the one hand I'll grant that you are coming at it from a different perspective, I am sadly not yet shopping for a boat to live aboard full time.

On the other hand that really doesn't have anything to do with the point I was making. The reason fine furniture belongs in my living room is because my living room has hundreds of square feet, doesn't heel, doesn't have a b/d ratio or a d/l ratio or a sa/d ratio, is highly unlikely to capsize or take on salt water, rarely has people walking through it in soaking wet weather gear">foul weather gear, etc. If I am so fortunate as to make a boat my living room one day, I certainly plan to make different compromises than I do in my current home -- that only stands to reason.

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Old 10-08-2009, 02:59   #86
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and that about sums it up... wood or no wood, we all must be a bit off our rockers to have these holes in the water into which we invest so much in so many ways!
Houses are also holes. They have prices which are trebble the build value and once your installed, your a cash cow for numerous colectors not to mention the upkeep and maintenence
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Old 10-08-2009, 06:52   #87
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Houses are also holes. They have prices which are trebble the build value and once your installed, your a cash cow for numerous colectors not to mention the upkeep and maintenence
I always found it better to get the houses built yourself instead of paying someones profit buying it from them.

The same with boats.
Then you pay a lot less money for the same value end product.

Yes, I know, it's a remarkable concept but some of us do it.
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Old 10-08-2009, 06:58   #88
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I am now going to try out MY new favorite toy:

I think I like the flys best!
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Old 10-08-2009, 17:51   #89
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I am now going to try out MY new favorite toy:

I think I like the flys best!
Yep... his mind was made up before question was asked... OH well
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Old 10-08-2009, 22:26   #90
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Don't underestimate the value of a good conversation...

Rarely do people change their minds because of an internet conversation. Variety is the spice of life.

The only issue with fiberglass that I haven't seen discussed yet is this. Our boat has a fiberglass "plug" that creates a false floor and the form for the interior benches and teh forepeak berth. The bulkheads and galley are wood.

Another maxi was on the hard here forever the fiberglass plug was deteriorated and cracked. There is no way to get a replacement or even if you could you could not get it isnside the boat with the deck on. Fiberglass repairing is possible but eventually the brittleness and deterioaration will make this a losing game.

Wood seems an efficient way to rebuild this interior.

We also talk about redoing our interior. I have several ideas for improvements when/if we do and the only way that I could execute on this with my skills is in wood.
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