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Old 24-03-2011, 21:49   #1
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Which way do I go

As most of you know I am looking for a boat!

This week I have found 2 that could not be more different if i tried

One of my criteria is as smooth a motion as possible as I have a very bad back.

Does that mean I should steer away from the light displacement fin keeler (i am thinking 6600KG fin keel farr 1220) and steer towards a full keel 11500kg displacement (Like a mason 43)

I know there are a million other criteria to consider but on this point am i right or just naive??
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Old 24-03-2011, 21:52   #2
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Re: Which way do I go

[Warning: Multihull fan giving advice]

You're in Australia, land of the fabulous catamarans. Try out a Seawind or other design and see how flat sailing suits you.

I enjoy monohulls too, but I think a catamaran would be easier on your back.
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Old 24-03-2011, 21:54   #3
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Re: Which way do I go

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Originally Posted by snort View Post
[Warning: Multihull fan giving advice]

You're in Australia, land of the fabulous catamarans. Try out a Seawind or other design and see how flat sailing suits you.

I enjoy monohulls too, but I think a catamaran would be easier on your back.
Thanks Snort

Simple answer: Can only afford one hull.

My budget of about 150K Aus really doesnt buy a lot of catamaran does it?
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Old 24-03-2011, 22:21   #4
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Re: Which way do I go

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnathon123 View Post
As most of you know I am looking for a boat!

This week I have found 2 that could not be more different if i tried

One of my criteria is as smooth a motion as possible as I have a very bad back.

Does that mean I should steer away from the light displacement fin keeler (i am thinking 6600KG fin keel farr 1220) and steer towards a full keel 11500kg displacement (Like a mason 43)

I know there are a million other criteria to consider but on this point am i right or just naive??
G'DAy again James,

This question will bring forth lots of very emotional responses from "experts" who will passionately defend their particular design school.

Our personal observations indicate that there are boats of each of the above general categories with good and with bad motions at sea. One can't generalize such things very successfully.

Ann has suffered from a bad back for most of her adult life... had a pair of fusions (lumbar) back in the 60's, and more recently more major surgery on lumbar and cervical areas in '09 (quite successful, by the way). We moved from Insatiable I which was a Palmer Johnson Standfast 36 to our current Jon Sayer design. I-one was a retired racer, but of the old school: quite heavy (around 10 tonnes on a 29 foot LWL), lots of rocker, round hull shapes... something that fits many of the old school characteristics. I-two is a flat-bottomed fin keel, no rocker to talk about, very flat sections aft of the keel, and only 9.5 tonnes launch weight on a 44+ ft LWL and likely 12 tonnes in cruise mode.

To our surprise, I-two is WAY more comfortable at sea!! The long waterline really makes a difference, and I suspect there are far more subtle factors, but the bottom line is, for Ann in particular, a more enjoyable existence at sea. It is true that I-two will pound if driven hard to windward in a seaway... but if you simply slow down from the 9+ knots she delivers if hard driven to something like 6-7 knots the pounding vanishes, the heel angle diminishes and the comfort factor goes up. I suppose I don't have to point out that the traditional designs don't have to make this adjustment -- they only do 6-7 knots to windward when driven hard!

I can make no comment about the two specific designs you mentioned, but I can say categorically that only a sea trial will tell you if the motion is to your liking.

I wish that I could offer a "one size fits all" answer like lots of other CF folks can, but in reality, one size fits some at best, and may fit almost no one! YMMV.

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Towlers Bay, NSW, Oz
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Old 24-03-2011, 22:27   #5
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Re: Which way do I go

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
G'DAy again James,

This question will bring forth lots of very emotional responses from "experts" who will passionately defend their particular design school.

Our personal observations indicate that there are boats of each of the above general categories with good and with bad motions at sea. One can't generalize such things very successfully.

Ann has suffered from a bad back for most of her adult life... had a pair of fusions (lumbar) back in the 60's, and more recently more major surgery on lumbar and cervical areas in '09 (quite successful, by the way). We moved from Insatiable I which was a Palmer Johnson Standfast 36 to our current Jon Sayer design. I-one was a retired racer, but of the old school: quite heavy (around 10 tonnes on a 29 foot LWL), lots of rocker, round hull shapes... something that fits many of the old school characteristics. I-two is a flat-bottomed fin keel, no rocker to talk about, very flat sections aft of the keel, and only 9.5 tonnes launch weight on a 44+ ft LWL and likely 12 tonnes in cruise mode.

To our surprise, I-two is WAY more comfortable at sea!! The long waterline really makes a difference, and I suspect there are far more subtle factors, but the bottom line is, for Ann in particular, a more enjoyable existence at sea. It is true that I-two will pound if driven hard to windward in a seaway... but if you simply slow down from the 9+ knots she delivers if hard driven to something like 6-7 knots the pounding vanishes, the heel angle diminishes and the comfort factor goes up. I suppose I don't have to point out that the traditional designs don't have to make this adjustment -- they only do 6-7 knots to windward when driven hard!

I can make no comment about the two specific designs you mentioned, but I can say categorically that only a sea trial will tell you if the motion is to your liking.

I wish that I could offer a "one size fits all" answer like lots of other CF folks can, but in reality, one size fits some at best, and may fit almost no one! YMMV.

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Towlers Bay, NSW, Oz

Thanks Jim

Glad to hear Ann did well with the back!

Interesting observation re designs and of course highlights the fact that you need to go for a sail as i would have picked it the other way around

Thanks

James
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Old 24-03-2011, 22:28   #6
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Re: Which way do I go

SAIL EVERYTHING-- buy what ye likes.
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Old 24-03-2011, 22:29   #7
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Re: Which way do I go

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SAIL EVERYTHING-- buy what ye likes.
i figure if I sail everything I would never need to buy anything.

So much choice
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Old 24-03-2011, 23:04   #8
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Re: Which way do I go

You have enough cheese for a cat. Try one! I must warn you that, while you might help your back, there are other issues that you buy into with a cat.
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Old 24-03-2011, 23:16   #9
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Don't suppose your into Wharrams........

Ketch rigged, Tiki style lashings with Marine grade aluminium I beams. Beam 6.1m
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