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Old 09-04-2016, 11:12   #1
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Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

What's your choice and why for extended cruising? We have a choice to make, we all do, but ours is this.

A little info. Both boats on our radar, both about the same cost, slightly more for the cat, affordable because both are totalled. We will do all of our own work so no biggie there. My club footed friend Old Salty said that the Ingred is the cruise the world forever type we want, a multi friend we sail with says he never wants anything but a tri from now on, best of both worlds he say.

But what do you guys n gals think? We've never been on a big cat but have sailed Hobie's. We're excited to stay level at sea and at anchor especially. We're "used" to terrible motion aboard our 30ft fin keeled sloop on our home waters, the kind that makes you hate sailing and turns you into a solid land lubber.

No mono vs multi debate please just comparisons, opinions, and experience with these 2, please, and thanks all.
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Old 27-04-2016, 18:25   #2
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

What's the story on the CW A42? Ingred 38 is supposed to be a good solid cruiser. Describing them both as totalled, sounds like you will not be sailing anytime soon. Always takes more time/$ than you would ever imagine.
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Old 27-04-2016, 19:06   #3
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

Boy, you sure could not have picked more different boats. Nonetheless both have strong records in extended cruising. We faced a similar choice between a Skookum 53 and performance cat. We're great fans of the Skookum, especially as an expedition boat. We went with the cat.

1. Better performance under sail.

2. We prefer above deck accommodations. We like looking out the windows while in harbor. A pilothouse on an Ingrid would help, but most are like living in a cave.

3. More comfortable motion, especially downwind.

4. We have experience with multihulls. Finding moorage or haulout facilities hasn't been a problem for us.

5. Shallow draft has some benefits although most of the places we really want to explore have deep water, and draft won't be a problem.

We looked closely at an Atlantic 42. That particular example was at the end of a lot of wear cycles, and we felt it was way overpriced, so we kept looking.

While we made lists and compared features, the decision was driven by Item 1. We really like sailing at 10 to 15 and more knots. And IMHO, your friend is right. We just couldn't find the right tri.

Cheers,
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Old 27-04-2016, 19:09   #4
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

Talk about both ends of the spectrum!
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Old 28-04-2016, 10:09   #5
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

Haha thanks all! Yes they are two different beasts, only really comparable in length and bluewater cruising, old salty says ingred will take us to the gates of hell and back, which is not whst we are really after, but thats good to know. She is beautiful as the old owners fixed her all up preparing to cruise before she hit the rocks. So is the atlantic. we didn't really want the mono after owning one, it's a light fin keeled w spade Rudd, you probably know why, we were hoping someone would just praise the Ingred BC that looked like the most probable outcome.
We're not scared of the work, our 30ft was on the hard for years b4 we got her, a 68, great solid boat, beautifully strong built, solid mahogany cabin top walls, leaked front to back, mohog rotted in places, delam outer skin, totally rotted hull to deck joint, bloody keel, sinking on land, cheap paint dripping all throughout! Talk about end of its duty cycles! Standing rigging and eng replaced 10 yr ago, eng was in pieces when we got yhough, looked better than it sounds, hard to make a boat look too bad though. But she's been a great first boat for us, bounced us off more than a couple rocks, taught us everything we couldn't learn on a Hobie about sailing, and now we're proficient in fixing every boat system from bottom of keel to top of spar, stem to stern, Genny to Genny, she is loved and will be missed
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Old 28-04-2016, 10:18   #6
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

Jdazy thank you, I agree about the skookum beautiful, we would love a nice big mono, were hoping for a 40ish, something that had room, wondering what cat you got, sounds luxurious and delicious. I hear ya on the Atlantic prices, not on par with comparable multis. I don't know what's up with that, not a gunboat, just an overgrown Hobie
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Old 28-04-2016, 10:24   #7
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

Mattyc so the Atlantic is a home build, glass over cedar strip, got off her leash, hit rocks, for the second time. The owners\builders just fixed and relaunched, maybe it's getting hard to get those big $ for the Atlantic's as more performance cats hit the market. Damage is from rocks and SW. Flooded a hull, and engine, got holed one side in spots, smallish holes, she sat down when she flooded I guess, toasted a rudder, but that's about it
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Old 28-04-2016, 10:26   #8
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

Ingred same thing, broke the leash, got holed, smashed up the Rudd and shaft, cracked the log, don't think the SW flooded her though
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Old 29-04-2016, 06:01   #9
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

Sent you a PM.
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Old 29-04-2016, 06:07   #10
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

ridiculous comparison
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Old 29-04-2016, 08:13   #11
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

The cat's ride will be more comfortable under most conditions. However, the watch keepers on her will need to have a higher level of seamanship/training, in terms of what to do when situations arise.
Be it the wind speed taking a big jump, very rapidly, to avoid a sudden obstacle, due to her higher speed, & what rapid course changes can do to your AWS. Higher speeds vs. the MOB situation. Docking/maneuvering in a breeze. And a few other things.

But.. she'll let you do a lot more exploring in places where the water is thin. And you'll have a Lot more deck space, & space in general. However, the deck space thing is key, as that's where you get to relax when you're at anchor, and also is where you keep your other toys.
That, & it's Much easier to do maintenance on things, or just projects in general, on the hook, on a non-rolling platform.

Also, there's the upkeep side of things; fiscally, & time wise. A cat that size will require a Lot more $ just for her basic gear; rigging (standing & running), deck hardware, sails (due to the higher loads on them), netting/trampolines, paint, etc. Plus, you have 2 complete engines/drivetrains to 'feed". And twice as much surface area which needs TLC, & or re-fitting every so often. So the time & expense is much greater on a cat vs. the same length mono.

Do yourself a favor, & get the figures for the gear to fully re-fit each boat/fit her out from an empty hull, even to include wiring & plumbing. Odds are the differences won't be small.

If there's Any way that you can spend a few days on a bigger multi, be it a tri or a cat, that'll help you a lot. Especially if you can spend some of that time on the hook. Plus, if you can do it in the same locale where you could do the same on a mid-sized mono.
Well, there's little to match experential learning.

One other thought is that if the cat is a strip plank build, then when holed, water sometimes has a nasty habit of wicking much further along the planks inside of the glass skins than one would imagine. Which leads to needing to rebuild much more of the hull than would be apparent at first glance.

I say as much, as there was recently a thread on here, where such was mentioned. And that fact was quite a surprise to those looking at/working on the boat. As the standard mode of thinking is that the epoxy which joins the lengths of the cedar together shouldn't allow that to happen much.
So it's worth checking closely on the boat in question.

One other good reality check, is this article by Nigel Calder, about when they re-fitted their Ingrid. And how much time & expense was involved, despite his/their level of expertise.
It's quite an eye opener, unless you've been involved in the refit of several boats. And shows why "free" boats are/can be so expensive.
http://www.cruisingworld.com/how/refit-reality-check


PS: Don't let the title fool you, this book while dated, has a Very comprehensive listing of what goes into the basic fitout of a boat. And given that it costs about the price of lunch, it's worth it for that alone. http://www.amazon.com/Steel-Away-Gui...rds=steel+away
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Old 29-04-2016, 08:35   #12
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Re: Which One, Ingred 38 or CW A42 Cat

Never had a multi so cannot comment on the comparison but owned an Ingrid 38 for nearly 25 years. She was so solid that I couldn't imagine selling her until a character walked down the dock and offered me about 50% more than I had paid for her 25 years previously. Sailed her from Vancouver, BC to Alaska, around Vancouver Island twice then down the coast from Seattle to San Francico living aboard her for nearly the entire time
I had her. She is dry to weather, runs like a top downwind and very roomy for a single guy or a couple. Seaworthy, salty and dependable. Moved off the water for a couple of years then back aboard a Transpacific 49 in which you could hold a dance party!
Multis frighten me a bit, mostly due to my inexperience aboard them, finding moorage at reasonable cost and concern over the horror stories I have heard about them in a blow. But no real personal experience to speak from... Phil
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