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Old 04-09-2016, 08:30   #76
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

Yep.

Round 360 back and trucking on.

The driver scared but still functional ;-)

+1 on the seaworthy list.

THX for sharing.

b.
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Old 04-09-2016, 08:43   #77
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

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Don't you get tired of pretending to be a monkey? "You are a monkey because you think you're a monkey?"
I think therefore I am, Ken. What about you? You shop because you cannot think?

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Or wasting time on a cruisers forum since you don't seem to own a boat or go boating? Whats the point? Unless you just enjoy pestering people who enjoy things you don't have.
To find my next, but more importantly, to keep you honest.
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Old 04-09-2016, 11:59   #78
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

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Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
Objection !!!

Or do you mean 'may survive'?

And, mind you, 'survive' is simply not enough. When a small boat encounters a hurricane at sea, her crew are in extreme danger. Their boat may make it (while often will not) but the crew may not make it.

b.
I meant exactly what I said. "Virtually" means almost any, and "can" is synonymous with "may." You may/can phrase/say it differently if you like/want.

I would state that any boat and crew regardless of size that encounters a hurricane or typhoon at sea is in extreme danger. That is why my primary advice was to avoid such a situation to begin with.

I rode out Typhoon Mireille in Okinawa, Japan in a 24' San Juan moored between a breakwater and a crane barge. The workers secured chain around the concrete breakwater blocks for me to tie onto, and also allowed me to tie off to the barge. Mireille had winds just over 100 mph. A number of boats in Ginowan Marina and Kadena Marina did not fair so well. It was not in the least bit pleasant, but both I and the boat survived. I would not want to do it again.

The point of my response was to advise the OP not to look for some magical unicorn (a boat to ride out a hurricane), but to 1.) avoid storms, especially hurricanes/typhoons/cyclones; 2.) secure mooring or find a hurricane pit (other than a marina or boat yard); 3.) learn to use a parachute anchor and hold on and pray.

Oh yes...I also agree many boats are found well after the crew has abandoned ship never to be seen again. I suspect this occurs because some people have the inexplicable urge to panic and choose to place their lives in a tiny rubber raft in the middle of an already angry ocean.
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Old 04-09-2016, 11:59   #79
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
Objection !!!

Or do you mean 'may survive'?

And, mind you, 'survive' is simply not enough. When a small boat encounters a hurricane at sea, her crew are in extreme danger. Their boat may make it (while often will not) but the crew may not make it.

I believe by seaworthy we should discuss boats with live humans inside. Not 'corked bottles'.

What is your take on this matter?

b.
OK I propose we hear from all those who have been able to complete a card game, make coffee, serve it and not spill too much, while riding out a hurricane, or even a tropical storm. Which boat were you on? The card game and coffee test! Now if you were able to complete a chess game you are just showing off!
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Old 04-09-2016, 12:13   #80
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

Remember this? EXTREME experts too

Two sea anchors did not work.

OREGON / Search ended for lost sailors - SFGate

Catamaran capsize raises questions | Soundings Online

". Photographs of the upturned vessel on the beach show a line tied around the Saildrive on the starboard hull. Birst says it could have served as a tether for the life raft or for crewmen trying to stay with the capsized boat. Other pictures of the wreck show a missing forward crossbar."
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Old 04-09-2016, 13:04   #81
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

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Originally Posted by Discovery 15797 View Post
I meant exactly what I said. "Virtually" means almost any, and "can" is synonymous with "may." You may/can phrase/say it differently if you like/want.

I would state that any boat and crew regardless of size that encounters a hurricane or typhoon at sea is in extreme danger. That is why my primary advice was to avoid such a situation to begin with.

I rode out Typhoon Mireille in Okinawa, Japan in a 24' San Juan moored between a breakwater and a crane barge. The workers secured chain around the concrete breakwater blocks for me to tie onto, and also allowed me to tie off to the barge. Mireille had winds just over 100 mph. A number of boats in Ginowan Marina and Kadena Marina did not fair so well. It was not in the least bit pleasant, but both I and the boat survived. I would not want to do it again.

The point of my response was to advise the OP not to look for some magical unicorn (a boat to ride out a hurricane), but to 1.) avoid storms, especially hurricanes/typhoons/cyclones; 2.) secure mooring or find a hurricane pit (other than a marina or boat yard); 3.) learn to use a parachute anchor and hold on and pray.

Oh yes...I also agree many boats are found well after the crew has abandoned ship never to be seen again. I suspect this occurs because some people have the inexplicable urge to panic and choose to place their lives in a tiny rubber raft in the middle of an already angry ocean.
Yes. I can hear you.

Many ways to express same or very close concepts.

Panic is the norm and non panic is either a trained skill (within limits, racers, military, etc.) or else a rare personality trait. Nothing we have plenty of control over.

In the cruising aspect, most cruisers will have zero previous exposure when they get involved into their first extreme wx adventure.

One cannot live to 'stay in port when in doubt' theme and get rough wx experience at the same time. Modern wx forecasting services and the culture of avoiding all risk leads to panicking one day further down the road. At times in conditions that other sailors may consider lumpy and extremely unpleasant, but not truly dangerous.

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Old 04-09-2016, 13:04   #82
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

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Remember this? EXTREME experts too

Two sea anchors did not work.

Catamaran capsize raises questions | Soundings Online
Many of these stories impact many fellow sailors here in the PNW.

But, the first statement in the SoundingsOnline says it all. "Three sailors are presumed dead after setting out on a delivery despite a forecast of heavy weather." SF to Neah Bay is notoriously known as a graveyard of ships for good reason. It is a very rough passage. Many ppl either choose to "harbor hop" down the coast about 25 miles offshore and head into one of the few ports if there are any signs of bad weather. (Of course this usually means crossing a bar which can also be treacherous.) A second choice for this passage is to get far off the coast 150-250 miles and hope to ride out a storm.

Also, deploying a sea-anchor within 100 miles of shore goes against typical heavy weather practices. Within 10 miles of shore a vessel could easily drift into trouble.

Even "experts" can occasionally make poor judgements or decisions.
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Old 04-09-2016, 13:25   #83
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

I think this is then the boat the OP wants:

http://cms.traderclassifieds.com.au/...om.au/TAB3.jpg

And this is the development one:



Cheers,
b.
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Old 04-09-2016, 13:52   #84
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
I think this is then the boat the OP wants:

http://cms.traderclassifieds.com.au/...om.au/TAB3.jpg

And this is the development one:



Cheers,
b.
Well she's no HC! Stainless steel keel and lead bulb though... wow... but only 28hp Yanmar?
BTW anyone read "God Forsaken Sea?"
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Old 04-09-2016, 14:32   #85
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

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Well she's no HC! Stainless steel keel and lead bulb though... wow... but only 28hp Yanmar?

(...)
Well, not a HC, but meets some of OP intent: very hard to wipe out, when goes turtle - known to return with rig intact and skipper shaken but no panic ... keep calm and sail on ""

28hp engine pretty normal in a racing boat. They are light and keep on sailing while cruisers may have been motoring for hours. All good sailing boats (or more adequately: boats that sail well) need only a small engine.

Have not read "God Forsaken Sea" yet. Will check out online now.

THX for sharing,
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Old 04-09-2016, 14:53   #86
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

I have a sailboat that is so water tight I think it would be the best option.
Welded aluminum it is built like a submarine.
At sea I don't think weather could beat it, but I might do something stupid that would.
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Old 04-09-2016, 16:10   #87
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Discovery 15797 View Post
Many of these stories impact many fellow sailors here in the PNW.

But, the first statement in the SoundingsOnline says it all. "Three sailors are presumed dead after setting out on a delivery despite a forecast of heavy weather." SF to Neah Bay is notoriously known as a graveyard of ships for good reason. It is a very rough passage. Many ppl either choose to "harbor hop" down the coast about 25 miles offshore and head into one of the few ports if there are any signs of bad weather. (Of course this usually means crossing a bar which can also be treacherous.) A second choice for this passage is to get far off the coast 150-250 miles and hope to ride out a storm.
As I remember they had some constraints on the delivery; hence why they were hired. I don't remember the follow up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Discovery 15797 View Post
Also, deploying a sea-anchor within 100 miles of shore goes against typical heavy weather practices. Within 10 miles of shore a vessel could easily drift into trouble.

Even "experts" can occasionally make poor judgements or decisions.
I believe it was a "hail Mary" attempt. The purpose is to STOP drift from wind and slow the boat as well as keep her headed.

A sad and terrible story that affected us all out west.
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Old 04-09-2016, 16:40   #88
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

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28hp engine pretty normal in a racing boat. They are light and keep on sailing while cruisers may have been motoring for hours. All good sailing boats (or more adequately: boats that sail well) need only a small engine
b.
Oh, yes, but I seem to recall some folks saying they used their engines in big storms to maintain control of the boat... bigger storms need bigger engines! Well for some I guess, but I think if I find myself there I hope I have one of those new-fangled, super-duper, fool-proof, para-anchors... and, yes, I confess, a HC would be nice, maybe even nicer that my Rhodes 41 idea... but I'd still be up for trying it!
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Old 04-09-2016, 17:03   #89
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

I have survived many named storms and one hurricane, and my choice for a safe, solid boat would be a Cabo Rico 42 or 45.
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Old 04-09-2016, 17:53   #90
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Re: Which is the most seaworthy sailboat model you can think of?

It is not just the materials. Welded alloy is great BUT how it was designed, welded and put together counts too.

Not too long ago, there was an Eastern European custom welded alloy boat in Norway - one built for ice, storms etc (think of Blakes' Tara knock off ...).

She looked great. All it took was a single big wave and she came back with broken rigging, some dents, and her 'go everywhere' crew radioing for help ...

Southern Ocean racing is a great testing ground for such boats/ideas as they tend to flip up there more often than anywhere else.

I think grp, alloy, steel all have proven their value in such designs.

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