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Old 08-03-2016, 09:45   #1
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When You Bought Yours First Boat....

Hi all

I'm in the moment that after saw many different boat i'm getting my idea on what i really want/need/preference/characteristics, ecc even i still need/want to visit much many more boat...

What made you decide ok i want this boat?
It means, how did you decide that THAT boat was your next-first boat?
You know when you look at so many boat that you wanted it all for a month and then (maybe) decide? But you know it will be worst

Did you just "calculated"(meaning get a vote from 1 to 5 for all the caracteristics, get an average and match it with all the other boats you visited, the best voted by you boat win , if i like it living inside i'll buy it) wich boat is for you, get it, visited it like it would be yours then made an offer?

Thanks all
Stef
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Old 08-03-2016, 09:55   #2
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

For me it had to do with boats I'd been racing on, but my first boat wasn't a cruising boat. If you mean first cruising boat, looks probably had 90% to do with it! Which may not be a good thing....
With hindsight:
-I would worry less about a particular interior arrangement than other things like build quality and condition and reputation.
-I designed the interior in my first real cruising boat, and it cost me more to do so. What I learned in retrospect is everything inside a boat is compromise. You want a bigger head? You going to live without a wet locker or a sleeping length settee etc.
-I would take specifications with a big grain of salt. Evaluate them, but dont let them become your most important factor.What you want is a sweet sailing forgiving boat. A good example of this might be the Crealock boats sold by Pacific Seacraft; they are a bit old school, longer overhangs, shorter waterlines etc than many more modern boats. But they have a reputation for being sweet boats. Many Albergs, Mason's etc do too.
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Old 08-03-2016, 09:56   #3
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

I picked the first one that was seaworthy and that I could afford.
Except it wasn't and I couldn't.


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Old 08-03-2016, 09:58   #4
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
For me it had to do with boats I'd been racing on, but my first boat wasn't a cruising boat. If you mean first cruising boat, looks probably had 90% to do with it! Which may not be a good thing....

Yes..only cruising and liveaboard...
Do you mean i should just "calculate" the best boat with the average best charcteristics?
Thanks
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:01   #5
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

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Originally Posted by RoryD View Post
I picked the first one that was seaworthy and that I could afford.
Except it wasn't and I couldn't.


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LOL

So you are still looking for?

I even "thought" about get the first one that i like and f.sc.k everything else, more or less all the boat are the same, they float, they sails, they have a table, they have a deck and a bed...

Otherwise at the end of this summer i will be on my laptop looking at pictures of boats
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:04   #6
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

I am assuming you plan to start with a liveaboard/cruising boat? Or are you looking for a first boat to learn on?

When we started sailing we learned on 14' Capris and Lidos. But we were subscribing to Cruising World magazine and through all those slick, glossy ads we fell in love with the Cape Dory boats, which were in their prime then. About a year into our sailing experience we saw a 19' Cape Dory Typhoon, I think it was only 2 years old, for sale and we were absolute goners. At the time we were not looking for a cruising boat, just a good boat to develop our skills on, and one we felt comfortable with, and she was a head turner too (in our estimation). I guess you could say we fell in love, if you can love an inanimate object. That boat never disappointed us in any way. She had excellent sailing characteristics and was just a joy to own.

Over the years we have "grown into" our boats. We have owned over a dozen of them at this point of varying makes, models, and designs. Some racy fin keelers, some heavy full keelers, some in between. In the end we still found we loved the same kind of boat the most, long keel, cutaway forefoot, graceful overhangs, traditional interiors, sloop rig. Basically Carl Alberg and similar designs, and the Cape Dory was still at the very top of our short list. When we saw our current boat, even in her state of distress, it was again love at first sight. Even faced with an extensive rebuild we never questioned the decision to buy her for a moment. I guess that's how you know.
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:13   #7
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

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Originally Posted by oldragbaggers View Post
I am assuming you plan to start with a liveaboard/cruising boat? Or are you looking for a first boat to learn on?

When we started sailing we learned on 14' Capris and Lidos. But we were subscribing to Cruising World magazine and through all those slick, glossy ads we fell in love with the Cape Dory boats, which were in their prime then. About a year into our sailing experience we saw a 19' Cape Dory Typhoon, I think it was only 2 years old, for sale and we were absolute goners. At the time we were not looking for a cruising boat, just a good boat to develop our skills on, and one we felt comfortable with, and she was a head turner too (in our estimation). I guess you could say we fell in love, if you can love an inanimate object. That boat never disappointed us in any way. She had excellent sailing characteristics and was just a joy to own.

Over the years we have "grown into" our boats. We have owned over a dozen of them at this point of varying makes, models, and designs. Some racy fin keelers, some heavy full keelers, some in between. In the end we still found we loved the same kind of boat the most, long keel, cutaway forefoot, graceful overhangs, traditional interiors, sloop rig. Basically Carl Alberg and similar designs, and the Cape Dory was still at the very top of our short list. When we saw our current boat, even in her state of distress, it was again love at first sight. Even faced with an extensive rebuild we never questioned the decision to buy her for a moment. I guess that's how you know.
First boat owning and yes cruising and liveaboard, as in italy right now it would be impossible for us buy a boat (even a 20 ft, because taxes+marina+taxes again+ boat's mafia i would buy a new 20 ft boat every 2 years...) so we go directly "big" , quitting paying a flat's rent were we are living now...

Thanks for your message
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:16   #8
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

Quote:
Originally Posted by stefano_ita View Post
Yes..only cruising and liveaboard...
Do you mean i should just "calculate" the best boat with the average best charcteristics?
Thanks
No, but I mean don't let your heart insist you buy a boat because you just liked how it looked. Use a balanced approach: looks, reputation, data.
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:25   #9
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

To buy the best boat in my budget which had resale market liquidity. I.e. I can sell it immediately if I set a fair price.

All those funny ratios s/d etc mean nothing, really, to me.
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:25   #10
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

There seem to be two "schools" of boat buying:

1. Find a size range and shop around to get one that "fits" in your pocketbook and "heart"

2. Determine what you actually WANT and search for a quality example of just that boat

I have NEVER done #1. To me, just my opinion, it makes little sense. For example, for simple recreational (vs. BWB) boats, the differences between, say, a Cal 34 and a Catalina 34 are HUGE. The heads and saloon layouts down below are vastly different. The Cal galley is along the entire starboard side, while the Catalina 34 is L shaped. The aft head on the Catalina, I think, is far superior.

We did #2 for all our boats: Catalinas all: 22, 25 and 34. Before we bought the 22 we did our research and homework, looking at Merit 22s, Merit 25s, West Wight Potters, Macgregors, Venutres, etc. We found an excellent 1981 C22 in 1983.

In 1986-87 we looked for an entire year for a C25 and found a 1981 in excellent condition.

In 1997-98, we looked for an entire year for our C34 and saw many horrible examples of neglect and abuse until we found "our" boat which was in better condition than some new ones due to the add-ons the PO had done.

Of course, if what you have your heart set on is not widely available, you have a different issue.

Your boat, your choice.

Good luck.
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:26   #11
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

Quote:
Originally Posted by stefano_ita View Post
It means, how did you decide that THAT boat was your next-first boat?
I knew what I wanted, and what I didn't want, so selecting boats wasn't too hard. There are always loads and loads of boats for sale here in the Netherlands, but only a few checked all the boxes on my list.

You were all over the map when you started posting, and I think you still are maybe? The problem with that is that when you have no clear idea of what you're looking for, you can't really select boats and you can't see the forest for the trees.

I can only tell you how I went about it, which is just one way of doing it. For looking online (where you can find most boats for sale these days anyway):

Before I started looking to buy, I knew the length (min 28 and max 33 in my case), hull material (plastic, pref. no teak decks), and type of layout (no dinette, berths / settees need to be long and wide enough, L shaped galley etc etc).

On the boats that checked these boxes, I'd select further. First ones to go were all the sad and neglected looking ones and the ones without clear, recent pics and/or enough information.

Next, I checked asking prices. Anything that looked reasonable and above budget: not an option. Overpriced boats that should be within budget provided the owner wasn't an idiot, I kept (Lizzy Belle was one of those).

By this time, most boats would be gone Those left I gave a serious look and dropped a few because of whatever I didn't like about them that wasn't easily fixed (could be anything from just not liking the lines to serious issues).

Those left (not too long a list anymore) I printed out and I made a 'top 10' - boats with a keel stepped mast above deck stepped, privately sold above brokers etc - just my personal preferences. I made appointments to go and see my top 5. Lizzy Belle was in that top 5, and (long story short) the owner had more sense then the broker and accepted my offer (which was well below asking).

On edit:
This was not my first boat - I bought my first boat when I was 16, about 25 yrs ago. I spent my whole life on boats of all sorts and shapes, which does make it easier cos you have a better understanding of what you like and dislike.

What I did NOT do: look for a "seaworthy" or "ocean worthy" boat or select by makes. Since pretty much any well built and maintained boat can go wherever you want, it really isn't something you can select on unless you want to limit yourself to whatever makes 'the masses' or 'the interwebs' and marketing have decided fit that bill ...
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:31   #12
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

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Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
No, but I mean don't let your heart insist you buy a boat because you just liked how it looked. Use a balanced approach: looks, reputation, data.
Only look obviously no, but i'm talking about thinking like: this one is ok but smal cockpit table and mainsail's rails just in fron of the helm, but maybe another one that has german sheeting on the roof that is good for comfort has sail area/displ of 17, while the other was 20, or while the other has a boat of better quality/brand but maybe has a volvo saildrive or even a in mast furling mainsails...one better and bigger heads, the other less vertical stair to get inside...one has better looking interior but uncomfortable galley or saloon...

How to get rid of the idea?

Let's say 70% quality, seaworthiness, comfort, pratical, objective's data valutation and the rest 30% personal valutation= i get this one...

I'll get crazy
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:35   #13
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When You Bought Yours First Boat....

I thought I knew what I wanted, a starter boat that I could re-sell easily. That is not what I ended up buying. I looked diligently at all kinds of boats, eventually ending up after months and literally thousands of miles driving with what I have.
I initially wanted a boat to see if we liked the experience for lack of a better term, boat I have now was meant to determine that, and be sold to buy a "better" or at least newer, better equipped boat, but she sort of grew on us and it became "the" boat.
Finances and my desire to perform all the equipment installs myself drove that decision to a large extent.

Seen more than one buy more boat than they can really afford, and not being able to afford to go, keeps them at dock.

I did have a check list of features I wanted and looked for those.


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Old 08-03-2016, 10:40   #14
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

Quote:
Originally Posted by stefano_ita View Post
Only look obviously no, but i'm talking about thinking like: this one is ok but smal cockpit table and mainsail's rails just in fron of the helm, but maybe another one that has german sheeting on the roof that is good for comfort has sail area/displ of 17, while the other was 20, or while the other has a boat of better quality/brand but maybe has a volvo saildrive or even a in mast furling mainsails...one better and bigger heads, the other less vertical stair to get inside...one has better looking interior but uncomfortable galley or saloon...

How to get rid of the idea?

Let's say 70% quality, seaworthiness, comfort, pratical, objective's data valutation and the rest 30% personal valutation= i get this one...

I'll get crazy
I agree about the saildrive!!!!

In order to make an educated choice without knowledge (everyone of us had to start a zero - none of was born knowing about boats) we ALL did our homework and research.

Two great sources for me were:

Desirable and Undesirable Characteristics of Yacht Design

and

Calder's Cruisers Handbook

Both of these books explain what works and what doesn't. If you haven't read them, you should.

Good luck.
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Old 08-03-2016, 10:46   #15
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Re: When You Bought Yours First Boat....

We had lists of "must have" features, "really would prefer" features, "we could fix it with an aftermarket add-on" features, "unattractive" features, and "absolutely can't live with" features.

We compared candidate boats to that list. A few others came close enough to buy, but when we found the first that we actually did buy -- we instantly recognized that was the one. (And then we compared to the list to be sure we hadn't missed something.)


Turned out to be a really good boat. Except for the ladder to the flying bridge, we could probably live with that boat even today... although I'd be probably investigating retro-fitting a circular staircase to replace the original ladder.

-Chris
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