Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 25-04-2014, 14:25   #61
Senior Cruiser
 
Cheechako's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 19,369
Re: What builder makes good quality full keel sailboats?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Neely View Post
This is not correct when it comes to the yard statement. Many Hans Christians where made in similar yards but of the main line of has christians they where all separate. For instance our HC33 along with all HC33 that where made pre87 where built in the Hansa yard, only a few 41/43s where built there as well. You named off a lot of Taiwanese boats, almost none of them shared the same yard. Just because the boats where built in Taiwan doesn't mean they all have the same quality. Our family sailboat is a Mason 43. Masons where built in the Ta Shing yard along with Babas and Panda and Toshibia/flying Dutchman's I Believe. When you look at the Hansa Vs the Ta Shing yard I can spot pretty quickly the quality difference from the layup of the hull to the welds in the steel. Now when you start comparing this to Formosas... sorry formosa owners but these other yards where in a different category. We have Friends the cruise a CT41, while I think they are cool and so do the owners, they could immediately tell the difference of quality when stepping on our boat. They Should, the CT was always a low cost Taiwan cruiser compared to Hans Christians. I was on a Late 70's HC38 and the quality of it shocked me (in a bad way) compared to our Hansa. There are also areas on my boat that is shake my head.... We have had non of the Stainless problems that most other Taiwan boats have. Please don't take this a snappy or mean, just trying to share some info.

Cheers,

Jon
Glad somebody straightened this out as I was about to. No comparison between a Formosa and a Ta Shing built boat.
__________________

__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard











Cheechako is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-04-2014, 16:07   #62
Senior Cruiser
 
Jim Cate's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 11,467
Re: What builder makes good quality full keel sailboats?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
Glad somebody straightened this out as I was about to. No comparison between a Formosa and a Ta Shing built boat.
You guys better watch out! Zee can get folks to come knee-cap you for statements like that!

Jim
__________________

__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II , lying Port Cygnet, Tasmania once again
Jim Cate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-04-2014, 16:31   #63
Senior Cruiser
 
Cheechako's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 19,369
Re: What builder makes good quality full keel sailboats?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
You guys better watch out! Zee can get folks to come knee-cap you for statements like that!

Jim
err....ahh.... yeah... last I heard Zee is still rebuilding her....eerr... Formosa.
Nothing wrong with those boats, just sayin'... Ta Shing is probably the best in the world if your boat style includes "furniture" as well as good quality.... Unfortunately, I think Ta Shing moved up to 80 foot or bigger years ago....mostly power. They know where the money is I guess....
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard











Cheechako is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-04-2014, 19:17   #64
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Boston, MA
Boat: Bristol 38.8
Posts: 1,625
Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

Don't the Island Piglets still use a Scheel keel?
__________________
Curmudgeon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2014, 05:01   #65
Registered User
 
Polux's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Portugal/Med
Boat: Comet 41s
Posts: 5,765
Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pauls View Post
Polux,
The numbers you are quoting, from a variety of manufacturers, are based on "light boat" conditions. I suspect that "light boat" for some of these guys is really "empty boat". The poster is interested in a cruiser. He is going to be carrying a lot of gear. The only SA/D ratio that will mean anything to him is the fully loaded one.

The SA/D's I was giving refered to loaded condition. Yeah, sure, "loaded" means different things to different people. And if somebody is willing to travel really light they can have pretty high SA/Ds. But if they're carrying supplies for 6 months, several anchors, lots of tools and spares, a good tender, 300' of chain, etc etc than the ULDB SA/Ds come down quite a bit.
SA/D are always calculated on the given displacement by the manufacturer that is normally a light boat, being them modern or old boats.

The difference between old cruisers and modern cruisers in what regards SA/D is very big to the point as modern cruisers being classified as racers on old SA/D calculators.
Polux is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2014, 06:44   #66
Senior Cruiser
 
DoubleWhisky's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Home at Warsaw, Poland, boat in Eastern Med
Boat: Ocean Star 56.1 LR
Posts: 1,841
Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

I can be completely wrong, but I was under impression that SA/D ratio is useful mainly to compare boats with hulls having quite similar prismatic coefficient...
__________________
DoubleWhisky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-04-2014, 08:36   #67
Registered User
 
Polux's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Portugal/Med
Boat: Comet 41s
Posts: 5,765
Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

Not prismatic coefficient but finesse coefficient ( CF or waterplane coefficient). The Water plane coefficient on a well designed boat has a lot to do with wet area/displacement and a beamier light modern boat will not have necessarily a bigger CF than an heavier narrower boat of the same size. It can be quite the contrary.

These drawings from Finot explain the two situations in what regards CF between an heavy narrower boat and a lighter beamier boat while sailing:





SA/D is a measure of the boat power and also of the boat stiffness and stability (till Max RM). It is related with the boat speed in light winds and also with the wind needed to reach hull speed (bigger the SA/D less wind force will be needed).
__________________

Polux is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
builder, keel, sail, sailboat

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
marine survey advice Ardi Monohull Sailboats 13 28-02-2013 18:07
Need Help Setting up my Battery Monitor Jbaffoh Electrical: Batteries, Generators & Solar 46 07-11-2012 13:48
Capsize Ratio's topfish Monohull Sailboats 266 06-07-2012 19:44
For Sale: Cruising Guides and Sailing Resource Books svdreamkeeper Classifieds Archive 3 23-11-2011 12:24
Tartan or Sabre ? Here's a Couple of Examples Jbingham Monohull Sailboats 29 31-08-2011 13:50



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:43.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.