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Old 22-09-2013, 22:20   #31
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Full keel is a dinosaur stuck in the past thing. The only full keels built are for nostalgia so it's no wonder that it's hard to find any.

For offshore work, fin keels and spade rudders are king
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Old 22-09-2013, 22:57   #32
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Re: What builder makes good quality full keel sailboats?

Well built fin keel boats with strong spade rudders are king. Some on this board believe no matter how cheap they are built (Cyclades) or how light they are built they are good to go. Then fellows like John Neal who is an experienced sail/teacher won't even allow one of these models on his "approved" list of offshore boats. So what good are opinions from experienced sailors, really?
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Old 22-09-2013, 23:34   #33
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Re: What builder makes good quality full keel sailboats?

I agree that full keels are from the dinosaur age and I admire a lot about the Sundeers. Having met the Dashews in mexico and Tahiti, I thought they were very nice people, but why did they have to make a cruising boat so ugly. I realize that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but the Sundeer are much like the maligned full keel boats that are under rigged and have to depend on huge fuel tanks to turn in good passages. ____oops, I guess this will cause an argument. _____Grant.
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Old 23-09-2013, 04:12   #34
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I agree that full keels are from the dinosaur age and I admire a lot about the Sundeers. Having met the Dashews in mexico and Tahiti, I thought they were very nice people, but why did they have to make a cruising boat so ugly. I realize that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but the Sundeer are much like the maligned full keel boats that are under rigged and have to depend on huge fuel tanks to turn in good passages. ____oops, I guess this will cause an argument. _____Grant.
I guess there are all kinds of people, incl. those who, when left without anything meaningful to say, resort to childish and ignorant posts like this. Not worth my powder
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Old 23-09-2013, 06:00   #35
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

Whatever your opinion on Dashews designs one thing is for sure, he knew how to make a proper spade rudder that is almost bullet proof. As far as speed under sail under the right conditions his designs make very quick passages under sail and go like hell under motor. As far as esthetics well everyone has their own opinions but personally most people only get to look at the stern of these boats and not for long.
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Old 23-09-2013, 06:50   #36
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

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So, I was wondering what full keel sailboats are built well and can sail well because of a nice sized rig?

Eric
Back to Eric's post.

It is in the rig (enough S.A.) but to similar extent it is in the hull (shape/volume).

Displacement can be distributed in a number of ways and the hulls will have varied hydrodynamic characteristics with different volume, sail carrying ability, wetted surface, etc.

Long keel NOT = Long keel.

We are in a long keel boat and sometimes we look at same LWL boats that have twice (sic!) our displacement. They never have twice our SA ... but they may have way more space inside ...

You must also think about the part of the world where you are and your typical wind/sea state conditions. Designs that may look 'too heavy' on paper may in fact outperform the 'right' designs in choppy waters / high winds.

Just my free floating musings.

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Old 23-09-2013, 10:59   #37
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

You guys can fight out this relatively useless argument. All that matters to me is how she responds to me when I take the helm. A responsive and balanced boat is a beautiful thing. The only time I look down there is when something needs fixing. To compare her legs with another boat just doesn't make sense. That is not why I bought the boat.
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Old 23-09-2013, 11:09   #38
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

I'm glad someone mentioned Island Packets. We looked seriously at one and my husband (who really is not a full keel fan) had to admit that it sailed and pointed higher much better than he anticipated. He still could not get over the aesthetics- either they work for you or they don't but he had to admit it's performance shocked the heck out of him.
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Old 23-09-2013, 12:18   #39
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

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(...)

A responsive and balanced boat is a beautiful thing.

(...)
Try Farr 40 or alike, bet you will like.

b.
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Old 23-09-2013, 12:36   #40
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

A couple of areas that the long keel boats have to overcome is wetted surface, some of that can be equaled by more sail area to handle lighter winds.
Depending on draft, pointing may be an issue although deep draft long keel boats will often point very well.
If a long (full) keeled boat is well designed it can sail much better than many people think and many of them will out sail fin keel boats in the trades winds.
BUT if you have a well designed fin keel boat its going to be the fastest. In certain conditions the heavy displacement yachts have a very nice motion at sea. Don't be fooled and think that all full keel boats have long graceful overhangs and short waterlines because some of them like the BC Cutter are almost all waterline.
So not all full keeled boats sail alike just like not all fin keel boats sail alike.
I can tell you that a Cape George cutter will give any boat her size a damn good run in the trades, maybe not win but a damn good run.
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Old 23-09-2013, 12:42   #41
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

Very few boats actually have the "full" keel. Most have the forefoot cut away a lot. A severe detriment if trying to heave-to in large seas. (any boat will heave to in relatively flat water) But many of the boats with the cutaway forefoot (mentioned above) are great sailors and track well.
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Old 23-09-2013, 12:44   #42
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

Same with Skookum, no longer produced, but still many around the PNW, our 47' made a very good showing against lighter, supposedly faster boats, that sailed the BC ~ Maui race. I now have the 53' and I like her motion, and if I never get more than 7 or 8 kts, that is fine, I am not racing. I am about the ride.
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Old 23-09-2013, 17:17   #43
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I've been sailing a beautiful Morris Leigh 30 for the past 3 summers. The more I sail her the more I'm impressed. She sails well in light air and screams in winds 12 knots and up out performing much larger designs. She loves winds 20 - 30 providing easy sail reduction with the cutter sail plan, and speeds surpassing hull speed without burying the rail and upsetting the Admiral. Chenega is dry and with a following sea holds her course with fingertip control. For a crew of two extended cruising is a real joy. Hull #1, it's more than I can ask for in a 30 footer.
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Old 23-09-2013, 19:22   #44
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

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I've been sailing a beautiful Morris Leigh 30 for the past 3 summers. The more I sail her the more I'm impressed. She sails well in light air and screams in winds 12 knots and up out performing much larger designs. She loves winds 20 - 30 providing easy sail reduction with the cutter sail plan, and speeds surpassing hull speed without burying the rail and upsetting the Admiral. Chenega is dry and with a following sea holds her course with fingertip control. For a crew of two extended cruising is a real joy. Hull #1, it's more than I can ask for in a 30 footer.
Sweet boats ,one day the fellow that laid those lines to paper will be famous!!
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Old 23-09-2013, 20:36   #45
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Re: What Builder Makes Good Quality Full Keel Sailboats?

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I've been sailing a beautiful Morris Leigh 30 for the past 3 summers. The more I sail her the more I'm impressed. She sails well in light air and screams in winds 12 knots and up out performing much larger designs. She loves winds 20 - 30 providing easy sail reduction with the cutter sail plan, and speeds surpassing hull speed without burying the rail and upsetting the Admiral. Chenega is dry and with a following sea holds her course with fingertip control. For a crew of two extended cruising is a real joy. Hull #1, it's more than I can ask for in a 30 footer.
aways liked the looks and frugal weight approach to those boats. Very Nice!
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