Wauquiez Gladiateur or ?

[stipakb]

I am considering buying a Wauquiez 33 Gladiateur for cruising - to Mexico and maybe beyond.

I have also considered more traditional cruising designs: Valiant 32, Pacific Seacraft 34, Cape Dory 33. These boats differ from the Wauquiez 33 in:

1. elongated fin keel or cutaway full keel, versus higher-aspect fin keel
2. less beamy (10 to 10.4, vs. 11)
3. slightly greater displacement (11.8k to 13.5k, vs. 11k).
4. shorter LWL (24.5 to 26.3 vs. 27.3)
5. substantially heavier, measured by Disp/LWL (300 to 404, vs. 253)

If selecting a Wauquiez 33 compared to a Valiant 32, Pacific Seacraft 34, or Cape Dory 33, how much would I give up in tracking stability and in seakindliness in strong conditions?

Thanks for any comments!

Brian Stipak
Portland, Oregon

[John Drake]

I think you would find that the Gladiator gives up nothing compared with the other boats. All are good choices and all are of good quality. None are superior to the Wauquiez in terms of seakindliness, tracking and stability. The longer LWL of the Glad and greater beam would argue that she would pitch and roll to a lesser degree. Displacement on all of the boats mentioned is moderately heavy by modern standards, with one being very heavy.

You would not go wrong with any of those choices. So...chose based on the condition the boat is in (Buy the one in the best condition) and chose the one that gives you space, storage and nicely sized berths. See each of them and measure the critical areas....measure the dimensions of the berths, head, settees and galley. Keep in mind that more LWL and beam often give you more interior space. Should be interesting.

Hope this helps, just wanted to jump in since no one else did.

Best
John

[Hiracer]

I owned a Wauquiez Gladiateur for three years. So, this is not dispassonate advice.

The W is better built that the other three. I have been on HalbergRassy. The W is better built than HR too.

The W is a great sailer. Her only debit in that department is in short steep seas found in shallow bays she once (and only once) got hobbyhorsing on me--from that pretty IOR stern. But conditions were so ugly that day (we were the ONLY boat out and even we turned around) that I'm not totally convinced it was the boat's fault. I managed to spear a wave up to the mast, twice, until we turned around and ran.

Fuel tankage is very low, stock, something like only 17 gallons. That's fixable.

I grew to love the saildrive. The boat was quiet and bone dry below. Spiders and webs in the bilge. I miss that. Oh, not that it's needed, but she does have a real bilge from the keel stub.

She has an IOR rig. Big foretriangle. I didn't have roller furling. It was managable. BTY, with the 100% jib in 25 knots that boat is a thing of beauty. She loves windward in anything over 6 knots, but especially over 17 knots when I could put the genoa away.

The head of the quarterberth is your seat for the nav station. Ergo, in the rain the quarterberth head gets wet from nav work. That's fixable. Cover it.

Tracking: not an issue. She has a skeg and plenty big enough rudder. Windward, I could lock the wheel and go five miles (no ****) without touching the wheel.

Ws were imported into this country during the early to mid-1980s when the Frank fell against the Dollar, big time. It was a high end boat, sold at a realistic price because of the currency situation. When the currency corrected, the importation stopped. She is one of those rare finds, a dislocation in the market place.

I have been told that in the 1980s Lloyds of London had an internal ranking of boat yards wordwide. Wauquiez was number 5. None of the American builders were in the top ten. Not Morris, Hinckley, Shannon, Pacific Seacraft, etc.

Practical Sailor did a rather glowing review of the Pretorian, the 35' big sister to the Gladiator. I met a guy who owned both, first a Gladiateur and later the Pretorian. He claimed that the Gladiateur was the better sailor.

After being boatless for six years, I was seriously thinking of another Wauquiez when I found the steel boat I have now. I would do another W in a heartbeat if I hadn't found current boat. Few boats that size can match W to windward. Plus, she has no real bad habits, so the design is solid, and the build is top ranked. Easy call from my perspective.

[Hiracer]

WAUQUIEZ GLADIATEUR

INPUTS
Lh = 9,99 m
Lwl = 8,30 m
Bmax = 3,35 m
Bwl = 3,20 m
Draught T = 1,80 m
Body draught Tc = 0,60 m
Moulded depth H = 1,72 m
Disp = 5000 kg
Ballast = 2200 kg
Sail area = 48,36 m2
Mast height = 14,89 m
Heeling Arm = 6,68 m
Power = 18,4 KW


OUTPUTS
Length/Beam Ratio (2Lwl + Lh)/3B = 2,65
Lwl/Bwl Ratio Lwl/Bwl = 2,59
Length/Draught Ratio Lh/T = 5,55
Beam/Draught Ratio Bmax/T = 1,86
WL beam/Body draught Bwl/Tc = 5,33
Ballast/Disp Ratio W/Disp = 0,44
Displacement/Length Ratio D/L = 243,90
Sail Area/Disp. Ratio SA/D = 16,81
Sail Area/Wetted surface SA/WS = 2,12
Power/ Disp. Ratio HP/D = 2,27 HP/ton
Hull speed HSPD = 6,99 Kn
Potential Maximum Speed PMS = 7,68 Kn
Velocity Ratio VR = 1,10
Best motoring speed (1.1) CSPD = 5,74 Kn
Capsize Safety Factor CSF = 1,98
Motion Comfort Ratio MCR = 24,04
Roll Period T = 2,76 Sec
Roll Acceleration Acc = 0,11 G's
Stability Index SI = 0,82
Angle of Vanishing Stability AVS = 125 º
Dellenbaugh Angle DA = 16,86 º (14 kn wind)
Wind pressure coefficient WPC = 1,25

Estimated STIX 41,89


Ballast/Dsplacement Ratio - Boat Design Forums

[Franco]

Originally Posted by Hiracer

I have been told that in the 1980s Lloyds of London had an internal ranking of boat yards wordwide. Wauquiez was number 5. None of the American builders were in the top ten. Not Morris, Hinckley, Shannon, Pacific Seacraft, etc.

Do you recall what other names were in the top 10?

[Hiracer]

Sorry, I was not told the top ten, only that Wauquiez was number 5 and that none of the American makers were top ten.

I have no real idea if there is any truth to it. It was just something somebody (chief of police) told me.

[emagin]

Check the stats for the boats you want to compare in the cruising boat spreadsheet - link in signature.