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Old 19-05-2015, 17:19   #1
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Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

Greetings. What is the best way, if possible, to use the boom of a 38 foot sailboat to lift out the perkins. I think this is extreme but some old sea dawg told me its the way they did it back in the day. Thanks in advance for any advice.

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Old 19-05-2015, 18:04   #2
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

In my opinión you should hire a crane, the old iron is heavy as hell, mine 4236 is about
500kg with the trany, yours could be around 400 ,, to much for a boom, just saying...
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Old 19-05-2015, 19:35   #3
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

Your engine should weigh 464 pounds without the gears.

Unless your boom is very high it might be difficult to raise the engine high enough to clear the gunnel assuming you are putting it over the side. I removed and reinstalled a Yanmar 4JH 4 times using my main halyard and some creative rigging.
I put a block on the main halyard and led it to a cleat aft so I could keep the lifting line directly over the engine. Then I winched the engine straight up and maneuvered it with the help of some other tending lines.
I took the engine from the bowels of a CSY 44 to the forward deck and back without incident..
If you are sure your winch can handle the load...IE it is through bolted and not just screwed into the mast. There is no reason you should not be able to move the engine.

You need to be overly cautious and never get under the load.
Never get between the load and the direction it would swing if it became free.
Make sure whoever helps understands how to manage a line on a cleat to control the load. (this is very important!!)
Understand all the risks such as what will happen to your boat should you drop 500 lbs on the deck.
Just bumping the boat will damage whatever it touches.
Make sure every cleat you would use is through bolted and has backing plates.

Once rigged raise the engine enough so it is free from the engine mounts and then wait a few minutes. You should know right away if the winch will handle the load.

If you can handle all that....Why not do it.
Sailors should be self sufficient in all things. You have lines and winches!

If you can't be sure about the cleats and winches you will use... plan B of course....
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Old 19-05-2015, 19:37   #4
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

I'd say that the halyard would likely be okay for it, assuming that it's in good condition, & not undersized, etc. Although, when's the last time you unbolted your winch, to check for corrosion in it's base, as well as the integrity of the deck in it's vicinity?
Ditto on inspecting your masthead sheave. As if it's composite, & has been aged by time, & the Sun, then it too could be a terminally weak link in the chain. So to speak.

But if you're talking about suspending that kind of weight from the end of the boom, you also have to consider how much compression load that it would be putting on to the goose neck.
And if you go with some kind of sling setup, wrapped around the boom, you're likely to terminally dimple it, with that kind of point load.

Is you boom short enough to act as an ad hoc gin pole, or derrick arm if supported by the halyard? For this kind of lifting operation I mean.

Still, with all of the above, my vote would be for a crane or fork lift as well. Then you get the benefit of some professional expertise, as well as machinery.
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Old 19-05-2015, 21:29   #5
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

I did it no problem.
We removed the transmission and the starter then used the boom to lift the engine out and onto the dock. Wrap the halyard a couple of times around the boom, tie it off. Connect a block and tackle to the tied off halyard and use that to lift the engine not the boom. The boom will be a "gin pole". Pad around the companion way with cardboard and blankets.
For re-installation the trans was attached so we did use the yards crane. What a ripoff. $400 for 20 minutes.
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Old 19-05-2015, 21:39   #6
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

It is what they used to do. But they used to do a lot of things that often ended badly

It's so much easier to have the boatyard use the crane they use for stepping masts. It will be a single lift from the mounts to the back of a pickup truck. That engine isn't going to be any lighter sitting on the dock.

And if something goes wrong, the boat yard's insured.
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Old 20-05-2015, 00:15   #7
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

I did it with no problems on a 46 ft boat. Used the main halyard to lift through a snatch block on a reefing line to control the in and out. Used the mainsheet and preventer tackle to control the side-to side. I figured the 4108 weighed about 600 lbs with the transmission attached, and it was easy to hoist using a Lewmar 43 halyard winch.

I set the 4108 on a temporary frame of 2x8's on the side deck while I dropped in the new Beta. When I was done I motored over to a sailing club and used their hoist to transfer it to the back of a pickup truck. Total cost $25 for the hoist and the lumber.
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Old 20-05-2015, 00:58   #8
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

Quote:
Originally Posted by donradcliffe View Post
I did it with no problems on a 46 ft boat. Used the main halyard to lift through a snatch block on a reefing line to control the in and out. Used the mainsheet and preventer tackle to control the side-to side. I figured the 4108 weighed about 600 lbs with the transmission attached, and it was easy to hoist using a Lewmar 43 halyard winch.

I set the 4108 on a temporary frame of 2x8's on the side deck while I dropped in the new Beta. When I was done I motored over to a sailing club and used their hoist to transfer it to the back of a pickup truck. Total cost $25 for the hoist and the lumber.
Thats what I did when taking out my MD17D for overhaul.... took off all the bits that weren't needed.... slid into saloon... lifted up... took up on snatch block and set her down in the cockpit on some 4x 4 bearers....

Positive side.... no load on boom.

No negs...

Re-built in cockpit... put back in engine room...
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Old 20-05-2015, 09:24   #9
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

I used a 6" diameter round fence post athwartships on the steel hatch rails with a come-a-long. However I did not bring the engine up on deck, just rolled it forward and set it down on salon floor. Yanmar 2qm15 and trans.
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Old 20-05-2015, 11:02   #10
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

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Originally Posted by slacker View Post
I did it no problem.
We removed the transmission and the starter then used the boom to lift the engine out and onto the dock. Wrap the halyard a couple of times around the boom, tie it off. Connect a block and tackle to the tied off halyard and use that to lift the engine not the boom. The boom will be a "gin pole". Pad around the companion way with cardboard and blankets.
For re-installation the trans was attached so we did use the yards crane. What a ripoff. $400 for 20 minutes.
this worked well for me on three occasions. Make sure the halyard is attached to the boom at the lift point, that way the boom is only holding ti out and not up, other wise you might bend the boom. I lifted the boom first to give me room to clear the deckhouse and the side of the boat. The last time I did it was a pearson424 with a westerbeke 60 with tranny minus alternator and wraw warer pump - couldn't clear the companionway - and an all wire halyard, out and back in no stress. also winched an extra halyard port foreword to add support to the standing rigging.
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Old 20-05-2015, 12:19   #11
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

I have done this many times as a mechanic, and it can be done on almost any boat. Due to the loading sails put on gear, and the relative size and weight of the engines installed in sailboats, the rigging can handle the engine weight. HOWEVER, those sweet, heavy duty Perkins engines push the envelope, and no mistake. Be very careful, and if in doubt, don't risk what you are trying. There are boats I had to support the boom at the engine lift point with the halyard, then use block and tackle to move the engine to a more favorable position, then move the boom out of the way and lift the engine with the main halyard, have two big fellas on safety lines: one to pull the engine aft and a second to pull it toward the dock, while I handled the halyard winch. Slow and careful, but done safely and sanely. Just be careful.
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Old 20-05-2015, 14:04   #12
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

Quote:
Originally Posted by slacker View Post
I did it no problem.
We removed the transmission and the starter then used the boom to lift the engine out and onto the dock. Wrap the halyard a couple of times around the boom, tie it off. Connect a block and tackle to the tied off halyard and use that to lift the engine not the boom. The boom will be a "gin pole". Pad around the companion way with cardboard and blankets.
For re-installation the trans was attached so we did use the yards crane. What a ripoff. $400 for 20 minutes.
It's much stronger and less chance of damage to the boom if you lift from the end of the boom, put the halyard at the end of the boom, lift the boom up at an angle steep enough so that the end of the boom is directly over the lift point of the weight, use a tackle to lift the weight, and control the boom side to side to move the item to the deck or dock, halyard moves it closer or farther from the mast. Be careful and slow. Know that it could get out of hand with the weight off center and the resulting heel of the boat. Do some calculations with rope strength, and geometry to determine safe working load of the setup.
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Old 21-05-2015, 00:38   #13
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

Hi all,
I've just replaced the engine in our Roberts Mauritius 43'. How I went about it is this.
I lifted the pilot house floor, then built some towers in the pilot house. Put a beam across, then used a chain block to lift the engine out of bed. Having the engine up high enough, we then moved our towers out to the pilot house roof. We then used a 3" square tube app. 4mtres long and rolled the Yanmar out onto the rear deck. Then reversed the process to put the new Fiat engine back in. No swearing, no backs broken. Job done. BUT we were on the hardstand at "MONTY'S MARINA" The BEST boat yard in Australia. At Beachmere QLD. And we had the use of the fork-lift to take engine off the rear deck and put New engine back up.
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Old 21-05-2015, 03:44   #14
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

We have done the same with our Yanmar. I suggest only using the boom as a strut and running the halyard through a block attached to the boom.
You can halve the weight on the halyard if you use a block on the engine and then take the free end of the halyard around an appropriately positioned beam supported on the side decks. This will have to be secured well so that it does not move around when under strain. (If a ketch you could use the mizzen instead of a beam)

Regards,
Richard.
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Old 21-05-2015, 10:01   #15
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Re: Using boom to lift out perkins 4108

I lifted a 6 cyl 354 perkins out through a hatch using the boom
In order to make sure the boom was strong enough I used 2 wood shores on both sides of the come a long and placed 3/4 inch 12" x 12" plywood pads under them to distribute the load on the deck
I docked the boat stern to the dock before I began and used 2x 12's as a ramp and slid the engine onto the dock after I moved the shores and come a long aft
I removed the transmission, alternator, starter, cooler, etc to reduce the weight before I lifted the engine out.

Good luck
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