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Old 28-09-2015, 06:53   #106
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

No, no, not sulking, I just wanted you to know I like your method, I just had such light wind I didn't have to use it that time, that's all, it's when the wind is blowing in here that I have the problems.
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Old 28-09-2015, 07:11   #107
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

I started out boat handling with 225' tanker with a direct reversing Atlas diesel of only 500 hp, delivering unleaded gasoline between New Haven, Ct and Phil. PA, with stops in NY and NJ. You've gotten a lot of excellent answers to your question here and I wouldn't presume to add much. Just an observation if I may. There is rarely a docking situation that is identical every time. Maybe just a subtle difference in and out of the same slip or berth, but not identical. You're placed a little different as you approach, the wind or current is a bit different. My contribution is simply control, you must maintain control of the vessels movement at all times. That of course is difficult singlehanded as the use of springlines is limited. I find on my sailboat that throwing a byte of line that's as long as I can comfortably throw from the cockpit can be a lifesaver. as a byte you can toss it over anything and still retrieve it to use again quickly or leave it fast for a second while you get another line on without the boat moving much. Also I would practice in the open in a breeze and without to get familiar with the boats characteristics and then use them to advantage when docking. That old tanker only let me shift five times before the air ran out and took almost a minute to go from forward to reverse and when she was light the pucker factor could be quite high. Good luck and good sailing.
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Old 28-09-2015, 07:42   #108
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

Amazing, I wrote a thread about having the worst slip ever this summer after being at Confed for the Blues Festival. It wasn't terrible when the wind was light in the morning but the afternoon 15 knot crosswind was a nightmare to get out backing. I was at the downwind end of the fairway on the right side so my prop walk was impossible being that it was taking me down into a power boat across the end of the fairway. Only a strong push out allowed us to make it so I backed in when I came back which made exit much easier. Of course they had put a boat in my lee side slip while I was out sailing with friends so I ended up backing into the windward side...withmuch fending.

Great spot in Kingston in a great marina!

Dan

This is a real issue, and IMHO does warrant consideration of moving to another dock. At my marina, I moved to a "head to wind" dock, even though it was much shorter than my original dock (shorter than the boat in fact). And when there is a strong breeze opposite to the prevailing direction, like when a storm is approaching, I'm right back to an over the stern wind direction, just like the OP, and its tough getting in/out without a lot of fending.
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Old 28-09-2015, 08:31   #109
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

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Originally Posted by fish53 View Post
I started out boat handling with 225' tanker with a direct reversing Atlas diesel of only 500 hp, delivering unleaded gasoline between New Haven, Ct and Phil. PA, with stops in NY and NJ. You've gotten a lot of excellent answers to your question here and I wouldn't presume to add much. Just an observation if I may. There is rarely a docking situation that is identical every time. Maybe just a subtle difference in and out of the same slip or berth, but not identical. You're placed a little different as you approach, the wind or current is a bit different. My contribution is simply control, you must maintain control of the vessels movement at all times. That of course is difficult singlehanded as the use of springlines is limited. I find on my sailboat that throwing a byte of line that's as long as I can comfortably throw from the cockpit can be a lifesaver. as a byte you can toss it over anything and still retrieve it to use again quickly or leave it fast for a second while you get another line on without the boat moving much. Also I would practice in the open in a breeze and without to get familiar with the boats characteristics and then use them to advantage when docking. That old tanker only let me shift five times before the air ran out and took almost a minute to go from forward to reverse and when she was light the pucker factor could be quite high. Good luck and good sailing.
That sounds lie a truly awful ship, 225 feet with only 500 hp and 5 starts! At least you weren't carrying a dangerous cargo, er, oh right, gasoline, one of the worst cargos.
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Old 28-09-2015, 08:39   #110
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

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Originally Posted by danstanford View Post
Amazing, I wrote a thread about having the worst slip ever this summer after being at Confed for the Blues Festival. It wasn't terrible when the wind was light in the morning but the afternoon 15 knot crosswind was a nightmare to get out backing. I was at the downwind end of the fairway on the right side so my prop walk was impossible being that it was taking me down into a power boat across the end of the fairway. Only a strong push out allowed us to make it so I backed in when I came back which made exit much easier. Of course they had put a boat in my lee side slip while I was out sailing with friends so I ended up backing into the windward side...withmuch fending.

Great spot in Kingston in a great marina!

Dan


This is a real issue, and IMHO does warrant consideration of moving to another dock. At my marina, I moved to a "head to wind" dock, even though it was much shorter than my original dock (shorter than the boat in fact). And when there is a strong breeze opposite to the prevailing direction, like when a storm is approaching, I'm right back to an over the stern wind direction, just like the OP, and its tough getting in/out without a lot of fending.
Confedration Basin stuck me in a truly awful slip during busker fest too. It was a 25 foot dock (I'm 35), way deep in, close to the locomotive. The slip way was so narrow I had to back and fill the snot out of her just so I could make the turn and get parallel to the slip. I just stood on it in reverse until my stern sucked adequately around to point my bow into the slip.

Getting out, forget about it, I had to back my double ender all the way out with wind and pushy power boats zipping past. I think it was the worst slip I was into all season.


Beautiful location, but really lacking in transient slips for bigger sailboats.
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Old 28-09-2015, 08:48   #111
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

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That sounds lie a truly awful ship, 225 feet with only 500 hp and 5 starts! At least you weren't carrying a dangerous cargo, er, oh right, gasoline, one of the worst cargos.
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Old 28-09-2015, 09:09   #112
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

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Originally Posted by northoceanbeach View Post
Well, having problems backing out again here. I've got the coming in thing going well, but backing out.....not so much. This thing does not want to cooperate!

I guess I have prop walk to starboard. So much for vari prop advertising no prop walk. Anywho. Today was a fiasco!

Ok. Moderately windy. Almost straight astern a little to SB. Maybe 7-8 knots. Incoming tide.

I reverse with the tiller over to starboard and that does nothing. I give it a blast in reverse and the stern kick to SB. A lot. So now I'm pointed the same way I was, forward but the current has carried me closer to the
Next door neighbor. I give it some throttle forward and pull the tiller the other way. This does make the boat turn the way I want it but its
Not enough. I'm going to be too close to the back of neighbors boat. So back
In reverse. SB kick. Facing straight again. The slip in front of me is open so I deside to dock ad reassess the situation.

I'm hoping someone is around but they are not. The best plan, and it's not a good plan, is to be my own bow push guy. I have to leave these people's slip and I'm not going to be able to revere out. So I walk the boat back and get some momentum and when the bow clears the finger pier I shove it facing the right direction, grab the pulpit and jump on and run to the throttle.

Too late I'm blowing into the pier. Run forward and fend off, reverse etc and I'm back to facing straight. Luckily the tide has pushed me past the next boat and to another empty slip.

At this point I go to find someone. He comes and gives me a shove, but it's a really sucky shove and I'm facing the right way, going forward but blowing into the docks. However this time with me and him fending I made it.

What do I do?
Trying to solve this problem in your slip is a big ask. If you can't get out to clear water to learn how to coax your boat in the direction you want then hire someone to teach you.

You can learn a lot about the response of your vessel without leaving the dock. You can loosen most of your dock lines then practice springing and initial manouevering. Also try it when the wind pipes up. Borrow some fenders.

Prop walk is your friend. Don't fight it. Spring lines are also your friend. Ideally you want to be able leave and dock with just one line. You'll likely use some rudder and off idle in gear to hold position.

Sent from my SM-N900T using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
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Old 28-09-2015, 09:27   #113
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

Quote:
Originally Posted by northoceanbeach View Post
Well, having problems backing out again here. I've got the coming in thing going well, but backing out.....not so much. This thing does not want to cooperate!

I guess I have prop walk to starboard. So much for vari prop advertising no prop walk. Anywho. Today was a fiasco!

Ok. Moderately windy. Almost straight astern a little to SB. Maybe 7-8 knots. Incoming tide.

I reverse with the tiller over to starboard and that does nothing. I give it a blast in reverse and the stern kick to SB. A lot. So now I'm pointed the same way I was, forward but the current has carried me closer to the
Next door neighbor. I give it some throttle forward and pull the tiller the other way. This does make the boat turn the way I want it but its
Not enough. I'm going to be too close to the back of neighbors boat. So back
In reverse. SB kick. Facing straight again. The slip in front of me is open so I deside to dock ad reassess the situation.

I'm hoping someone is around but they are not. The best plan, and it's not a good plan, is to be my own bow push guy. I have to leave these people's slip and I'm not going to be able to revere out. So I walk the boat back and get some momentum and when the bow clears the finger pier I shove it facing the right direction, grab the pulpit and jump on and run to the throttle.

Too late I'm blowing into the pier. Run forward and fend off, reverse etc and I'm back to facing straight. Luckily the tide has pushed me past the next boat and to another empty slip.

At this point I go to find someone. He comes and gives me a shove, but it's a really sucky shove and I'm facing the right way, going forward but blowing into the docks. However this time with me and him fending I made it.

What do I do?
Lots of posts here, and I haven't been keeping up with them because I've been away sailing again, but I have an idea that might help you here. If I understand the situation correctly, you are starboard side too and you need to turn to port to exit your slip way, but your stern is being pulled to, port, swinging your bow to starboard and ruining your game.

Forget the trying to turn with the tiller in reverse at slow speed, it isn't working for you. Try backing the boat so its half way out of the slip. Hard to port on the tiller and juice it ahead. Lean on the corner of your dock, midships, the friction will slow your forward motion and the dock corner will provide you with a predictable pivot point.

An alternate method of doing this with a line, may be to use a running stern spring to the cleat on the dock corner. Leave about 10-14 feet of slack in it. Back gently onto the line, when it comes taught, it will jerk your stern to starboard and your middle will lean on the dock corner, again, providing the pivot point. You will likely lose the rotation you set up using this method, but it should give you the edge you need to back out at 30 or 40 degrees and give you a head start on your turn when you come ahead. on her and go hard over to port.
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Old 28-09-2015, 12:03   #114
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

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That's a pretty cool idea! The tennis ball thing.

I had good luck today but it was light wind in the harbor but not on the water..

Today I locked my tiller slightly to SB. Started Walking the boat back to gain momentum and pushed the bow off a little, then it was at an angle and I hopped on and put it in reverse, but I didn't rev it high just a little so I avoided prop walk. I thought I had read in previous advice to gun it in reverse for shot bursts, but that makes it worse. At least with mine.

Your 29 foot boat was designed for an outboard? That's weird. ,usually boats,that big are made for inboards.

Cool,thou if It is and you have on, use it, get a new Yamaha 9.9 and you'll love it.
Yes using a line to pull to windward did work and no lives or stern pulpits were lost. My Columbia originally came with an outboard well for a Seagull engine! Naturally that well is not big enough for current outboards. It was an option to get the boat with an inboard Palmer engine. I really like that I don't have an inboard for reasons of simplicity, weight, speed and storage, but I wouldn't blame anyone for saying an outboard is ugly as sin. I will say it makes it maneuverable enough that I was able to raft up with a friend's engineless boat and take it over to the boatyard. By the way, someone mentioned backing out of the fairway, I say if that works , go for it. No need to worry about what others think of you.
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Old 28-09-2015, 14:09   #115
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Re: Trouble getting in and out of slip

I will just keep practicing. Every time until I get good at it. I feel a little better, I was talking briefly to the guy with the 38 foot boat right behind me. I wasn't telling him about my troubles, but he said he was waiting for crew and had non sailing guests coming and his main crew was backing out and if they didn't come he couldn't get the boat out. I was surprised, so I said:"you can't get this out single handed?" He said no, so I guess not everyone in the marina is the boat reversing master I imagined them to be.
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