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Old 05-04-2011, 03:21   #31
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

I don't know. The basis is the CC Chen Gilmer design which Chen sold to a number of "finishers" The Aires is the Sausalito Yacht Works version, the Roughwater was another, I would be interested in knowing all of the iterations of the design myself and how many total hulls were produced.
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Old 05-04-2011, 10:48   #32
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

I believe the Southern Cross was another version.
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Old 05-04-2011, 10:50   #33
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

I believe the builder /dealer Herb Madden is still in Sausalito and could possible give you some more information.
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Old 05-04-2011, 14:59   #34
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aries 32 View Post
I believe the builder /dealer Herb Madden is still in Sausalito and could possible give you some more information.
I have many fond memories of Herb. I hope he is doing well - he has to be over 80. Last I saw him was about 15 years ago, he was the Harbor Master in Sausalito, supervising the marina that he had once owned or leased as Sausalito Yacht Works and Chandlery.
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Old 06-04-2011, 18:01   #35
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

Aires 32, Roughwater 33, Weatherly 32 and Southern Cross 31 are.........

Basically all built on the same hull design of Thomas Gilmer, naval architect. The design was/is very popular, starting back somewhere in time (have yet to research that one).

The Aires 32 may have been his design name (?) and many were built out of wood with a lower fore cabin and raised 'dog-house' at least in the early 70's.

It appears to me that almost simultaneously, the Roughwater 33 (RW33) and the Southern Cross 31 were started in fiberglass. Both models track their production roughly the same; from 1975-mid 80's. Both have a full trunk cabin w/o doghouse.

I'm more familiar with the RW 33, as that is what I have. The RW's were built by the Chen Hwa Boatyard in Taiwan, with a heavy, hand laid glass hull and varying amounts of glass over ply in the cabin, etc. depending on their year of construction. If you've ever heard of a CHB trawler, it's from the Chen Hwa Boatyard and the trim details match many on the RW sail. My RW33 production number is: RWB330160380. This reads RoughWaterBoat, 33', #16, built March, 1980. It is molded in the aft starboard hull, just aft of the rub rail. I believe there were about 35 or so RW's built through about 1982-83, extrapolating out from my hull number and date.

The Weatherly 32 is very similar to the Roughwater. They got hold of the molds after RW went out and a built for a couple years perhaps. At first glance they look identical. But they have a little finer finish; hawseholes rather than rail mounted cleats, factory fiberglass decks, aluminum masts (always, I believe), etc. I'm not sure where they were made.

The Southern Cross 31 I know less about. I believe they were built about the same timeframe as the Roughwaters and they have a little different look to them. Same hull-design essentially, but the ones I have seen have a factory glass cockpit and cabin. They may have been offered as a kit finish, like many of the Westsails, because the couple interiors I've seen looked a bit rough. I really have no idea how many of these were built.

Needless to say, Thomas Gilmer came up with a great design, that has been used by many, from owner builds to factory builds. She continues to be very popular on the US west coast and I know of a couple that have been sailed overseas; one to Asia and another to Britian I believe; as well as from Alaska to Mexico.

Keep the stories coming and projects underway!
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Old 06-04-2011, 23:04   #36
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

For whatever it's worth, my boat (SAU000320682, which I take to mean built 1982) is all glass (over plywood on the decks) with an aluminum stick and an interior that screams Taiwan. I have no idea where it was really built, but I believe the builder on the title, which I don't have handy right now (and whatever it's worth) is CC Chen. I hear rumors that only the first 6 boats were built in Sausalito, but rumors being rumors.... I can't find anything very certain about the breed.

I'm parked one slip down from a factory finished Southern Cross 31 (the SC was offered in finished and bare hull versions), and I can't tell if they're the same hull or not. The SC, at least on some days, looks to be a bit rounder in the buttocks. Otherwise, I can't tell a difference. The SC has lead ballast and fuel and water under the sole, where I have very little bilge room and nothing under the sole. The SC has a square rudder, mine is rounded. The cabinetry was certainly built by folks who talked to each other, barring one hell of a coincidence! The exterior of the head appears identical, although the Aries toilet faces centerline and the SC is rotated 90 degrees, and the shelves above the setees have only minor differences, for example. Other Aries have drastically different interior layouts. The SC is cutter rigged, as I believe all are, and the Aries is sloop, again as I believe all are. The Aries has a boomkin vs. the SC split backstay. I have a shallow teak cockpit with fuel tanks under the seats, the SC has a deep glass version. Etc., etc. So, I can't say whether they're identical hulls or not, but they certainly share a pedigree.

I've posted many pictures in flickr, and have started a blog mostly for my own records (because it's harder to lose the internet than to lose paper!). I'll cry if you make fun of my "dullwork."
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Old 07-04-2011, 00:59   #37
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

Thanks for the post Dustymc. I've never seen the hull number sequence for the Sausalito boats. I looked at some of your pictures and yours looks like what I've known as the Weatherly (hawseholes, scupper relief, stainless supports for the winch cleats, glass decks, etc.).

I was introduced to the name when I had ours down in Channel Islands Harbor, CA; by the owner of one. Judging by your built date, I'd say yours came after the *Roughwaters*.

Very cool to have the extra info on all the Aires hulls.
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Old 07-04-2011, 03:05   #38
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

thanks dusty and Ira - great stuff.
my Hull# is SAU000170377
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Old 07-04-2011, 08:31   #39
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

The mystery deepens!
I tend to agree with Dusty regarding the last 4 digits being the month and year of the build for the Sausalitos, as they are for the RWs. That would mean that Les' boat was built in 1977; BEFORE the Roughwaters had stopped (mine is 1980). We NEED more SAU#'s to figure this out...or a phone call to Herb Madden...or a look at our boat Titles.
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Old 07-04-2011, 11:32   #40
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

No need for me to look at my boat title - we are the original and only owners. Bought the boat from Herb in Sausalito in July 1977. Had actually seen it a couple of months before freshly imported and dolled up for a recent boat show - we went totally head over heels and headed home to Michigan to arrange financing. Problem: the bank wouldn't cut a check until the boat (collateral) was in Michigan and I couldn't pay Herb without a check from the bank (duh!). Herb shipped the boat COD to me in Michigan when I had maybe a $500 deposit on it.
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Old 07-04-2011, 12:38   #41
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

Great story Les. Herb sounds like a special guy.
Well, this certainly changes my view of history. It definitely sounds like some of the Roughwaters and Sausalitos were built at the same time. Perhaps the yard building them was *private labeling* for two different importers; with a few refinements to each.
I have met a friend of the original owner of ours (in Redondo Beach, CA), who still had his as of a few years ago. They use to boat around together.
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Old 07-04-2011, 14:38   #42
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

Hi All, have you all seen these? Any others out there?
Attached Thumbnails
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Name:	Southern Cross 31 lines.jpg
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ID:	25942  
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Old 07-04-2011, 18:45   #43
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

Guys, hi. Mine is SAU000090275. Hull #9, commissioned Feb, 1975 by Herb Madden in Sausalito. The boat is still at SYH after 36 years! Herb is still around and is in the office quite often as he lives 20 feet away, literaly. Also, spoke to Jim Madden, his youngest of two sons. and Jim remembers putting the wooden spars on the boats in the 70's when he was a kid. He said only 20 something boats where imported from Taiwan and no boats were made in Sausalito. I told him otherwise but he said he knew nothing about boats made in Sausalito in the early 80's. Rumors? don't know but I heard that Sausalito Boat Works made 6 boats before going belly up. Jim says not true. Anyway: my boat is here: https://picasaweb.google.com/klondikejoe/HorizonAries32

and here: Anton's "KlondikeJoe" Blog

Enjoy!

-Anton
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Old 11-04-2011, 15:44   #44
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

My mistake, spoke to Mike Madden, not Jim about the Aries. I'll ask Mike if I can interview Herb for some background info on the Aries he commissioned at SYH in the 70's.

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Old 12-04-2011, 01:28   #45
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Re: Thomas Gilmer Aries 32

Not to beleaguer the discussion, but I believe that very early on in this thread we were comparing hull #'s. The Chester P is SAU000230879, which most of the tooling experts who own rights to various hull designs that are popular on the west coast I've spoken to agree is number 23 in a sequence, released to market in August of 1979. Also, the orignally designed spar was 34'11". To ship from Taiwan the spar couldn't exceed the footprint of the vessel it was shipping with without it costing more $'s. My spar is original. It will be curious to see how it performs in the slot this summer compared to other taller rigs that I'm reading about here.

Cheers!

-Chuck
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