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Old 10-09-2011, 18:02   #16
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

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Originally Posted by maxingout View Post
For me the perfect 30 footer is any well constructed yacht built to offshore scantlings AND it has a new engine with two large fuel tanks giving a 500 to 1000 mile range under power.

I believe in using my engine/engines when there is no wind or when my speed drops below 4 knots on passage. This policy has kept me out of trouble many times during my trip around the world.
That's a lot of fuel for a 30 ft boat! Doesn't leave much room for water, food, people, sails, anchors, spares, etc....
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Old 10-09-2011, 18:13   #17
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

What's the budget to buy and outfit?
You said solo.
How old are you?
Where are you located?
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Old 10-09-2011, 18:15   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy

That's a lot of fuel for a 30 ft boat! Doesn't leave much room for water, food, people, sails, anchors, spares, etc....
That's what I was thinking... 30 feet is pretty small for a full time liveaboard/cruiser. I don't have an extra inch of space anywhere

You could get 500 miles out of a good running diesel and a 40 gallon tank. But try to find a 40 gallon tank in a 30 footer maybe one of those 'built for 'bluewater' 30 footers... But then you're looking at paying 6times as much. For that kid of money, just get a production class 36 footer and call it a day

The good thing about most of the early production class 30 footers, is they are all designed for some type of racing. I can make 4kts in 5kts of wind. Try that with a Baba
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Old 10-09-2011, 18:22   #19
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

A Rawson 30 is pretty good of a Bodega/ Golden Gate 30 (tales of a Sea Gypsy by Ray Jason) as well in the say under 15K range. If you're looking to spend more $$$ I forget the IP, Baba and Channel Cutters and get a Pacific Seacraft 31 desinge by WIB crealock transom stern model. Get the 5' draft not the shoal for offshore. You should get 1000nm on around 75 gallons if that's an issue and is easily obtainable on a 30 footer with 2 25 gallon tanks and some additional jerry cans. Plenty of juice to run your watermaker if you have that much diesel or carry water and 10 gal fuel, up to you.
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Old 10-09-2011, 18:23   #20
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

I could advise you, but as a Bristol 31.1 owner I fear my advice might be biased.
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Old 10-09-2011, 18:25   #21
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

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That's a lot of fuel for a 30 ft boat! Doesn't leave much room for water, food, people, sails, anchors, spares, etc....
I carried enough fuel for 1400 miles on my privilge 39 catamaran. That's a lot of fuel for a 39 foot catamaran. Most catamarans my size carried only enough fuel for half that distance.

I spent more time with light winds than I did with heavy winds during my circumnavigation. Fuel is a high priority in my passage making strategy.

When I sailed across the Atlantic, I motored southwest until the trade winds filled in and my speed picked up to an acceptable level.

When I am on the shoulders of hurricane season, and there is unstable weather on passage, lots of fuel gives me options that I would not have otherwise.

I don't know how much fuel I could squeeze into a thirty footer, but I would make a maximum effort at having a fuel efficient engine in good shape with fuel spread in multiple tanks.

Singlehanders have more options because they only have to worry about their own priorities. If you have a couple on board, then there will be less room for fuel. You can only get so much stuff inside a thirty footer.

If I would have sailed around the world in my Westsail 32, I would have added additonal fuel tanks plus had jerry cans on deck. I carried eight jerry cans on deck when crossing the Atlantic, plus I had fuel in two bladder tanks to supplement the two stainless steel tanks.

I have spent many hours on passage listening to yachts running low on fuel and barely enough electricity to talk on their radios to give their position and yacht information. For me it was a safety issue. I am responsible for the family and friends on board my yacht, and lots of fuel means that I can do a better job of taking care of them. If it was just me, I might take chances with less fuel.
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Old 10-09-2011, 18:39   #22
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

Aloha,
You've gotten a lot of good recommendations. Depending on where you are there are a few 30 footers that would be bargains. The Rawson was a good recommendation and is a Pacific Northwest Boat. It does have some soft deck problems occassionally. Mariner or Fuji 31 or 32 (same boat) or a Cascade 29 that's been factory finished are really seaworthy for their length and price.
Good luck in your search. Look for something that has a low hour diesel engine. Disregard lots of electronic gear unless it is very new.
The definition of a yacht is any boat used for recreation so even an 8 footer can be a yacht.
kind regards,
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Old 10-09-2011, 19:09   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiprJohn
Aloha,
You've gotten a lot of good recommendations. Depending on where you are there are a few 30 footers that would be bargains. The Rawson was a good recommendation and is a Pacific Northwest Boat. It does have some soft deck problems occassionally. Mariner or Fuji 31 or 32 (same boat) or a Cascade 29 that's been factory finished are really seaworthy for their length and price.
Good luck in your search. Look for something that has a low hour diesel engine. Disregard lots of electronic gear unless it is very new.
The definition of a yacht is any boat used for recreation so even an 8 footer can be a yacht.
kind regards,
Aloha! The aloha 30 also a good 30 footer

Another one I find very appealing is the wauquiez gladiator, beautiful boat with very smart interior... Could possibly be the 'perfect' 30 footer in my opinion
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Old 10-09-2011, 19:46   #24
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

I just saw a Sun 27 on Seattle Craigs List today $10900us. Bob Perry design, owners I've met are happy except those wanting more size. Singlehanding 27 is a sweet spot for me, did it for many years. Cans can always supplement tankage. fair winds and good luck!
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Old 11-09-2011, 06:02   #25
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How New Is 'Very New'? - Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiprJohn View Post
Aloha,
You've gotten a lot of good recommendations. Depending on where you are there are a few 30 footers that would be bargains. The Rawson was a good recommendation and is a Pacific Northwest Boat. It does have some soft deck problems occassionally. Mariner or Fuji 31 or 32 (same boat) or a Cascade 29 that's been factory finished are really seaworthy for their length and price.
Good luck in your search. Look for something that has a low hour diesel engine. Disregard lots of electronic gear unless it is very new.
The definition of a yacht is any boat used for recreation so even an 8 footer can be a yacht.
kind regards,
Thanks, JohnL. Quick follow on question: how new is 'very new' in terms of electronic gear? Boat gear must age similarly to computers/other tech - or faster? Should I disregard if older than 2yrs? 6 months? other?

Thanks again in advance,
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Old 11-09-2011, 08:46   #26
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

I give a +1 to the factory finished Cascade 29 and would also suggest a Cal 34.

Both have double quarter berths (the best place to sleep short of pilot berths which are few and far between at this length, and quarter berths use a lot less cabin space) . The downside to this is the galley runs up one side of the boat. Better in port or living aboard but not so good underway where you want a tighter layout with everything at hand.

Both have been around the world and are fairly cheap, $10k-25K. For the Cal don't get the Mark 2 or 3 versions, they have single lowers.

The thread Why Cal ? gives a lot of reasons to look at Cal's in general.

If money is not so much of an issue then I would suggest the Alajuela 33.
Perfectly laid out: double quarterberths, double settees, tight galley and a locker by the companionway for wet foulwether gear; it is heavily built, with a decent amount of sail area for its displacement, and lightship draft under 5'. It will set you back about $50-75k. ALAJUELA 33 sailboat on sailboatdata.com
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Old 11-09-2011, 09:30   #27
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

I am not sure there is one boat that fits everyones needs as everyones needs and wants are different. But for me it was compromise of the best bang for the buck vs reputation vs durability. I ended up buying an Alberg 30. After doing some research and reading the Alberg seemed to fit the bill for me. Since sailing her I can say it was an excellent choice..for me. It is very easy to single hand...although I have single handed her my wife has always been on board(not sure if that counts). The boats does have a few issues as I am sure all older boats do but this boat design allows me to modify her the way that I want without feeling guilty up cutting and modifying a 50k+ boat. Most importantly everything is accessible and relatively inexpensive(in boat dollars) to maintain and repair. I would also consider looking at a pearson Trition.

I will say that these boats are small on the inside but are very liveable, just depends on what you consider comfortable.

Good luck with your search
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Old 11-09-2011, 10:18   #28
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

I've owned 4 cruising boats in the 26-32 foot range and chartered a few more.

A few features I prefer (as opposed to specific boat model):

Settee births and table - I much prefer a settee with center table to a dinette. I find them more convenient to get in and out of, like that you can fold the table down and flop down on the seats as well as sleep people on them. I prefer the centered ones to the one's that have U or L shape to one side as those are harder to skoot around into.

Gravity feed holding tanks - with the seacock under the bathroom sink. Just open it and the tank drains, with no need to go fishing in lockers, under bunks, etc. Gravity feed means no overboard pump which means one less thing to fail and simpler.

Accessible, straight through hull fittings. - Elbow joints under births are more likely to clog, harder to service and harder to get to in an emergency

Large V-birth - many in boats of that range are too short for many people to comfortably sleep in.

Ergonomic design - In boats of that size range, I prefer the newer more ergonomic designs. Many of the older models are well built, but have smaller interiors and less efficient use of space, but not all...

Accessible engine - In small boats, the inboard can often be crammed into a very small, inaccessible space.

Walk out transoms - much easier than climbing over a transom.

Lazy jacks and sail bag - much easier than gathering and tying sails.

Roller furling headsail - I think overall it's easier and safer than having to go forward to change sails or reef.

Dinghy Storage - Need somewhere to store the Dingy when it can't be towed. Davits may not be the answer on many small boats due to weight issues. Double forestays can limit foredeck space.

Cockpit space - Boats in that size range vary a great deal in how big the cockpit is, whether or not it has long, continual seats and whether or not it's easy to get around the wheel. I like having a small cockpit table.

Convenient lazarette and propane locker - I prefer a dedicated, properly vented propane locker and lazarette space that can be organized.

Shallow Draft - I sail Florida and the Bahamas, so draft can really affect where one can go. I love bilge keel monohulls for that reason, but they are hard to find. Obviously this will be dependent on where you cruise. (The Westerly Konsort is probably my favorite overall design in a boat under 30 feet)

Adequate Tankage - I find fresh water carrying ability especially is one of the biggest limitations in how long I can stay out. Ideally, I'd love to have 2 tanks - drinking and other uses, the "other" could be filled by rain water collection from a hard top instead of soft bimini.

Solar and Wind power - Relying on the engine all the time is costly and limiting.

Reliable autopilot - Hand steering gets old fast.

Reliable windlass or hand anchoring system - To have adequate v-birth space, many boats in that size range have small anchor chain lockers. Often this means there is not as much chain weight as there should be on the windlass, causing the chain to jump off or jam.

Hard top - who ever takes their bimini down? Hard tops don't have the wear issues, are better to mount solar panels on and can collect rain water. Also easy to mount a cockpit VHF under. (For solo sailing, I really prefer a real VHF, I can hear and use while at the helm) Trade off with windage however if you keep your boat in tropical storm locations and can't remove it. If I was sailing in mostly cold weather, I'd go with a pilothouse.

Cockpit shower with hot water - maybe. On a smaller boat, I don't want crew showering inside. It gets stuff wet, encourages mildew ties up the head and requires extra space I'd rather use for other purposes. Unfortunately, many cockpit showers have cold water only. I say maybe however, because it opens up the potential for an over zealous crew member to use up half your tank in one go. Sun showers are not as convenient, but allow you to carry more water and budget people's fresh water use.


The above is concerning monohulls of course. I like Catamaran designs, but I think it's hard to get standing headroom and adequate bridge deck clearance in a 30 foot cat.
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Old 11-09-2011, 10:18   #29
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

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Both have been around the world and are fairly cheap, $10k-25K. For the Cal don't get the Mark 2 or 3 versions, they have single lowers.
The Cal 2-29 is a great boat for its size.. mine had double lowers, forward and rear, as dose the one that just appeared in the Claffified area of CF.. A great boat for the money
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Old 11-09-2011, 10:21   #30
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Re: The Perfect 30' Yacht Design?

i know a good cal 30 built in 1968 or 1969 in good shape can be had for dirt cheap, you can add to the electronix easily....is in sd. bullet pruf with a full keel.
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