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Old 08-06-2010, 17:06   #106
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If I went out and bought a new High Performance Car, something that would run a top speed of up around 180 or more.. would it be something I couldnt take for a sunday drive along the coast.. sure it would, and would handle great if was done responsable..
Just like in autos, crews are needed in full race conditions, but not so much for just puttin around.. If you pulled it out on a long open road in the right conditions, Ya, I'd probably stuff my foot into it... and do it without a crew...
The same holds true with performance boats.. They dont have to be pushed at race conditions all the time and dont need a crew ALL the time.
As far as the stats, it all depends on whos behind the wheel, both in the boat and in the auto.. If you're going to push it, better get a crew.. But if you have a little more sence, you can single hand it very reasonably...
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Old 08-06-2010, 17:17   #107
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By the Way......the picture to the left.. under the name.. is my 8 year old grandson, at the wheel, of our FIRST42, Put him on a heading and he's at home and very much in control.. Guess that would make me the crew.....
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Old 08-06-2010, 17:22   #108
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Originally Posted by Doodles View Post
Me too, me too! Uncle Doodles, please send me the money, quick!

Doh ;-)

Until recently I was not aware they existed. Indeed a very nice boat. Mine is just like this, except the center 10' is missing.

barnie
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Old 08-06-2010, 17:38   #109
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Boatman61 you crazy barnacle you...ho laddie, those certifications ere just to examplele what you cannot find online easily.

If anyone knows where we can get a full listing of Lloyds A boats please let me know. I'll be damng where they are.
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Old 08-06-2010, 17:43   #110
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For kicks, I'm going to go and look at that Bendy FIRST 42 sometime just so I can say I did and become softer on her. She's a bit $ but what the hell.

Looked at what the blokes who are sailing the Tranpac are using this year. One good one stuck out at least on paper that was not on my list - Cascade 36. The rest were garbage except for usual candidates like Westsail 32

Islander 36 was on back of my list. Might go look at that one too.
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Old 08-06-2010, 17:52   #111
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Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
Boatman61 you crazy barnacle you...ho laddie, those certifications ere just to examplele what you cannot find online easily.

If anyone knows where we can get a full listing of Lloyds A boats please let me know. I'll be damng where they are.
Salty old bean...
Some Cheoy Lee's were Lloyds 100A, as were some Moody's etc... it is usually down to the buyers to request specs built to that standard.. then a Lloyds Surveyors pops along and checks each stage of the build and signs it off...
There are very few builders of the smaller boats(under 50ft) that maintain that standard across the range... it pushes the prices up.
But you can be sure a Lloyds boat will be stronger and in better condition if maintained than an equivilant boat of the same vintage built to the makers spec....
You gotta look for the print in the sales pitch....
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Old 08-06-2010, 18:03   #112
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Boatman61, had no idea it was on request by request basis. Thought it was to builders spec based on design and builder notes, then QC signed off when going out the door as being applied. Hence always held to a design pretty much.

arrr..learn something everyday.

SaltyMonkey is rightfully confused once again on what boat he should get.
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Old 08-06-2010, 18:11   #113
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Boatman61, had no idea it was on request by request basis. Thought it was to builders spec based on design and builder notes, then QC signed off when going out the door as being applied. Hence always held to a design pretty much.

arrr..learn something everyday.

SaltyMonkey is rightfully confused once again on what boat he should get.
How about this one Salty.... built to Lloyd's 100A... no guarantee the rest were tho'......http://www.yachtstunisia.info/index.html
Lloyd's 100A1 standard is a whole lot different from Lloyd's 100A1
Thats why so many builders of great boats went bust... priced themselves out... won't find Bendy Toy built to those standards
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Old 08-06-2010, 18:21   #114
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Salty, have you considered any of the Wauquiez's? We love our Pretorian and its the right size at 35'. The ones built in the '80s were awesome, fast and built like brick sh*thouses. Here is a statement from an earlier thread that I would sure like to believe but can't substantiate:

"I have been told that in the 1980s Lloyds of London had an internal ranking of boat yards wordwide. Wauquiez was number 5. None of the American builders were in the top ten. Not Morris, Hinckley, Shannon, Pacific Seacraft, etc."

This is the thread ...Wauquiez Gladiateur or ?
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Old 08-06-2010, 19:44   #115
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Doodles:

Pretorean 35. It's on my list, but the "sailing specs" didn't come out too good on her. I don't know why. I looked at a few other sheets, and they came out about the same.

boatman61: holy bananas boatman! Thats one beautiful boat! I am fond of that rudder stock. 71448 US Dollars - today. Thats extremely reasonable. Oh wait VAT!!

Now you got me thinking I should get something over 42 feet and may a play for the Transpac next year.
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Old 08-06-2010, 21:17   #116
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Doodles:

Pretorean 35. It's on my list, but the "sailing specs" didn't come out too good on her. I don't know why. I looked at a few other sheets, and they came out about the same.
Hmmm ... of course, I have to plug my own boat. Here is some info from the Practical Sailor review of them re performance. Just add it to your pile.

Quote:
Performance
In an attempt to determine the sailing characteristics, we talked with several present and former owners of Pretorien 35's and were surprised that their comments fell within a very narrow range. Depending on the sail inventory, the boat needs 6-8 knots of breeze to sail quickly. This is not surprising considering its 15.6 sail area/displacement ratio.
One racer told us that his inventory included only a 135% genoa and that in less than 10-12 knots of wind, performance was dismal. A second owner who participates in Wednesday night fleet racing said that the boat sails to its handicap with 8 knots of breeze and a 150% genoa. In all cases, sailors were using traditional Dacron fabrics; we'd bet that light air performance could be enhanced by lighter, finely tuned laminate sails.
On the other hand, skippers said the boat is dry going to weather in 30 knots of wind. All agreed that the boat points higher than similar 35-foot cruisers. One racer said he sails to within 40 of true wind direction.
Sam Stitt, who cruises his boat in the Northwest, said that the boat is easily balanced on all points of sail, but mentioned that an Autohelm 4000 was inadequate for sailing wing and wing in more than 20 knots of wind because of its slow response time. He purchased the Pretorien after considering a J-36 and Express 37, primarily because it is fast enough for his needs, and more comfortable.
"The boat steers better, with less effort, and more predictably, than any comparably sized boat I have driven. I think that this is one of its most important features, beyond all of the obvious quality and finish attributes," Stitt said.
A similar sentiment was expressed by Fred Hess, who raced his boat in the single-handed TransPac in 1996. He replaced the Autohelm with a sturdier Alpha autopilot, which he said responded more quickly.
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Old 08-06-2010, 21:51   #117
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Oh Doodles. I'm not going to trash your boat. No way. I'm sure its a brickhouse. Its on the Mahina list btw. This is what they say:

"Strong, fast & attractive. Built by Waquiez. Best value for a boat under $85,000. Modest tankage, some have saildrives. A neg."

True, I'm avoiding the saildrive and the maintenance issues. I probably shouldn't base my boat decisions on that but what can I do? The LM 30 also has a saildrive.

Where the 35 is good:

D/L = 208.01 - closer to a light displacement cruiser/racer
B/D = 51% - very resistant to heeling

Where not so good:

Light winds, comfort/resistance, Roll recovery (old calcs)

Again all theoretics and out of the box. here is one near me (i think although it could be san diego):

1986 Wauquiez Pretorien 35 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
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Old 08-06-2010, 22:03   #118
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Oh Doodles. I'm not going to trash your boat. No way. I'm sure its a brickhouse. Its on the Mahina list btw. This is what they say:

"Strong, fast & attractive. Built by Waquiez. Best value for a boat under $85,000. Modest tankage, some have saildrives. A neg."

True, I'm avoiding the saildrive and the maintenance issues. I probably shouldn't base my boat decisions on that but what can I do? The LM 30 also has a saildrive.

Where the 35 is good:

D/L = 208.01 - closer to a light displacement cruiser/racer
B/D = 51% - very resistant to heeling

Where not so good:

Light winds, comfort/resistance, Roll recovery (old calcs)

Again all theoretics and out of the box. here is one near me (i think although it could be san diego):

1986 Wauquiez Pretorien 35 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
Yeah, those are pretty much the +'s and -'s. Our has the direct prop shaft like the one you found, no saildrive, although I wouldn't let that keep me from buy a particular boat. I see in the YW ad they mention Hal Roth owned one. That's ours, we bought it from Margaret Roth about a year after Hal passed away. He made some interesting mods most of which we've kept. The best was he yanked out the wheel and put in a tiller.
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Old 08-06-2010, 22:24   #119
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Seriously??? i LOVE that idea. Rip out the wheel! Didn't think it was possible.
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Old 08-06-2010, 23:13   #120
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You might want to look at one of these.

Halmatic 30 archive details - Yachtsnet Ltd. online UK yacht brokers - yacht brokerage and boat sales

They are mostly in the UK, but I found one in Oz so they are out there.

They tick all my boxes, and I am an old folkboat owner too (marieholm IF)
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