The full timeline of what went down (besides the boat) of the Polina Star

[ArmyDaveNY]

There have been some interesting developments lately. First, there is a new Oyster owner. The article below also talks about taking care of previous Oyster owners and also talks about the Polina Star III. Unfortunately the article does not talk about any resolution but rather simply states that the incident with the Polina Star III has been put behind them.

Three very interesting comments per the article:
"Hadida also confirmed that the Polina Star III incident was now firmly in the firm’s past, and stressed a repeat “would never happen.”

"Oyster later went on the record to say the construction and design of the 825 took into account Classification Society Rules and other standards, and that its inspection of other 825s (not including Polina Star III) highlighted a possible weakness in the process used to build the inner structures of these vessels."

“Oyster owners five weeks ago were left high and dry. These 26 owners are our first priority which is to give them the Oyster they ordered so they don’t end up with a hybrid and they will have full warranty for what they ordered.”

It sounds like the new owner is trying to do the right thing. Also interesting is that the original owner formed a company to take care of old Oysters regardless of age. It will certainly be interesting to see what the final outcome is. I wish them and the owners well.

Tech entrepreneur Richard Hadida is new owner of Oyster Yachts - YBW

[NevisDog]

Originally Posted by ArmyDaveNY

..."Oyster later went on the record to say the construction and design of the 825 took into account Classification Society Rules and other standards..."

Salesmen use three definitions:
1. built under class rules and supervision;
2. the design complies fully with class rules;
3. design and construction take account of class rules.
Ask to see the paperwork proving 1 or 2. Statement #3 is of course meaningless hogwash - it promises nothing.

[ArmyDaveNY]

Originally Posted by NevisDog

Salesmen use three definitions:
1. built under class rules and supervision;
2. the design complies fully with class rules;
3. design and construction take account of class rules.
Ask to see the paperwork proving 1 or 2. Statement #3 is of course meaningless hogwash - it promises nothing.

You are correct. The part I should have, but failed to do, was that they said their review indicated a weakness in the inner structure. Sorry about that.

[NevisDog]

Originally Posted by ArmyDaveNY

You are correct. The part I should have, but failed to do, was that they said their review indicated a weakness in the inner structure. Sorry about that.

Ah but you did quote that part (it was me that left it out):
"Oyster later went on the record to say the construction and design of the 825 took into account Classification Society Rules and other standards, and that its inspection of other 825s (not including Polina Star III) highlighted a possible weakness in the process used to build the inner structures of these vessels."

[BCookCornwall]

Originally Posted by NevisDog

Ah but you did quote that part (it was me that left it out):
"Oyster later went on the record to say the construction and design of the 825 took into account Classification Society Rules and other standards, and that its inspection of other 825s (not including Polina Star III) highlighted a possible weakness in the process used to build the inner structures of these vessels."

I have said for a while the quality of Oyster has gone down since the Richard Mathews period. I guess since he sold it, the emphasis was on profit instead of quality. Such a shame.

The surveyors report made for interesting reading. The overlap between the internal structure and the keel stub seemed very insufficient. I personally would avoid keel bolts at all costs however, I want peace of mind while sailing oceans.

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, BCookCornwall.

[hellosailor]

The way the new owner (who sounds willing and able to run it as a "hobby") glossed over the prior difficulties makes it sound like there is an NDA in effect and some private resolution to the claims has been made.

The announcement that former employees are starting an independent company targeting the service of Oysters, is just incidental news. Someone thinks Oyster owners will prefer a shop that specializes in them, that's fine. Of course if the new owner of Oyster does his job...they'll be competitors, that's good too. Sometimes.

All of which really says nothing about whether there was a design problem and whether it will be re-mediated in existing hulls.

An encapsulated keel can still literally fall out, if the capsule is cracked in a grounding. One piece composites can still come unglued--as the tail of one jetliner did in 2002 after takeoff at JFK international. But combat aircraft still are literally having their wings glued on, rather than bolted or riveted on. And bolt still work, if you use enough of them properly.

I've seen a 28 foot boat with twice as many keel bolts as a 36' boat. The 28'er was known as being "not a light air boat" while the 36 was built for racing. And the guys who crew the America's Cup boats over the years (not just the last round) will gladly tell you that if they sailed to their races "on their own bottoms" they'd be broken up long before the first ocean crossing.

It isn't the bolts, or the frames, or anything else that is at fault. It is designers and builders, not appreciating the need to get their numbers right. All their numbers, not just the budget.

[BCookCornwall]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, BCookCornwall.

Thank you very much sir!

Originally Posted by hellosailor

The way the new owner (who sounds willing and able to run it as a "hobby") glossed over the prior difficulties makes it sound like there is an NDA in effect and some private resolution to the claims has been made.

The announcement that former employees are starting an independent company targeting the service of Oysters, is just incidental news. Someone thinks Oyster owners will prefer a shop that specializes in them, that's fine. Of course if the new owner of Oyster does his job...they'll be competitors, that's good too. Sometimes.

All of which really says nothing about whether there was a design problem and whether it will be re-mediated in existing hulls.

An encapsulated keel can still literally fall out, if the capsule is cracked in a grounding. One piece composites can still come unglued--as the tail of one jetliner did in 2002 after takeoff at JFK international. But combat aircraft still are literally having their wings glued on, rather than bolted or riveted on. And bolt still work, if you use enough of them properly.

I've seen a 28 foot boat with twice as many keel bolts as a 36' boat. The 28'er was known as being "not a light air boat" while the 36 was built for racing. And the guys who crew the America's Cup boats over the years (not just the last round) will gladly tell you that if they sailed to their races "on their own bottoms" they'd be broken up long before the first ocean crossing.

It isn't the bolts, or the frames, or anything else that is at fault. It is designers and builders, not appreciating the need to get their numbers right. All their numbers, not just the budget.

Obviously construction methods and quality are the main points and I think they were big issues for Polina Star. The photos and survey report sheds light on some of those issues. That is unfortunately a sign of the times however as many production boats use cost as a priority for design.

I think a well built integral keel is still the best option for cruising. We have all seen large objects floating on passages and there is always a chance to hit something. An example I was thinking of is the hull and keel Kraken Yachts are building into their yachts. Very solid integral keel with no bolts, even with an encapsulated bulb.

Bolts can just be a pain to inspect too. I know a friend that recently took his yacht out of the water and had to cut away grp to get to the keel bolts to inspect them. It had suffered a grounding so he wanted peace of mind.