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Old 14-05-2015, 04:57   #556
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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Not be allowed? By whom? Some autonomous body crafting regulations? There is not an agreement as to what "blue" actually is never mind what is the best boat to transit it. That, of course, would not stop a government from feeling it necessary to regulate "it". Is that a good thing?

Be careful what you wish for.
The designer was arguing that ISO should mark it down as not being acceptable for an A rating in the the same way that ISO dismiss side doors we spoke about earlier.

He was not arguing that they should be legislated against by government. There are many thinks that prevent a A rating and he just wanted this to be another.

We do need standards. All guns in America have to comply with standards. Your right to use them is a completely different constraint argument.

Barrels are rated for use with + P ammo and if they were not people would be blowing their hands off.

Regulations are on balance a good thing but I take your point because too much of a good thing can become bad thing and inhibit design.
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Old 14-05-2015, 05:00   #557
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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This boat is for sale at the moment:


Greyhound

Has two of those bubbles. And certainly "blue water". Was build for the OSTAR... I almost bought this boat when it was for sale in the 90ies, maybe I should now.
Note also that the top is all roundy so waves and wind cant stick to it.
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Old 14-05-2015, 09:00   #558
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

I have allways wondered those bubbles, don't you bang your head back and forth trying to peek out of them beating to weather?
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Old 14-05-2015, 11:07   #559
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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I have allways wondered those bubbles, don't you bang your head back and forth trying to peek out of them beating to weather?
Crash helmet? They are not a bad idea really. They offer a great solution without much design and engineering involved but it would be hard to run with one of these if you had a dodger..



Actually if the bubble was able to be high enough you could see through the dodger and the dodger would keep it dry.
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Old 14-05-2015, 12:59   #560
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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Crash helmet? They are not a bad idea really. They offer a great solution without much design and engineering involved but it would be hard to run with one of these if you had a dodger..
......
Actually if the bubble was able to be high enough you could see through the dodger and the dodger would keep it dry.
Why not just make the dodger the dome....or maybe the dome the dodger.... and grow hot-house tomatoes en passage.....

I know of a boat that had such a thing but more closed in around the back - built by the same person as this one - I don't know which boat had it first .

She was laid flat on her way from S Georgia to the Falklands, the helmsman .....outside of the dome.. .. said when she righted herself the two punters in the 'dome' looked like goldfish.
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Old 14-05-2015, 13:13   #561
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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Why not just make the dodger the dome....or maybe the dome the dodger.... and grow hot-house tomatoes en passage.....

I know of a boat that had such a thing but more closed in around the back - built by the same person as this one - I don't know which boat had it first .

She was laid flat on her way from S Georgia to the Falklands, the helmsman .....outside of the dome.. .. said when she righted herself the two punters in the 'dome' looked like goldfish.
hahahaha... classic, can imagine them swimming around. Funny... Yeh, maybe these ideas can be taken too far.
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Old 15-05-2015, 04:13   #562
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

I would love to have been able to attend this show. Can't go but looks good.

News articles from World Cruising Club: Bluewater Open Boat Weekend 2015

"Over 100 aspiring bluewater cruisers are set to attend World Cruising Club's second annual Bluewater Open Boat Weekend hosted at Berthon Marina in Lymington on 16-17 May. They will have the opportunity to climb aboard a variety of ocean sailing boats, mingle with experienced cruisers and get expert advice to help set sail with the right boat, training, and equipment. Designed to make visitors think about all aspects of living the bluewater dream, the two day free to attend event combines a boatshow, seminar and sailor rendezvous all in one."
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Old 16-05-2015, 15:30   #563
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

Could this technology add more blue to a blue water boat?

Capsize Prevention System Article

If top of mast is immersed for a few seconds masthead buoyancy bag could be deployed and filled via a compressed air line run up the mast.
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Old 16-05-2015, 16:03   #564
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

A multihull is already 'blue' because of its unsinkability. Rose-Noelle floated around the Pacific for months before coming ashore at Great Barrier Island - all survived. If their emergency beacon had been picked up... The real inverted problem is with ballasted monos - flood them and they sink.
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Old 16-05-2015, 16:35   #565
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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A multihull is already 'blue' because of its unsinkability. Rose-Noelle floated around the Pacific for months before coming ashore at Great Barrier Island - all survived. If their emergency beacon had been picked up... The real inverted problem is with ballasted monos - flood them and they sink.
Sure but this aims to stop the total inversion. Bags are quite common on dingies and for sure a top of mast buoyancy device if there was one would be more critical to a multi hull because inversion is a one way ticket but!... Still has benefit to a mono - me thinks.. Matey.
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Old 16-05-2015, 16:40   #566
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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Note also that the top is all roundy so waves and wind cant stick to it.
Hi. We all see things differently.

I don't see the rounded cabin top as designed to be more aerodynamic as a primary reason for that shape.

As I see it, the curve of the rounded top is a better surface for the solo sailor to stand upon when sailing on the heeled boat, at any angle of heel.
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Old 16-05-2015, 16:52   #567
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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... Still has benefit to a mono - me thinks..
Oh, I see. Interested in what others may think but I see this more as a device for a fast/racing multihull making a mistake in relatively calm, sheltered water.

I recall one offshore catamaran that was designed with a sort of flying saucer atop the mast to prevent full inversion - no reason why a mono couldn't have the same thing but I don't think it would help the salesman with his sales pitch! A bit like parachutes on aircraft - too scary to look at. ("Mom, why does that nice yacht have a saucer atop the mast?!")
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Old 16-05-2015, 17:01   #568
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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...As I see it, the curve of the rounded top is a better surface for the solo sailor to stand upon when sailing on the heeled boat, at any angle of heel.
I see it differently again - remember this was described as an OSTAR race boat (a very nice one, but still a race boat) - needs to minimize windage. What would you hold on to atop that rounded thingy?
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Old 16-05-2015, 17:01   #569
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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Originally Posted by NevisDog View Post
A multihull is already 'blue' because of its unsinkability. Rose-Noelle floated around the Pacific for months before coming ashore at Great Barrier Island - all survived. If their emergency beacon had been picked up... The real inverted problem is with ballasted monos - flood them and they sink.
I like cats and monos. But...

I see this differently too. I don't see "unsinkable" as necessarily making a boat "blue" or better designed for bluewater sailing or all seas and conditions. In other words, I may prefer a sinkable design over an unsinkable design or type of boat and consider it better designed as a water sailing">blue water sailing craft.

The case of the sailors living in an overturned boat is an exceptional or rare case. I think it much more likely most sailors of an overturned multihull will either exit the boat or die within it, even if it continues to float upside down).

In other words, I think both mono and cat sailors are at risk if their boats overturn in offshore, bluewater, storm conditions.

My POV is influenced by a vivid memory of an overnight offshore race I was in where a large trimaran capsized not far ahead of where I was in high winds and big seas in the Pacific. The USCG hello flew over our boat with spotlight on the water searching for the tri and their crew, some of which were separated from the overturned tri. I don't doubt the tri was floating. But I don't think that was much help to the crew. Partially submerged big slippery hulls are not easy to stand on or stay on with any seas. I know I would much rather be IN a proper SOLAS offshore life raft rather than trying to hug an upside down hull in a storm.
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Old 16-05-2015, 17:05   #570
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Re: The criteria of "blue"

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Hi. We all see things differently.

I don't see the rounded cabin top as designed to be more aerodynamic as a primary reason for that shape.

As I see it, the curve of the rounded top is a better surface for the solo sailor to stand upon when sailing on the heeled boat, at any angle of heel.
Very true but still rather precarious. So as blue sailors we have to practise balancing on a ball now?!
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