Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 11-06-2015, 06:38   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 1
Stowage of Diesel Fuel

Just a quick opinion survey request.

What are the views of the community with regard to the stowage of diesel fuel BELOW decks in the accommodation spaces on a sailing yacht.
i.e. under berth lockers, clothes hanging lockers etc etc.

Not just a couple of containers but 6-8 x 20-25 ltrs. Vessel less than 12.00M loa.

Is it a sound and safe practice...?

There was no conventional deck filler but the one main tank could only be re-filled by lifting the aft cabin berth cushion and filling directly into the fuel tank through the inspection hatch. The fuel was mostly topped up in harbour only, which meant that the diesel in the 'spare' containers was STORED for a considerable time.

Is this a sound and safe practice...?
__________________

__________________
ajm0548 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2015, 06:43   #2
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Baltic (Summer) (the boat!); somewhere in the air (me!)
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 19,743
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

You don't want to spill it or get it in your bilges, but diesel fuel is not really a fire hazard, because it does not form explosive vapors like petrol. Beware however that it is stinky and can ruin your boat forever if it soaks into plywood bulkheads or other parts of the inside of your boat.

Sailors sometimes store some diesel below decks, although it is more common to see it on deck and tied off to the pushpit or lifelines. But don't you have a lazarette or cockpit lockers? That would be a better place than inside the boat.

Buy really good jerry cans and make sure they are securely sealed, and wherever you keep them, make sure they are securely tied down so they can't fly around in case of a knock-down.
__________________

__________________
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2015, 07:15   #3
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,579
Images: 240
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, ajm.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2015, 08:30   #4
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Long Beach, CA
Boat: Tayana Vancouver 42
Posts: 1,854
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

Add a deck fill pipe. Pouring diesel into an inspection hatch below decks is a bad idea. Once spilled diesel doesn't go away easily.


S/V B'Shert
__________________
Tayana42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2015, 11:05   #5
Registered User
 
FamilyVan's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,779
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajm0548 View Post
Just a quick opinion survey request.

What are the views of the community with regard to the stowage of diesel fuel BELOW decks in the accommodation spaces on a sailing yacht.
i.e. under berth lockers, clothes hanging lockers etc etc.

Not just a couple of containers but 6-8 x 20-25 ltrs. Vessel less than 12.00M loa.

Is it a sound and safe practice...?

There was no conventional deck filler but the one main tank could only be re-filled by lifting the aft cabin berth cushion and filling directly into the fuel tank through the inspection hatch. The fuel was mostly topped up in harbour only, which meant that the diesel in the 'spare' containers was STORED for a considerable time.

Is this a sound and safe practice...?
My set up is like this. There is a deck hatch in my salon I pull up to reveal a sounding tube into my tank, which is where I have to fill from. Its annoying but not as bad as you might think. If I ever had to completely fill my 125 gallon tank it would take me all day, but I just keep it topped up.

Adding a deck fill is on my to do list, but if it was that big of a pain, I would have done it by now.

Sent from my SGH-I547C using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
__________________
FamilyVan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2015, 11:12   #6
Senior Cruiser
 
Roy M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Southwestern Yacht Club, San Diego, CA
Boat: Searunner 40 trimaran, WILDERNESS
Posts: 3,042
Images: 4
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

I built my 55 gallon diesel tank with plywood and epoxy, complete with baffle plates, LARGE inspection/cleanout ports, fuel gauge, dip stick, vent hose and fill hose. That was thirty years ago. I can remove the tank, after removing the fuel, of course, if I need to put my eyes and hands on the hull beneath. Click on the pics for details.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	DSC06187.jpg
Views:	187
Size:	401.5 KB
ID:	103601   Click image for larger version

Name:	DSC06194.jpg
Views:	187
Size:	394.6 KB
ID:	103602  

Click image for larger version

Name:	DSC06195.jpg
Views:	180
Size:	396.3 KB
ID:	103603   Click image for larger version

Name:	DSC06192.jpg
Views:	172
Size:	406.7 KB
ID:	103604  

__________________
Roy M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2015, 17:24   #7
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 17,770
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

i have 125 gallon envy.
i keep mine on deck so it isnt so hard to lift to fill tank, and i donot lift jug for filling but use a siphon hose for that.
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2015, 18:07   #8
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Rhodes Greece
Boat: Corbin Ketch 39ft
Posts: 152
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

I fill my tanks from jugs using a holley fuel pump and a spin on automotive filter. I have a long hose to reach the deck storage permanently installed. The pump discharges into a manifold that selects which tank is on service so fills that tank through its pickup. This also serves to be able to put a positive pressure if I need to bleed the engine. I get additional filtration of fuel, and a matter of only a few minutes to set up to fill.
As to storing fuel below decks WW 2 subs sometimes store fuel in bilges for long transits. Could not have been confortable but not explosive
__________________
Joe Bayne
Jubilee
Mediteranean
Jubilee39 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 08:26   #9
Senior Cruiser
 
Roy M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Southwestern Yacht Club, San Diego, CA
Boat: Searunner 40 trimaran, WILDERNESS
Posts: 3,042
Images: 4
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

Many years ago (1989), we established the record for the first trans Pacific passage in a boat powered by diesel outboard engines (YANMAR ENDEAVOUR). The boat was a composite trimaran with no mast. For nine days we walked, sat and slept on flexible fuel bags of diesel, over 400 gallons of it. It was noisy and not comfortable, but we suffered no lasting effects.
__________________
Roy M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 08:47   #10
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Hailing Minny, MN
Boat: Vancouver 27
Posts: 751
Images: 1
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

If you have time for a project and know how to mix epoxy, an integral tank is always an option. Maximizes usable space, adds strength, and with large inspection ports provides direct access to the hull.

This boat has also relied on jerry cans, but they take up so much space. About to begin construction of an integral tank in an otherwise unused lazarette corner. Plan to just keep a couple jugs for ferrying diesel.
__________________
laika is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 10:41   #11
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Anacortes
Boat: previous - Whitby 42 new - Goldenwave 44
Posts: 1,735
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy M View Post
I built my 55 gallon diesel tank with plywood and epoxy, complete with baffle plates, LARGE inspection/cleanout ports, fuel gauge, dip stick, vent hose and fill hose. That was thirty years ago. I can remove the tank, after removing the fuel, of course, if I need to put my eyes and hands on the hull beneath. Click on the pics for details.
Very nice tank job! It may be the extra bit of inspiration I need.
__________________
exMaggieDrum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 10:58   #12
Registered User
 
Sailorman Ed's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2010
Boat: Polynesia 40/42
Posts: 685
Images: 15
Send a message via Skype™ to Sailorman Ed
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

Quote:
I built my 55 gallon diesel tank with plywood and epoxy, complete with baffle plates, LARGE inspection/cleanout ports, fuel gauge, dip stick, vent hose and fill hose
Roy, I also agree that was a nice job. Anything special needed to do this? Did you color the epoxy or paint it? If so, what did you use? How far off the bottom did you install the pick up tube?
Ed
__________________
Sailorman Ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 11:06   #13
Registered User
 
hamburking's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Kingston Ont Canada
Boat: Looking for my next boat!
Posts: 2,148
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

When filling the gerry cans, remember to leave a little air space...use the max fill line. My skipper, who wanted to carry every litre possible, filled the cans to the very top. Of course once we reached the tropics, the fuel expanded with the warm ambient temps, and several fuel cans cracked open. Liquid is non-compressible...so leave a little air in there...the air can compress when the liquid expands.

Also, long siphon tube from on deck will greatly simplify filling at sea.

When it was too rough on deck (sea water would have got in) to use the deck fill, we filled the keel tank from an access port below...what a pain...not a good setup. We poured. Syphon is much better.

We stuffed many gerry cans into the chain locker...we weren't going to be doing any anchoring at sea.
__________________
hamburking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 11:50   #14
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 13,037
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

Well, Jimmy Doolittle's bomber crews did it with aviation gas while flying, but of course, that was in order to bomb Tokyo and your cruise no doubt was not as critical a mission.


If properly secured and sealed, I wouldn't see a safety problem but somehow, fuel cans always get fuel on the outside of them, and that diesel stink would upset me more.


When you've got limited choices...you deal with it.
__________________
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2015, 16:19   #15
Senior Cruiser
 
Roy M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Southwestern Yacht Club, San Diego, CA
Boat: Searunner 40 trimaran, WILDERNESS
Posts: 3,042
Images: 4
Re: Stowage of Diesel Fuel

exMaggieDrum and Sailorman Ed, thank you. Here are the details: Make a cardboard template that will fit the space you want to place the tank into. Pop it opt and ensure that you can get the unit in and out of the boat, easily. If that's a problem, make two tanks, joined by an inch and a half hose at the bottom, and join the vents. Mine was one piece, but I've built others that needed the special size consideration.

Cut the pieces of plywood using the templates. For thickness, you need only consider how much volume (and height!) you will require. The baffles add structural strength to the tank walls. I used 1/2 inch (about 1.25 cm) Baltic plywood (no voids, birch plywood, smells nice to cut- non scientific logic), but smaller would probably have been perfectly adequate to save weight. You can also substitute structural foam, fiberglassed for strength and stiffness). Epoxy the inside and outside surfaces a couple times. You can use fiberglass if you are conservative. I did, but in later units I omitted the extra weight/cost/bother.

Tack the pieces together with tape, or sew up with copper wire or dental floss, leaving the top off. Then, mix up a batch of epoxy and low density filler (phenolic microballoons, for example, to "peanut butter" consistency (sorry, another "Yank" technological term) and goop it into the corners of intersecting plywood. Drag an empty beer can edge over the goop to create a smooth fillet joint. Before the epoxy kicks off, wet your fingers in water and smooth the hardening surface as though it were wet clay. You can end up with a perfectly smooth surface that doesn't need sanding. OOps!, I forgot the secret: Mix a pigment into the last coat(s) of epoxy for color. I used graphite powder for the black, because I had a lot of it. In later tanks I used white titanium pigment to make it lighter, just so it would be easier to see how dirty the tank interior was. There is no problem with UV degradation of the epoxy when out of the sunlight, so no need to paint it.

Fabricate the top using the same techniques. The big openings for the cleanout/inspection ports makes doing the fillet joints a breeze. Drill the necessary holes for whatever hardware you need. I used Nylon through hull fittings for my Fill pipe and vent, a brass plumbing assembly for the fuel pickup, and the the pickup pipe was cut at a 45 degree angle at the bottom. You can raise it a bit above the bottom to create a water/sludge reservoir to avoid crap from being sucked up into the fuel filters. The fuel return from the engine goes directly to a tee on the fill pipe. The fuel vent goes to an overflow preventor, then to the external vent. The dip stick was something I fiddled out of brass hardware, then calibrated with a file, marking the brass stick as I filled it in five gallon increments. Eventually, because it was a pain reading the notches in a dark space, I installed a standard float-type fuel sender and gauge. The inspection plate covers are epoxied plywood, with tee nuts embedded in the underside of the plywood top, and machine screws mechanically fastening the covers, and with Permatex gasket goop to seal it in between inspections. The tank, itself, is held in place with foam wedges and the floorboard above, which is screwed down to ledgers.

To clean the tank, I just pump out whatever fuel remains, pop off the inspection plates, swab the interior of the tank with rags to make it clean as a whistle, then replace the inspection ports and floorboard. All of the hoses can be easily removed with a screwdriver and the hose clamps above the floorboard. I do it every five years or so, unless I think there might be a problem with cruddy fuel.
__________________

__________________
Roy M is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
diesel, fuel

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Diesel Fuel Tank vs Portable Diesel Fuel Cell GaryMayo Engines and Propulsion Systems 11 13-11-2012 16:47
Jib Downhaul & Stowage ? hellosailor Seamanship & Boat Handling 33 20-10-2012 13:51
Galley stowage ideas James S Construction, Maintenance & Refit 0 26-03-2009 10:31
Washboard/Companionway door stowage James S Construction, Maintenance & Refit 8 24-02-2009 00:51



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 20:05.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.