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Old 09-04-2013, 20:16   #16
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pirate Re: Size Matter

Nice internal layout...
Quite like this one tho'


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Old 09-04-2013, 20:21   #17
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Nevermind that your idea of a practical boat is my idea of a rolling wallowing nightmare. There must be a thousand sound hulls suitable for you dream already built and languishing in yards. Either derelict production boats or unfinished homebuilts. Start with one of those.

What's the rule on boat building? When you are 90% done you are almost halfway there? Especially so with all the useless furniture and redundant rigging in that design.
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Old 09-04-2013, 21:48   #18
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Re: Size Matter

Building a boat yourself, especially a large boat (and "large" easily encompasses 36', let alone 44) is something that requires lots of skill, time and money. One should only ever build a boat if one particularly wants to go through the process of building a boat of and for itself. Buying a brand new boat will almost certainly be cheaper. Buying a decent second hand boat will definitely be cheaper. However, if building a boat is ones dream who are we to naysay, heh
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Old 10-04-2013, 06:43   #19
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Re: Size Matter

A 36' boat will be finished and ready to sail sooner, and for less money, than a 44' boat. What's more, on-going maintenance on a 36' boat will be substantially less than on a 44' boat, and it will be materially easier to sail. As others have said, the fact that the 44' boat is less than 25% longer than the 36' boat, is quite deceiving.

Beyond that, it really is a matter of what you and your family can live with. Families have cruised the world and lived comfortably on smaller boats than 36'. Others have felt too claustrophobic on boats much larger than 44'. What anyone else tells you about how big of a boat you need, really only tells you about THEIR requirements, not yours. What you need to do, as mentioned already, is spend some time with the family on boats to understand what YOUR requirements are.

Good luck.
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Old 10-04-2013, 07:01   #20
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pirate Re: Size Matter

Quote:
Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
A 36' boat will be finished and ready to sail sooner, and for less money, than a 44' boat. What's more, on-going maintenance on a 36' boat will be substantially less than on a 44' boat, and it will be materially easier to sail. As others have said, the fact that the 44' boat is less than 25% longer than the 36' boat, is quite deceiving.

Beyond that, it really is a matter of what you and your family can live with. Families have cruised the world and lived comfortably on smaller boats than 36'. Others have felt too claustrophobic on boats much larger than 44'. What anyone else tells you about how big of a boat you need, really only tells you about THEIR requirements, not yours. What you need to do, as mentioned already, is spend some time with the family on boats to understand what YOUR requirements are.

Good luck.
NB: the selection was based on your stated requirements... space etc... and the rig is for simplicity...
for me..? its a tad more compact...
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Old 10-04-2013, 13:44   #21
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Re: Size Matter

Have you been aboard one like this?

Before deciding to spend years building and $100,000 in materials I'd certainly go aboard as many homebuilt boats as you can to find out what you like. Ask about the sailing characteristics.

Are you going to order the hull or do the hull yourself? I'm only asking because there are so many uncompleted project hulls out there that beg completion at a fraction of the cost you'll spend doing your own. I'm not saying don't build (because you aren't going to want to hear that) I'm just saying find a hull and build from there.

kind regards,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreamsailoring View Post
Since I have read a few posts see what ever one thinks about this design. I have been drooling over this one and one other for a month now. I just needed to hear that I was on the right path.
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Old 10-04-2013, 15:28   #22
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Re: Size Matter

Keep your eyes out for good bargain sales on a good used sailboat that can fit your needs. Just plan to do a total refit and you can probably come out spending less than building a whole new boat.
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Old 10-04-2013, 15:41   #23
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Re: Size Matter

As a step between the referenced 36 & 44, we raised our two children on our 41' center-cockpit with a 'Walk-over" design. There's much to be said for the separate space with the children in the aft cabin. "Go to your room" or pleasantly off to bed was so much better after years on the single cabin 33' sloop until the chidren were 7 and 9.
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Old 10-04-2013, 19:01   #24
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Please have some boat building experience... Limited sailing experience and little or no boat building experience is a recipe for disaster for someone looking to build in the size range you are considering. I know you are building your own boat, I get it, when something goes south you want to be able to fix it pronto, that is what all experienced and responsible cruisers want. The leaning curve is huge in boat building, and the success rate for home builders is not very good to say the least. If you think you are saving money building yourself you would be mistaken. And if you think it's gonna take 6 years to build it will be more like 10 if it gets completed at all. Life gets in the way, " things" happen that will over ride your building fund and you will fall behind schedule time and time again, it's life. I don't want to deter your enthusiasm, it's great you want to build your own boat and sail away, but you should at least consider other avenues. I have been building and renovating boats all of my life, 58 years old now and still at it, to date I have built 11 boats, the largest 20' and have renovated many many more to 43' both power and sail. In this economy you can pick up a decent cruising boat for penny's on the dollar and be way ahead of the game in the end. I see good production boats for free sometimes that are salvageable.. There are boats in yards from one end of this country to the other looking for new owners, of course they are in need of a rebuild and a good carpenter can easily adapt to this work. My advice is to save your money and study fiberglass boat renovation, Don Casey's "This Old Boat" would be a good start, and start looking for neglected and abandoned boats, craigslist, ebay, cruising the boat yards, you will find them. You should consider finding a nice smaller sailboat like a Catalina 22 that needs a make over and practice your building and sailing skills. Cat 22's are everywhere and sometimes for next to nothing and parts are still available from Catalina.
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Old 11-04-2013, 06:31   #25
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Re: Size Matter

After readind and studing and learning we have founs plans for a 25ft boat to build. Though this is not are dream boat we will work to that. The boat is trailable and big enough for long weekend cruising. I feel after talking to everyone and seeing the light that maybe I need to see if the family can do a weekend, a full week and so on. If after the build I still feel like building my dream boat I will have a little more skill time and patients. Maybe with one boat to go out in will help keep me motivated. I did look to see there are boats in that size I am willing to buy and restore. They are quater of what I will spend on building some even less then 1000usd boat I still have an ich to build. I am excited and will be glad to hear more advice but I believe my mind is set up.
I will post picks when the project get started.
Thank you very much.
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Old 11-04-2013, 06:44   #26
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pirate Re: Size Matter

Small steps to start.. avoid giant stumbles later... good decision mate...
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Old 11-04-2013, 11:35   #27
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Re: Size Matter

I think you are starting to understand what experienced folks are trying to tell you about the build idea. I had that dream too as many here have had. Some folks are very much more successful at it than others. Roverhi completed a West Sail 32 but I believe he started with a completed hull and probably some more as well. I decided to start with a small boat, 8 foot dinghy, then did a 12 foot dinghy and now have a big project. If I were to start over again as a young dreamer I'd go down to the docks and buy a ready built production boat I could sail now with some cleanup and minor repair and I'd be miles and dollars ahead as well as sailing the boat instead of working on it.
kind regards,
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Old 11-04-2013, 17:21   #28
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Re: Size Matter

As a rough number, assume a boat yard will build roughly 8 pounds of boat per man hour, and a home builder will get about 5. When you start looking at the massive amount of time involved in large home builds you can start to see why many designers don't want home builders to even attempt their designs. It results in too many half build boats, and boats where people start to cut corners to get done sooner. And frankly when you compare the cost to building your own to buying new, a new boat is typically in the same price range, so you don't even get a significant price savings.

But I like the OP's plan. Build something small and relatively easy to complete in the 800-1,000 hour range, so you can see what a build looks like, and have a boat much sooner.
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Old 11-04-2013, 18:24   #29
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As a rough number, assume a boat yard will build roughly 8 pounds of boat per man hour ...
And that is optimistic. Two people building 8 hours a day could not have built my relatively simple 50 foot boat in 6 months. That 7 pound number must be for a team working in a proper shop building something regularly. Jigs and tooling exist.

Two people would spend 6 months on the phone simply ordering parts and supplies. Not even getting dirty.
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Old 11-04-2013, 18:35   #30
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Re: Size Matter

Daddle,

The 8lb number is what a commercial shipyard would generally assume. So proper molds, materials on a roll, fork lifts to move things, project managers to order materials on schedule, ect. There is of course some variability depending on materials, but not as much as you might think.

And generally the hull of a sailboat is only around 25-30% of the build time. All of the systems, layout, and cabinetry are the rest.
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