Shoal Draft Blue Water and ICW CC Liveaboard

[Cheechako]

I'd say 5-5.5 draft is doable mostly. The bridge height is the issue for the boat size you mention. Do you really need a 50 ft boat? Your lower end length is easier. At 42 you can probably get the mast under 65 ft.

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by TBA

HI Everyone ...

New to Forum and getting back into cruising after many years with an eye toward living aboard. I have a three year plan to get there, which includes ASA classes, bareboat charters and offering myself out as crew.

I'm looking for perhaps a needle in a haystack as the title indicates.

I am looking for a shoal draft and ICW boat because home port will be Sarasota Florida and much of my initial sailing will be done on the Gulf coast, Charlotte Harbor and in the Keys. I'd even love to sneak into the Little Shark River like we did when I was a kid.

I harbor fantasies of sailing this boat transatlantic to cruise the Med and northern europe. I plan on crewing ARC and/or ARC Europe before I taking the helm myself.

I'm a tall guy at 6'4" and I get up in the night and don't want to crawl over anyone nor sleep alone, so I'm focusing on 42-52' CC with a center-line queen. I also want a decent sized pass through and a galley I can stand up in.

In the end it will be my wife and I living aboard. I'm experienced, she not so much. So, the boat should be something two people can comfortably handle and one can do so in a pinch.

I grew on a Tartan 34 and am partial to the classic S&S silhouette. Cost is an object - so am probably looking at 1980 - 2000 vintage.

Thanks in advance for your input.

Cheers

TBA

I say a Island Packet 44 or 420
!

[RSB333]

Don't overlook the Whitby 42. 5' draft, sturdy build, good headroom, and aft cabin can be modified to centerline queen. Many have crossed oceans.
RSB333

[TBA]

Originally Posted by sailing_gal

Those are similar criteria I used when hunting for a boat. Island Packets will tick those boxes. I own my second one now. Sailed current one to Bahamas and then to Europe, currently in the Med. Sailed my prior one to the Bahamas several times and Bermuda twice .

I live aboard now in Spain.

Thanks. You’re living the life I want to lead. Island Packets are surely on my short list, but most seem to be little out of my price range.

[Kiwi.]

Originally Posted by PuttingDoctor

In your neighborhood I would suggest looking for an Irwin 46. I upsized from my original Irwin 38 and couldn’t be happier. Very ample headroom and the later models are inline queen master cabins.
There is one up at Green Cove Springs and a 43 at Amelia Island that I looked at with a friend. Good luck with your search.
https://www.sailboatlistings.com/sailboats/Irwin

A good Irwin is hard to go past given your spec. I'm tall and my wife hates me climbing over her in the night (except for one reason) and she also hates making beds that she has to be on when making it.
The 52 ft Irwin center cockpit ketch is a good option; the ketch rig is good for air draft clearance under bridges and is also great for inexperienced crew as the sails are smaller. If you can find one with the bigger engine option it really helps when bucking the currents you can experience in the Danube and Rhine if you're heading across Europe. Here's one that would leave you some money to check out the rig properly: https://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/76104

[sailorboy1]

You guys are too paranoid, I've been up/down those areas a couple times in my 6'4" draft boat.

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

You guys are too paranoid, I've been up/down those areas a couple times in my 6'4" draft boat.

^^ this

[dbcape]

https://www.boattrader.com/listing/1...-ii-103385828/
This boat will meet most of your requirements

[Jonathan Hansen]

We have a 46' CC turnkey blue water cruiser available that meets all of your needs with exceptions of the queen sized centered bed, and the location. The options for sleeping for two are the v-berth, where my wife and I sleep (78" length - I'm 6' and 170lbs - she's 5'6" and 120 lbs), or the master stateroom which we use as our guest room, which has one 82" length by 56" width bed and a 5' settee. It is also my wife's "private" quarters. The location of our boat is the Pacific coast of Mexico. We are not aggressively selling her, so she might be available a year or more out. If interested in learning additional, e-mail me at: svmollyj@yahoo.com

[sailorman7225]

Here is another IP owner confirming what the others have said. The boat was built for what you described. I might add just north of Sarasota is Whitiker Yacht Sales @ Regatta Point Marina in Palmetto. They sell a lot of IP’s and can keep their eye out for what you want.

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by TBA

I am looking for a shoal draft and ICW boat because home port will be Sarasota Florida and much of my initial sailing will be done on the Gulf coast, Charlotte Harbor and in the Keys. I'd even love to sneak into the Little Shark River like we did when I was a kid.

I harbor fantasies of sailing this boat transatlantic to cruise the Med and northern europe. I plan on crewing ARC and/or ARC Europe before I taking the helm myself.

Originally Posted by sailorman7225

Here is another IP owner confirming what the others have said.

IP's are great boats for live aboard and absolutely as an ICW and Bahamas boat.



I'm simply not impressed with them as offshore boats. They don't point very well, especially the three-digit boats. You can certainly cross oceans on them, and indeed in comfort. It's going to take a while and you'll motor a good bit.



Naval architect Bob Johnson did a great job of understanding his market and designing for it. He drew spacious, comfortable, and sea kindly boats. The Full Foil Keel (tm) of the three-digit boats assuaged concerns about draft in the ICW and Bahamas and indeed on the West coast of Florida. Sailing performance was simply not on the list of design criteria. Yes, once in awhile you'll see an IP take honors in a rally but you'll see two characteristics: experienced, capable crews and good winds abaft the beam.



An IP may be the right boat for @TBA. Getting across the Atlantic will take more work than a cruiser with a more balanced design.

[TBA]

Originally Posted by Auspicious

I'm not going to challenge your choices. I will share my perspective.



Flipping the VHF antenna upside down is not a big deal, and while you're up there you can easily pull the wind instruments if they stick up. It's a good chance to check rigging and lights and running rigging for chafe. Your call.


Mast height probably isn't an issue in your draft constraints. There are a lot of people who think 5 to 5-1/2' is some hard stop. There are people who won't buy boats with more than 4'. I've taken 8' up the ICW and 9' through the Bahamas. I took 7-1/2' out of Bradenton FL.



Do you know the biggest difference between a boat that draws 7' and one that draws 5'? How close to shore you are when you run aground. *grin*


In my opinion people worry too much about draft and not enough about fit. Headroom is an issue for you. How about sailing performance?



You mentioned double-handing (1-1/2? *grin*) and some single-handing. May I respectfully suggest lessons as a really good investment? There is really no reason that any boat in the recreational market can't be single-handed. Classrooms and groups afloat are a big help but a coach is like graduate school.



If by some remote chance you are coming to Annapolis for Boat Show drop me a line and we can chat.

Thanks for reply.

I know a lot about the running aground part! Glad we did it on nice sandy bottoms.

I am concerned about the fit. Galleys in the pass through seem like they may be a problem. Berths will always be an issue.

I am planning on taking courses and doing flotillas. I have ASA 106 scheduled for October in Corfu. Will do captained/bare boat charters in US and Europe and up to 108 before I buy.

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by TBA

Thanks, Pete. I had not looked at the moodys thinking they were deeper draft. A new world. I had planned on buying in the states, but have no real reason for that other than that’s what I understand. I’m currently living in Italy.

Actually, buying a EU yacht with the VAT paid even if you take it home and come back could be a sound investment or you have to play the Schenzen game of both boat and you moving in and out of Europe every so often. Oh and 230v which you will be used to.

However, not sure I could recommend buying a yacht located in the UK a the moment,

[TBA]

Originally Posted by RSB333

Don't overlook the Whitby 42. 5' draft, sturdy build, good headroom, and aft cabin can be modified to centerline queen. Many have crossed oceans.
RSB333

I'm very familiar with the Whitby. My step-father worked in the yard in Fort Myers where they were made. Would be a hoot to have a boat that he helped build. I had not thought much about internal modifications other than possible updates in the galley. We put an addition on our house and it was the worst experience of my life. I can imagine gutting an aft cabin and having it redone would be a similar level of pain.

Does anybody have experience doing what was suggested?

Thanks,

[valhalla360]

Draft is easy to check.

More importantly, what is your definition of Blue Water boat? There is no universally agreed definition.

One option not mentioned is some of the older 33-38' cats (but giving the space of a 40-45' mono). That should get you below 4' draft. Many of the older ones have more modest beams (14-16') so you can fit into slips and get thru smaller canals. They are also usually conservatively rigged, so bridge clearance isn't as big of an issue.

We had a Catalac 10m, that had 3 cabins, 3' draft, a well established blue water design and at 6'2" I had plenty of headroom throughout...Well within your price range.