Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 27 votes, 4.26 average. Display Modes
Old 21-06-2006, 14:35   #46
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 13,056
"Actually anchoring by the stern," A nice idea and convenient for short handing, but if the anchor rode and the rudder (or shaft) mix it up...UGH.
__________________

__________________
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 07:06   #47
cruiser

Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,525
I recently developed a new opinion regarding sailing at anchor. Since I've been living at anchor since May or so... I have found that ALL boats sail at anchor. Power boats, sailboats, boats rigged not to sail... etc... Well, I may not want to say "all", but I'll say "most."

Sitting next to many unattended boats for months now, I have seen them all sailing happily at anchor or on their moorings with no detriment to the boat. I sail back and forth constantly, but it's the same with every other boat. I think with a good snubber system and a solid anchor, it's really not a big deal. I also think it's inherent in higher freeboard. Power or sail... just about every boat I'm next to right now in some 30mph winds today are happily sailing about their anchor or mooring. It's probably not something to worry so much about. I think there are other things that should get a higer priority.
__________________

__________________
ssullivan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 08:15   #48
Senior Cruiser
 
Talbot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Brighton, UK
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 3,579
Images: 32
sailing at anchor can get out of control in extreme circumstances and even break out the anchor!

boats of similar type will all sail in a similar manner, but almost not in a similar direction or periodicity, thus danger of collission if you are too close

a cat will tend to sail faster, and more extreme angle than a heavy mono. (as will some mobos) as directional stability is not as good.

The problems occur therefore:

if you are anchored too close,
if you are in a different type of boat with different sailing characteristics,
if wind/tide swell characteristics are combining to make the angle of sailing extreme enough to risk un-setting the anchor.
__________________
"Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss."
Robert A Heinlein
Talbot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 08:47   #49
cruiser

Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,525
Yup... Talbot's exactly correct. For the newbies, always pay a lot of attention to these factors when anchoring. Leave lots of room when anchoring.

My boat, when sailing at anchor, does not tend to drag the anchor side to side to any great angle. It tends to "twist" at anchor about the keel and pulls the anchor rode in a similar manner to a dog shaking its head while pulling on a toy you are holding. It loads and then unloads each line of my dual-line bridal snubber system. The anchor chain doesn't take much lateral movement.

Sure, in a hurricane things might be different, but I'm starting to think I'll just haul out in that case. Not worth the risk or expense of trying to stay in the water.
__________________
ssullivan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 09:04   #50
Senior Cruiser
 
Talbot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Brighton, UK
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 3,579
Images: 32
If you are in a cat and you get hauled out for a hurricane, the highest risk of damage will be from mons falling over ont top of your stable pride and joy!
__________________
"Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss."
Robert A Heinlein
Talbot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 09:09   #51
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,413
The sailing on the hook is only a concern when it leads to chafe and wear of the ground tackle. Obviously more movement means ultimately more wear and to failure. But this is probably a long term concern.

A minor issue is in croweded anchorages where vessels anchor with different scopes and different swing patterns... and the wind pipes up and the swinging begings. It is not unreasonably to see boats instead of lying to wind with adaquate spacing... to be swinging and end up close enough to hit each other and cause some damage.

With adaquate spacing, of course this is not a problem.

Jef
sv Shiva
Contest 36s
__________________
Sandero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 09:21   #52
Senior Cruiser
 
Talbot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Brighton, UK
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 3,579
Images: 32
depends how you define adequate spacing. What may seem to be adequate when you anchor with the wind and tide both in the same direction, may be totally inadequate when tide changes as the long keeler will be controlled significantly bythe tide, whereas the cat may be laying in a totally different direction, because the wind is the significant factor.
__________________
"Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss."
Robert A Heinlein
Talbot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 09:56   #53
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,413
It depends on what the meaning of IS is.
__________________
Sandero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 13:32   #54
cruiser

Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,525
Ha ha ha!
__________________
ssullivan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 15:00   #55
Senior Cruiser
 
mikereed100's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Santa Barbara
Boat: 46' custom cat
Posts: 1,573
Images: 2
I have tried several tricks to prevent sailing at anchor with varying degrees of success. My favorite, if space allows, is to use 2 anchors set to windward off the bow. Not only does this cut down on sailing but allows me to sleep like a babe even in 40+ knots. A variation of this is to use a second anchor set on short scope off the bow (I use a Bruce for this) but this anchor will eventually drag if the wind gets up enough. I have had less success with using a bridle to make the boat lay to one side (it will eventually tack) and using a stern anchor set tight. Haven't tried a riding sail but is sounds like it's worth a go. Should be easy enough to make one out of an old jib.

Mike
__________________
mikereed100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 15:05   #56
Senior Cruiser
 
Talbot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Brighton, UK
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 3,579
Images: 32
on a monohull, a bridle has less effect than on a modern wide catamaran. therefore it is necessary to attach the bridle from at least midships, or even further aftand then experiment with the anchor chain length to the bridle to adjust the boats angle. When set up even on a mono, there should not be any tacking.
__________________
"Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss."
Robert A Heinlein
Talbot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 15:27   #57
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 13,056
"It depends on what the meaning of IS is."
Only if you refer to your headsail as "Monica".<G>
__________________
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-06-2006, 20:23   #58
Senior Cruiser
 
colemj's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Presently on US East Coast
Boat: Manta 40 "Reach"
Posts: 10,049
Images: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Talbot
a cat will tend to sail faster, and more extreme angle than a heavy mono. (as will some mobos) as directional stability is not as good.
You know, I always hear this, but I don't experience it on my Manta 40 cat. It certainly scoots around in the wind when untethered, because it has more surface area above the water than below. But when it is bridled to the anchor rode with a 20' length to each bow, it rides rock steady in all wind. Did you mean that cats sail more when the anchor line is simply cleated off on the bow amidship without a bridle? That certainly would be true for mine.

Mark
__________________
colemj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2006, 14:18   #59
Senior Cruiser
 
mikereed100's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Santa Barbara
Boat: 46' custom cat
Posts: 1,573
Images: 2
Talbot,
The bridle arrangement you describe is pretty close to what I use. I put a snatch block with a short line attatched to it on the rode then winch it in with the primaries until the boat is lying at about a 45 degree angle to the wind. It works pretty good until the wind really kicks up. Once the spindrift hits the dodger and the kayaks are spinning like kites at the end of their painters the boat will tack unless the bridle is adjusted to an extreme angle. Then instead of tacking i am heeling way past the point where my wine glass can be left unsupervised.
Mike
__________________
mikereed100 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-06-2006, 14:27   #60
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,413
Sailing about on the anchor can be helped with a riding sail rigged to the backstay for a sloop. Like the mizzen it will tend to keep the boat waethercocked.

Jef
sv Shiva
Contest 36s
__________________

__________________
Sandero is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Getting in Shape for Sailing Season Sonosailor General Sailing Forum 0 23-06-2004 06:11
Fall Sailing Stede General Sailing Forum 4 21-10-2003 19:49
Social aspects of club sailing 29cascadefixer General Sailing Forum 9 07-10-2003 14:52
suggestion: sailing schools cbare Forum Tech Support & Site Help 0 04-06-2003 10:41
Portal sailing website project CaptainTom Meets & Greets 2 20-03-2003 07:50



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:19.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.