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**Jim Cate** · 05-12-2014, 15:56

Yes, those S&S designs from that era are just wonderful to sail, and most are pretty as well.

But, I worry about their lack of Plexus and a liner... probably won't last well!

Jim

Pelagic · 05-12-2014, 16:18

Weicome to CF ihe2

I have delivered a few Swans from the 1970-80's era and they were a joy to sail. So perfectly balanced that in the days before autopilots were the norm, you were not fatigued in all kinds of offshore weather .

Even the larger ones 48-65 felt as responsive as a sailing dingy and the quality of fit out was the best.

Thank you for sharing.

**Dockhead** · 05-12-2014, 16:21

Your story is very similar to that of some people we met in Hamina, Finland, during the summer. Who graciously invited us to berth in their yacht club when the town quay was full, and we ended up spending a very enjoyable evening with them.

They had done an Atlantic circuit as newlyweds on a small Beneteau First, I think a 30 footer. Crazy. They finally found their dream boat, a S&S Swan 47 (I think) in Italy, and had just sailed it all the way back from there to Finland (that must be 3,000 or 4,000 miles). Hard core sailors, both of them.

Congratulations on your acquisition! Those classic Swans are gorgeous.

taildragerdrive · 05-12-2014, 19:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Yes, those S&S designs from that era are just wonderful to sail, and most are pretty as well.

But, I worry about their lack of Plexus and a liner... probably won't last well!

Jim

Jim:

I'm relatively new to sailing and this is my first and only boat. I have sailed on many others though in the last few years.

My Swan has been well cared for and for its age is very nice shape with possibly some dings and bumps to interior finish that I'm slowly working to refinish. It doesn't leak I think it was designed to have few places where it could leak. The through hulls are in good shape. It seems as solid or solider than any of the other boats I have sailed on. I don't see any real deterioration and see no reason that it will not last another 50 years as it is almost that old now.

So can you explain in more detail to me your reply about "lack of Plexus and a liner" I don't get your point. Why would either of these things preclude it from lasting a long time?

Thanks

**Jim Cate** · 05-12-2014, 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by taildragerdrive

Jim:

I'm relatively new to sailing and this is my first and only boat. I have sailed on many others though in the last few years.

My Swan has been well cared for and for its age is very nice shape with possibly some dings and bumps to interior finish that I'm slowly working to refinish. It doesn't leak I think it was designed to have few places where it could leak. The through hulls are in good shape. It seems as solid or solider than any of the other boats I have sailed on. I don't see any real deterioration and see no reason that it will not last another 50 years as it is almost that old now.

So can you explain in more detail to me your reply about "lack of Plexus and a liner" I don't get your point. Why would either of these things preclude it from lasting a long time?

Thanks

Oy vey, taildragger! That was a joking reference to the ongoing bunfight on the thread called "The Yard Guys" here on CF. In it, there is great contention between folks who love and respect old "stick built" boats, like yours, and the folks who like the newer ones that rely upon a stressed liner stuck in with an adhesive called Plexus. If my tongue had been any further into my cheek it would have likely stuck out of my ear.

FWIW, Ann and I cruised in a Palmer Johnson Standfast 36 for 17 years. PJ used to build some Swan designs in the USA (including IIRC some examples of the lovely Swan 36). So far we are not convinced of the desirability of the modern construction techniques as practiced by many mass production builders today.

So, rest assured that I too believe that your Swan might well be gracing the seas fifty years on.

Jim

taildragerdrive · 06-12-2014, 06:41

Jim:
Thanks I don't have time to read CF all the time so I missed that one.

I am always looking to gain in my limited boat and sailing knowledge. So I was lost on that one.

Thanks for the clarification.

**HappyMdRSailor** · 06-12-2014, 07:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Yes, those S&S designs from that era are just wonderful to sail, and most are pretty as well.

But, I worry about their lack of Plexus and a liner... probably won't last well!

Jim

HAAAAAAAAAA!!!! AWESOME!!!

Too bad I didn't respond before you had to explain it...

Suijin · 06-12-2014, 07:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Oy vey, taildragger! That was a joking reference to the ongoing bunfight on the thread called "The Yard Guys" here on CF. In it, there is great contention between folks who love and respect old "stick built" boats, like yours, and the folks who like the newer ones that rely upon a stressed liner stuck in with an adhesive called Plexus. If my tongue had been any further into my cheek it would have likely stuck out of my ear.

I'm totally perplexed as to why a liner is considered an advance, other than cost considerations during manufacture. I'm continually frustrated when working on boats with liners in terms of the pitiful access they allow. Plexus, OTOH, seems to have it's merits but I have yet to see any problems with my glassed tabs after 27 years and some hard sailing.

ClassicSwan.org is a fascinating site. I do have to say I was only vaguely aware of the prices that older Swans command. It's pretty eye-popping when you see early 70's 40' boats for well over $100k...

The double companionways has always been a problem for me. One of my favorite all-time lookers, the Alden 44 has them. But every boat is a compromise...mine certainly has quite a few.

But, every time I see a Swan my heart quickens a bit. They are absolutely gorgeous machines and a joy to sail.

paul1804 · 29-12-2014, 20:30

Great to see a lovely boat and she will turn heads everywhere you go.
I also have a S&S Swan the 48 she is a dream and is in brilliant condition.
2016 is a important year in the Swan S&S events maybe see you there in Italy

Steadman Uhlich · 29-12-2014, 20:55

Every Swan I have seen is beautiful, sleek, and looks like a thoroughbred racing heritage boat.

Whenever I see one, I know it is not only my eyes on the boat looking on it with some admiration, lust, and appreciation.

May she bring more dreams come true to you!

deluxe68 · 27-04-2015, 13:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihe2

Hi, it's a perfect cruiser but I might be biased of course

. If You like Your Yacht being fast in most conditions, stiff in a blow, easy on the helm and a beauty to Your eyes it might be worth buying. But forget a Swan in a project condition unless You have very deep pockets.

You sure have read the classicswan.org?

BTW at least in my Yacht the anchor chain is routed to the bilge via a very stiff hose from the deck to it's dedicated locker beneath the forepeak beds.

I am still considering the 431 for sale by Nautor USA and the price is right. It has fairly new teak topside (no screws) and engine. Is there anything in particular I should watch out for on this model? The keel step has a little corrosion from what I can see from the pictures. One of our requirements is a dodger for the cockpit but I have been unable to find any pictures where someone installed one.

savoir · 27-04-2015, 14:01

The standard Swan dodger is quite small and built for racing. It is only just wider than the companionway. Chances are you would be building a bigger one anyway.

The standard dodgers look like this.

deluxe68 · 27-04-2015, 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by savoir

The standard Swan dodger is quite small and built for racing. It is only just wider than the companionway. Chances are you would be building a bigger one anyway.

The standard dodgers look like this.

I have seen lots of pictures of various Swans with the smaller dodger. There are very few pictures of dodgers that are the width of the cockpit and none of the 431 specifically.