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Old 23-12-2018, 07:22   #16
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

I bought an FD12 few years ago that was deteriorating. They are from the same yard and time frame when Perry designed the boat you are looking at. Survey was a waste of money as everything needed to go. One thing he said was solid was the hull and the engine. Well few hours into ripping stuff out I found that hull was waterlogged. It's been a long road. 2 years and about 2k hours of labor in it, I would say it pushed me to the brink. I am about $80k of total cost for parts, materials, transport and marina fees and she was splashed last august. My plan was to sail south for the winter but in september i found that most of electronics and equipment was damaged by lightning. I'm alectronics engineer and did a most everything myself. Things are comming together nicely, but the other side fo my life, marriage, kids, friends and family has taken a hit.
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Old 23-12-2018, 09:46   #17
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

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This might sound strange but I am Aircaft Mechanic and I actually want to do the restoration. Its part of the journey. Why do madmen build boats from scratch? I cant explain it. I can spraypaint extremely well and rebuilding the Lehmnan Diesel will be (relatively) easy for me. There is a load of work I can do myself. I have just taken redundancy so working on the boat full time is not an issue and when I am finished I will know every centimetre of the boat.
Contrary to many others opinion on this forum, I would say that if the hull and deck are good(no osmosis or delamination, ) if you have the energy and time and the price reflect the real value of the boat(before refit) why not do do it?. Once the refit completed you will know everything on that boat and it might be better than new . The key issue here is your capacity to do most of the work yourself, and a very good surveyor that will look into important area to avoid any big surprise. In my experience, the cost of refit will be twice the estimate, and four time the effort. I understand that you have a good technical expertise, and that is important.
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Old 23-12-2018, 09:52   #18
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

Do you know that you can hire bob perry for advice?
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Old 23-12-2018, 10:13   #19
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

I just sailed the Harvest Moon regatta (Galveston to Port Aransas) on a Perry 47, same boat design. She was bought from a charity where she had been donated. Needed new fuel and water tanks, as original black iron had rotted. She was rewired, due to electrical issues. Teak decking had been removed, but lots of rotten core, some had been repaired, but poorly done by injecting resin into deck, but other areas, such as the aft deck was like walking on a pillow. That said, the boat still felt solid. she also had rigging replaced. The Ford Leyman had been rebuilt. Note nice feature for engine is that cockpit floor was removable, so easy engine removal for rebuild.


Sailing: she sailed well, on all points, close hauled was a bit slow, but on a reach, she outpaced the fleet in 15-20 knots. When the wind dropped, she slowed considerably as she weighs 43,000 lbs and when wind shifted to close haul, she dropped by back in the fleet.


The steering is hydraulic and there was little feel of the boat as a result, plus cylinder was leaking and she would not hold a rudder position without continually turning the wheel, if fighting a hard weather helm. Lots of fuel and water storage and the Leyman is a powerful engine for this boat.

She would be a big project, and I concur with what many have said here. Do you wish to sail or spend the next few years rebuilding and refitting a boat. Need less to say, lots of money also required.
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Old 23-12-2018, 10:37   #20
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

I won't get into advise because we bought a "worker" and it took us 4 years to get to sea. And I didn't count the $$$ spent because I simply didn't want to know. ( I have a rough idea though).

Robert Perry is very active on Facebook - both his own page and in groups, like "All Thing Sailing" "Liveaboard Sailboat". He appears to be very approachable and is still excited about many of his designs. I suggest you contact him through his website or one of the FB pages and ask his opinion of the hull.

I think you have nothing to lose and it will take 5 mintues of your time. Good luck!
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Old 23-12-2018, 10:54   #21
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

Robert Perry design; no faults
80s Taiwanese built; strong as a brick S+++house
from the pictures I see neglect; the black on the teak could be mold
Get a surveyor, if you have the time and elbows you can bring her back to life yourself.
oh its a ketch not a cutter even if she has a staysail
good luck and if you go through with it post the progress
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Old 23-12-2018, 10:59   #22
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

If you paid nothing, had 75G's to invest and enjoyed restoring old boats it might be worth it.
Most people regret getting into a project like this. Personally I love it.
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Old 23-12-2018, 11:09   #23
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

I fell in love with a Taiwanese Landfall 39. She was exactly the cruising boat I was looking for, built for cruising, had been through 2 hurricanes at sea and not on the edge of them. Solidly built as I suspect this one is.

I learned a lot about Taiwanese boat building and through this adventure became a shipwright.

How boats were built (at least then) in Taiwan goes like this. A yard builds the hull and then carious families come in and do their bit. Maybe they are wood specialists, electrical specialists etc. They go from yard to yard doing what they do. Then you also have owners who want different things in their new boats. What does this mean to you? Ahh, generally speaking no 2 boats are built the same. They may be a specific make/model/builder but you have different qualities of the actual build depending who did the work.

A friend had a sister ship to mine and his was all fiberglass including the sub deck where all the other Landfall's I've seen were plywood, fiberglass then teak.

They call them Leaky Teaky's for a reason. Delivering his boat south we had to wear full rain gear inside the boat due to how much water dripped on us. In my boat, one night I counted 151 individual leaks. Teak decks look great but how they installed them was a nightmare. They never last. So, you will likely have to remove the teak decks and the sundeck, get down to the frames and see what is still good and what needs to be replaced. Then install a new sundeck and a cover which likely will be fiberglass this time out unless you have the skills, tools required to vacuum bag the teak decks into place. Your toe rail is an awesome feature. However, it is supported by marine ply which is surely rotted out by this time. Another fun job. Then you have the actual house. That will probably need to go as well.

You will learn a lot on a project of this scale. You helpers may be as in to it as you or they may well get tired of it and bail. You will make mistakes. Some you will catch in time, others will rear their ugly heads years later.

And as others have said, the electronics are junk and the wiring may be as well and let's not forget the plumbing systems. Shower pans probably have rot in them the list goes on and on.

Are you ready for such a huge undertaking? Is your family/relationships? Truth be told you would be far better off buying a bare hull and starting from scratch. A lot less work. As others have said, do you want to sail or just work on the boat? And work and work and work. You will be at this project for years.

Fair market value as described to me would be 10-20K. Actually they could just give it to you. I am very serious on the price and part of what I used to do was help clients buy boats.

Last year, I bought another project boat. Can't believe I did it but it was what I wanted and fit within my budget and I know how to do every repair on a boat. I also. knew that it was a 1 year project and about 30K. Ok, so it's going to be 18. months.. sigh.
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Old 23-12-2018, 11:10   #24
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

Itís a truism that it takes more money to restore a neglected example of a given boat than it takes to buy a well maintained example of the same boat. Think about that long and hard before you jump in.

After 15 years on the hard thereís a good chance that youíll have to replace every mechanical system on the boat, rewire the boat, including the mast, rebed everything on the deck. replace all the running rigging. And the list goes on.

Yes it WAS a great boat. Now itís a money pit. If you have not owned and maintained and repaired a big boat then you donít have the experience to evaluate what youíre looking at and calculate what itís going to take in money and time to make her good again.
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Old 23-12-2018, 11:43   #25
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

Have sailed a Perry design for 30 years and a big fan of how they perform offshore.
Not sure what he charges now but he will advise you on buying a boat his or other designs. He was generous with his time and very candid even about his own designs.
Best value for money I ever spent on a boat.
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Old 23-12-2018, 11:50   #26
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

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Originally Posted by Metal Boat View Post
Check out this guy this guy likes pain
typical aussie, I watch his stuff all the time: respect
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCcJ...6_BHsnbytM0jzg
Yeah right; everything you see on TV is real.
I hope that this isn't your justification for actual experience.
But a suggestion. Why not acquire a beaten up little trailer sailor and restore it. That would give you a good indication of the effort and whether you and your kids enjoy doing it. There are hundreds of those little project boats around.

Also all the comments you received with the earlier boat you asked about are just as relevant and applicable to this one. You missed including the last paragraph of their advert too.We purchased the vessel for $50k and have spent another $25k with ship wrights.....we are seeking only $35k so there is a lot of value to a handy and able bodied person. A fantastic vessel just needing some TLC and minor money spent.

So what was it their grand dad, their father or themselves. Ad smells very badly.
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Old 23-12-2018, 12:11   #27
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

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Originally Posted by Metal Boat View Post
This might sound strange but I am Aircaft Mechanic and I actually want to do the restoration. Its part of the journey. Why do madmen build boats from scratch? I cant explain it. I can spraypaint extremely well and rebuilding the Lehmnan Diesel will be (relatively) easy for me. There is a load of work I can do myself. I have just taken redundancy so working on the boat full time is not an issue and when I am finished I will know every centimetre of the boat.
You and I have a lot in common. I try to do the same thing with the west sale . I try to do the same thing with the west sail 42 and it just about killed me.. Donít do it find something that works and sail!
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Old 23-12-2018, 13:58   #28
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

Be aware that this is a lifestyle rather than a project. If you don't accept that then walk away. You need a passion and a love for the work itself.
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Old 23-12-2018, 14:02   #29
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metal Boat View Post
This might sound strange but I am Aircaft Mechanic and I actually want to do the restoration. Its part of the journey. Why do madmen build boats from scratch? I cant explain it. I can spraypaint extremely well and rebuilding the Lehmnan Diesel will be (relatively) easy for me. There is a load of work I can do myself. I have just taken redundancy so working on the boat full time is not an issue and when I am finished I will know every centimetre of the boat.

Well I like it. Good design. Taiwanese fibreglass work is usually terrific. Thousands of dollars worth of superb teak. Engine that is ridiculously cheap to rebuild. The stainless steel looks in good shape. The only downside is the rig and sails. Mast will have to be stripped back to bare aluminium and then left with a clear finish and new sails will be expensive. Plenty of household products available to sort out any interior problems.
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Old 23-12-2018, 14:02   #30
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Re: Robert Perry 47 Taiwanese Built

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Indeed I understand perfectly, thats why I want to look very carefully at the boat and how much work is involved. The price is reasonable 30,000 AUD but I would love for others to chime in with ball park figures. I am happy to do all the work myself, I am honestly looking forward to it. There is much joy in engineering, but what I dont want to do is structural hull work (within reason some fibreglass work is fine, but not chopping out ballast etc). All the rest will be good solid fun and I have two boys to train as well. I expect this boat will need upwards of 150,000 to 200,000 to fix. I estimate its maximum value in this market in immaculate condtion to be 100,000 AUD. But again much appreciated for the words of caution Dale.
Well if you put $200k plus labor into it and it will have a market value of $100k afterward, then a good purchase price would be $-100k. So financially it can't work. Any boat purchase is a bad financial decision, you just really need to limit the pain if you are not exceedly rich.
How long will the project take to get to the point that you can enjoy cruising the boat? That depends a lot on how close by the boat is to work on, how much free cash is available to buy components, how much dedicated time you have to put into the boat. Anything less than 50% retired and it could easily be a 5 year project. How long can you keep the enthusiasm going and the families?

If you are going to have the $100k in the future to fix this tarnished gem, why not purchase a $100k boat in far better condition that someone else has dumped in the excessive rehab money and then take the $30k you'd have left and your skills to make an exceptional cruiser for you?
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