Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 20-07-2016, 19:43   #451
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 15,391
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Yes.

But looking at things from my singular experience of an ex financial world nerdie. (ex nerdie, the financial world is doing as fine as ever)

:

install a below decks AP
2 days

Install a radar
2 days

Install a windlass
2 days

Install refrigeration
1 day, 0 days, if you settle on ice

assemble complete spares and tools
danger, the boat will sink

install a staysail track
no, buy a boat with one if you think you need one
(OK, 2 days)

install an inner forestay
no, buy a boat with one if you think you need one
(OK, say a week)

possibly replace standing rigging
a week max, in a 40'er

possibly replace nav lights
possibly 2 days

install AIS
1 day

install a HF radio
no idea, I guess a week maybe?

get storm sails, drogue
buy online, next

install heating
so now that you have a fridge, you sure need a heater
no bonus, get a lover to hug on the colder days

install a water maker
about a week, maybe two if you run into challenges

and so on
ETERNINTY

Now I have proven, all the real tasks listed above can be done in about two months of intensive work of one skilled person (not getting a lover though, unless you find someone who likes smelly people).

The only item that cannot be ticked off in this time frame is the 'and so on'. And this is exactly what many wouldabies are doing for years before getting a heart attack or saying the dream was just a dream.

Whether one wants to sail a cat or stay mono, it does not have to take years to get their boat ready for sailing away. But it can.

Good reading for those who claim it all takes so much time:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson's_law
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hofstadter's_law

Cheers, love and flowers,
b.
__________________

__________________
barnakiel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-07-2016, 20:30   #452
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Massachussetts
Boat: Cheoy Lee 47 CC
Posts: 661
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
Yes.

But looking at things from my singular experience of an ex financial world nerdie. (ex nerdie, the financial world is doing as fine as ever)

:

install a below decks AP
2 days

Install a radar
2 days

Install a windlass
2 days

Install refrigeration
1 day, 0 days, if you settle on ice

assemble complete spares and tools
danger, the boat will sink

install a staysail track
no, buy a boat with one if you think you need one
(OK, 2 days)

install an inner forestay
no, buy a boat with one if you think you need one
(OK, say a week)

possibly replace standing rigging
a week max, in a 40'er

possibly replace nav lights
possibly 2 days

install AIS
1 day

install a HF radio
no idea, I guess a week maybe?

get storm sails, drogue
buy online, next

install heating
so now that you have a fridge, you sure need a heater
no bonus, get a lover to hug on the colder days

install a water maker
about a week, maybe two if you run into challenges

and so on
ETERNINTY

Now I have proven, all the real tasks listed above can be done in about two months of intensive work of one skilled person (not getting a lover though, unless you find someone who likes smelly people).

The only item that cannot be ticked off in this time frame is the 'and so on'. And this is exactly what many wouldabies are doing for years before getting a heart attack or saying the dream was just a dream.

Whether one wants to sail a cat or stay mono, it does not have to take years to get their boat ready for sailing away. But it can.

Good reading for those who claim it all takes so much time:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson's_law
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hofstadter's_law

Cheers, love and flowers,
b.
Can't disagree with your basic outline of reality when it comes to bringing a cruiser up to a solid boat. Some are needed, others very nice to have, but not necessary to cruise, although it does make it more comfortable.
A high level of activity for a fixed period of time can accomplish much, especially if your in the groove, just have to hope life doesn't intrude rudely during your re-build.
It's quite possible to do, and well worth it in the end.
__________________

__________________
lifeofreilly57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-07-2016, 20:32   #453
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,182
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

What you forgot was all the time to do due diligence on all the stuff you are deciding on. Sometimes you have to drive for many miles just to get to your boat. Often people are working at other stuff and can't work full time on the boat. And finally everyone has a different idea on what ready to go means. But ya, if everything was sitting in front of you it would definitely take a lot less time to refit your boat.
__________________
robert sailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 05:22   #454
Registered User
 
malbert73's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Boat: Tartan 40
Posts: 912
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

I find it's fun to make a boat "just right" but even a well equipped one takes 1-2 years to figure out what that is. But of course you can do all that while cruising full or part time. But I thought my boat was set 2 years ago when I purchased and now I realize how much better for me it is after 2 years of puttering and projects and upgrades


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
malbert73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 07:55   #455
Moderator
 
noelex 77's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Full time cruising. Currently in the Med.
Boat: Aluminium yacht
Posts: 10,022
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Quote:
Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
Isn't that so true, it usually takes close to 2 years to get your boat properly outfitted...who wants to start that process over?
One of the reasons for buying a new boat (it's a monohull so guess I am I the stay with monohull camp) is that we have finished outfitting our current boat .

My tip is go now. You can have a lot of fun on even the most basic boat. Gradually improving the systems can be great projects and something I personally enjoy.

You will appreciate (for example) that water maker all that more if you do without and then install it yourself. As well, you will then be in a better position to fix any problems that develop.

Anyway, as Rat said there is “there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats.”
__________________
Our custom built cutter rigged sloop is for sale:
48' Aluminium Bluewater Cruiser For Sale

Mermaids & Anchors
noelex 77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 08:06   #456
smj
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: galveston tx.
Boat: Searunner 38 catamaran
Posts: 2,887
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Quote:
Originally Posted by noelex 77 View Post
One of the reasons for buying a new boat (it's a monohull so guess I am I the stay with monohull camp) is that we have finished outfitting our current boat .



My tip is go now. You can have a lot of fun on even the most basic boat. Gradually improving the systems can be great projects and something I personally enjoy.



You will appreciate (for example) that water maker all that more if you do without and then install it yourself. As well, you will then be in a better position to fix any problems that develop.



Anyway, as Rat said there is “there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats.”

I absolutely agree, especially if this is to be someone's first cruise. Start of with a spartan boat boat then gradually ad equipment as you feel the need.


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
smj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 08:23   #457
Registered User
 
Sandero's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Southern Westchester/Northport LI
Boat: Shiva - Contest 36s
Posts: 4,029
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

The actual work may take perhaps 2 man months... but then you need to consider getting all the materials... tools, back and forth to the boat. I think it's conceivable to bust your butt and get this done in a few months... but this seems exhausting and takes some decent choreography.... and access to the boat.

I was once at the end of a very very long finger and it took more than 5 minutes to get to the ramp and another 5 to the parked car... and then 15 minutes to get to the chandlery or hardware store. Lots of time is lost to going back and forth... If you do this on a mooring it really kicks of the time.

Long and short of it is....the off shore / live aboard / cruising upgrades will take a variable amount of time depending on multiple factors. Can it be done in 2 months? Possibly... I think this is probably at the short end with optimal conditions... Probably 6 months is more realistic and a year if the boat needs a lot... and is not very accessible.

My AP installation took considerably longer than 2 man days. I had to fabricate parts in a wood shop, glass them to the hull... modify part of a lazerette.... do drafting and layout work... pull the lazerrettes apart to get in there to do the install... order an insert from Holland to mount the control head and then install it and epoxy it in place. The wiring was a few hrs. Windlass install was another long process.
__________________
Sandero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 16:20   #458
Moderator
 
Hudson Force's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Living aboard & cruising since 1972
Boat: Morgan OI 413 1973 - Aythya
Posts: 7,257
Images: 1
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Heat and humidity also slow my work progress. If it's very hot I limit myself to a couple of hours. I am likely to make stupid mistakes if I attempt to extend my efforts long into a hot day!
__________________
Take care and joy, Aythya crew
Hudson Force is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 16:40   #459
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 12,208
Reasons to stay "Monohull"

I've spent two years so far and am now very close to being finished, my part anyway, I'm going to have the chain plates and standing rigging done. Large reason for the time is I am still working and have only the weekends, and some of those times I want to sail .
I still have I think 10 months to go before I tell them to take this job and shove it, so I will spend 10 more months getting ready.
Sometime it takes as long as it does, cause you have that much time. And yes I am to some extent building a floating Condo as I am having someone come with me, and I feel I need to provide her with her comforts, she is not and has never been a camper.
Camping to her was a 36' fifth wheel.
I have 10 months or so left as that is when the Daughter graduates High School and when the wife completes her teaching contract.
Also I don't think I had the funds to do it all at once, in two years, I have paid off the boat and paid for all the overhaul / upgrades, some of us don't have the assets all at once, then there is the selling the house and "stuff" putting into storage, Lords knows what all else, it's not just getting run boat ready.


Sent from my iPad Pro using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
a64pilot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 17:30   #460
smj
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: galveston tx.
Boat: Searunner 38 catamaran
Posts: 2,887
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

This is the outside of our catamaran that we bought almost a year ago
Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByCruisers Sailing Forum1469143462.657643.jpg
Views:	67
Size:	230.1 KB
ID:	128180
And this is the inside
Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByCruisers Sailing Forum1469143531.160454.jpg
Views:	68
Size:	36.2 KB
ID:	128181
Since we bought her she has been sitting on the hard in North Carolina. We will head up there in 2 weeks and hopefully get enough done on her in 2 months to make the trip south. The mast, rigging, sails and motor are all new, the interior pretty much an open shell. We do have a queen sized berth with cushion and the settee is roughed in. We will install water tanks, a basic pressure water system with countertop and sink, a propane system with cooktop and a propane on demand water heater and a composting head. What else do you need:-)! Not luxury and it will take time to finish but she is light and fast.


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
smj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 18:07   #461
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 15,391
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Quote:
Originally Posted by smj View Post

(...)

What else do you need:-)!

(...)
You mentioned the things that will make the shell liveaboard' able. None of the things that will make her sail ...

Sails, rigging, maybe some form of an aux propulsion too.

BTW very nice boat. Definitely one of the reasons NOT to stay mono (see the tread's title, sic!) Our friends sailed out in a similar boat (from the EU) and are somewhere beyond Panama by now. Lucky ducks.

If I can ask, why do you start so "late", it is midsummer now, is fall not going to be breathing down your necks?

b.
__________________
barnakiel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-07-2016, 21:44   #462
smj
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: galveston tx.
Boat: Searunner 38 catamaran
Posts: 2,887
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
You mentioned the things that will make the shell liveaboard' able. None of the things that will make her sail ...

Sails, rigging, maybe some form of an aux propulsion too.

BTW very nice boat. Definitely one of the reasons NOT to stay mono (see the tread's title, sic!) Our friends sailed out in a similar boat (from the EU) and are somewhere beyond Panama by now. Lucky ducks.

If I can ask, why do you start so "late", it is midsummer now, is fall not going to be breathing down your necks?

b.

I believe I mentioned it but the boat is fully able to sail. She has a new rig, new Hydranet sails and a new motor, but unfinished on the interior. She lacks the space and headroom of a modern 38' production cat but more than makes up for it with her build and performance.
The best time to leave North Carolina would be mid to late October because the hurricane season should be dying down and the weather getting a little cooler. So maybe perfect timing!
Thanks for the compliment on our boat. She would appeal to maybe 5% of the current crowd of multihull buyers as she is a wood composite build and doesn't resemble a luxury condo! Just a common sense cruiser in our opinion.


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
smj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2016, 05:16   #463
Registered User
 
malbert73's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Boat: Tartan 40
Posts: 912
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Nice work! And this is the kind of boat that would make me leave monohulls. Unless you go high end or build yourself (like 44cc) there aren't a lot of production cats that focus on performance even at detriment of interior, and don't look like condos. No matter what most cats of same length will have more interior space but for now I just can't stomach the neutered sailing experience and elevated "bus-like" steering stations of most production cats.


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
malbert73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2016, 05:35   #464
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,890
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

While you can certainly spend 2yrs working on projects, we left 6months after buying and that was more about the work transition. We had planned to transition from full to part time in the fall and took possession of the boat in the spring.


Realistically, we could have headed out after a week as there was nothing required. Instead we would stop for a week to a month every so often and would tick off a project if it rose to the top of the list.


Now if you buy a trashed boat that needs a total refit, that's different but the vast majority of multi-year project boats are simply someone who is never going to head out. They will keep coming up with new projects whenever it looks like they might have to slip the lines.
__________________
valhalla360 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-07-2016, 06:05   #465
Registered User
 
Sandero's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Southern Westchester/Northport LI
Boat: Shiva - Contest 36s
Posts: 4,029
Re: Reasons to stay "Monohull"

Quote:
Originally Posted by valhalla360 View Post
While you can certainly spend 2yrs working on projects, we left 6months after buying and that was more about the work transition. We had planned to transition from full to part time in the fall and took possession of the boat in the spring.


Realistically, we could have headed out after a week as there was nothing required. Instead we would stop for a week to a month every so often and would tick off a project if it rose to the top of the list.


Now if you buy a trashed boat that needs a total refit, that's different but the vast majority of multi-year project boats are simply someone who is never going to head out. They will keep coming up with new projects whenever it looks like they might have to slip the lines.
This is not entirely accurate... I bought a brand new Contest 36s which had an installed instrument package. To take the boat offshore needed a whole bunch of "upgrades" and equipment such as a AP and a Windlass.. position fixer (GPS these days), Storm sails and tracks. The boat I bought could be cruised locally and was from the day I bought it. But the surveyor correctly noted that the boat was capable of offshore long distance cruising... but would require upgrades, equipment, spares and so on. These projects were leisurely accomplished over 5 years as I learned to sail the boat and find the best solutions. I certainly could have done it in less time... I still had an active architectural practice and other personal issues which prevented me from speeding up the process. I left at the right time and just getting rid of and storing all my stuff took a several months!

Sure if some world cruising yacht comes up for sale... you can buy it... spend some time learning the boat... and be gone while you deal with all your property and affairs in a few months. And I suspect there are a fair number of tricked out offshore boats on the market... sort of ready to go. I suspect the process to take the average equipped coastal boat to an offshore live aboard world cruiser is likely longer than 2 months. I think this is unrealistic
__________________

__________________
Sandero is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
hull, monohull

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Removable Cutter Stay vs Solent Stay Orchidius Deck hardware: Rigging, Sails & Hoisting 16 30-06-2014 03:36
St Augustine - To stay or Not to stay alsobrsp Atlantic & the Caribbean 1 17-01-2013 13:07
For Sale: Stay sail, Storm Sail, & Head Stay MoonlightSailor Classifieds Archive 1 18-12-2009 11:27
For Sale: Stay sail, storm sail, & head stay MoonlightSailor Classifieds Archive 0 31-10-2009 17:25
Removable Stay(sail) or not to stay... jcmcdowell Monohull Sailboats 8 27-08-2004 15:30


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:57.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.