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Old 20-03-2015, 10:47   #16
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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If you can find a used mast, with the same profile, and dimensions i couldbelieve $5,000. Heck I could believe a lot less. Scrap value for aluminium is around $1/lb, so for a breaker yard selling for anything more than scrap price is a win.

But finding a used mast isn't all that easy. Maybe if you live in south Florida at a boatyard that breaks post hurricane boats there would be some sort of selection, but otherwise I doubt it. I have had to replace two masts for relatively large one design boats, and couldn't find a used one anywhere. Despite some's beliefs I just don't think it is a reasonable plan. But sure it's worth looking, you might get lucky.
Between Maine and RI there are dozens of large boatyards with significant junk sections. What I did notice however is that if they perceive you as a mark they will definitely try to gouge you. If they see marine pro they will deal accordingly. When I first ventured there as a fresh boat owner they would quote one price to me on the phone, probably figuring out right away that I was a newbie. When I would come in with my marine pro friend and he started talking shop with them the price magically was only a fraction of what was quoted to me. May be that's the secret. If you're going in there with the idea that a used 30 year old must can't possibly be found for less than $5K+ they will sell you one for $5K+ no questions asked.
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Old 20-03-2015, 11:02   #17
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

Assuming the old mast boom etc is with the boat, I would try to locate a used mast that will work. Once located and reasonable $, I would make a time limited low offer on the boat. If the $ make any sense at all..... to end up with a bargain.
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Old 20-03-2015, 11:10   #18
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

"I am selling this project boat for a friend" = "I bought this for a song, and now I'm trying to flip it, and make a quick few bucks"
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Old 20-03-2015, 11:16   #19
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Purchasing boat with broken mast

Cheechako-the boat does come with a replacement mast and the original boom and rigging.


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Old 20-03-2015, 11:17   #20
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Purchasing boat with broken mast

MarkSF-you are probably right. He probably bought from a friend super cheap and now trying to resell it for a few bucks more. But does come with a replacement mast and the original boom and rigging.


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Old 20-03-2015, 13:13   #21
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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...If we think the boat is worth the $5,000, we would definitely get a survey to hopefully find out if there are any other hidden problems but would like to not spend the money on a survey if the cost is more than $15,000 to fix her up. Thanks.
This is the catch - if you don't have it surveyed, you need a pro to check what the repairs would cost - essentially what it needs to be done to make it safe and seaworthy as you'll need insurance to rubber stamp another survey after the repairs. I am sure you can do some of the repairs, but not sure if yourself would be able to get a reasonable estimate of what the repairs would cost.

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MarkSF-you are probably right. He probably bought from a friend super cheap and now trying to resell it for a few bucks more. But does come with a replacement mast and the original boom and rigging.
...
If that is the case, then check the Title - who owns the boat? Names on bill of sale and title needs to be same, no? I would ask why the "friend" isn't capable of selling his own boat anyway.
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Old 20-03-2015, 13:20   #22
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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...the boat does come with a replacement mast and the original boom and rigging.
Read the ad carefully. It says that the boat comes with a "spare" mast. It doesn't say that this "spare" came off of another Morgan 382, or is an identical replacement for the original. My bet would be that he bought a used mast that he kinda, sorta--without really measuring or being sure of anything--hopes will work on this boat.

To me, the vagueness about the "spare" mast is a big red flag.

Let's do a little translation work on this ad. Mark got a good start, but what about some of the other red flags here?

"The boat has new(er) chain plates. Not sure if they were replaced after the mishap but they look strong and new." Translation: They were not replaced after the mishap. I took a quick glance at them and they seem to be in one piece, so I guess they're good. (Plan on finding them damaged.)

"Engine looks like it needs a new impeller..." Translation: The engine is on its last legs. (Like somehow you can LOOK at an engine and tell it needs a new impeller!?! Plan on major engine work.)

"She has had some water damage to her flooring..." Translation: This boat sat for some time full of water. (It is suffering from a whole lot more damage and neglect than just hitting a bridge! Plan on a complete new interior and expect other significant issues.)

"The ceiling panels need to be replaced too." Translation: This boat didn't just get a little water inside. This boat sank. It was all the way under water. (Expect to find that everywhere there COULD be damage, there WILL be damage.)

The Morgan 382/3/4 series are good boats. I like them. They're on the short list for my next boat. I could be wrong, and only a really close examination can tell you for sure, but this one sounds like a complete piece of junk. There are enough other Morgan 382s out there that I wouldn't waste my time on this one. Yes, one in decent shape is going to cost more up front. But I'm willing to bet that in the long run, this one will cost way, WAAAAAAY more to get into sailing shape than if you start with a boat that doesn't have so many problems.

Good luck, whatever you decide to do.
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Old 20-03-2015, 14:19   #23
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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Originally Posted by fishbait58 View Post
MarkSF-you are probably right. He probably bought from a friend super cheap and now trying to resell it for a few bucks more. But does come with a replacement mast and the original boom and rigging.

If original rigging that means what was on the boat when it hit the bridge and broke the original mast then I would be extremely reluctant to reuse it. Just like the chainplates.
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Old 20-03-2015, 14:23   #24
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

Have not read the whole add for this boat but have just seen the comments about the water damage.

RUN AWAY.

Water damage to wood work and bulkheads then was all the wiring under water? Will you have to rewire the whole boat, replace overhead, replace bulkheads, floor, cabinet work?

Too easy to find a Morgan 38 for a good deal in better shape.

Even cheap, cheap this boat could be too expensive.
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Old 20-03-2015, 14:24   #25
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

I really appreciate all the info and advice. It gives a lot of food for thought. I'm waiting on a call back to ask lots of questions before looking at her. I'm thinking the boat hasn't been sunk before since the motor does run. I hope that is a good assumption but will definitely ask.


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Old 23-03-2015, 06:53   #26
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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I'm thinking the boat hasn't been sunk before since the motor does run. I hope that is a good assumption but will definitely ask.
Not a good assumption. If the engine was not running when it sank then it is entirely possible for it to fire up and run some after being re-floated. It is even possible that it would be in fairly decent condition, and only need a little bit of cleaning up, after sinking. But that is just the engine.

To me, the rest of this boat--and all of its other problems--is a much bigger issue than the engine.

As I mentioned, I like the Morgan 382/3/4 series of boats. I saw the same ad you are talking about. I live in Tampa, so, really not that far to go look at it. I didn't, though, and I'm not going to. Too many red flags. Not worth my time when there are so many other, better, boats available.

Of course, your money, your choice, but I would walk away.
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Old 23-03-2015, 08:19   #27
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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Not a good assumption. If the engine was not running when it sank then it is entirely possible for it to fire up and run some after being re-floated. It is even possible that it would be in fairly decent condition, and only need a little bit of cleaning up, after sinking. But that is just the engine.

To me, the rest of this boat--and all of its other problems--is a much bigger issue than the engine.

As I mentioned, I like the Morgan 382/3/4 series of boats. I saw the same ad you are talking about. I live in Tampa, so, really not that far to go look at it. I didn't, though, and I'm not going to. Too many red flags. Not worth my time when there are so many other, better, boats available.

Of course, your money, your choice, but I would walk away.
All right on the money. Running engine is not a guarantee the boat wasn't sunk. I once had a ski boat that sunk twice and kept the same outboard for years. If handled properly and promptly a submerged engine can be resuscitated but if done half assed can run but will die and early death.

You can bet that if the ad reported all these problems then you will find a LOT more if you get into repairing it. That you can be 100% certain of.

Bottom line. To make sense to buy this boat:

- you have a tiny savings account and a tiny income to match so no way to save more to buy a better boat.
- great skills in electrical, carpentry, mechanical, plumbing, etc so you can do it ALL yourself.
- lots and lots of time that you couldn't devote to earning more money to buy a better boat.

Otherwise, buy one in better shape. In the long run it will be cheaper. Literally cost you less money than you will spend fixing the wreck and you will be sailing years sooner.

This is not just wild speculation but the voice of experience from someone that has been there, done that.
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Old 24-03-2015, 06:42   #28
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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...and you will be sailing years sooner.
To me, this is the most important point.

If what you want is a project, then buy a project boat. If what you want is to SAIL, then buy a boat that isn't going to take years of work (and tons of money) before it is ready to sail.
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Old 24-03-2015, 06:57   #29
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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Originally Posted by fishbait58 View Post
I really appreciate all the info and advice. It gives a lot of food for thought. I'm waiting on a call back to ask lots of questions before looking at her. I'm thinking the boat hasn't been sunk before since the motor does run. I hope that is a good assumption but will definitely ask.


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Sounds like junk. Find a good boat in good condition if you want to go sailing.

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Old 24-03-2015, 09:09   #30
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Re: Purchasing boat with broken mast

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To me, this is the most important point.

If what you want is a project, then buy a project boat. If what you want is to SAIL, then buy a boat that isn't going to take years of work (and tons of money) before it is ready to sail.
If your ultimate goal is to do day sails only this apporach is the best. If the goal is to do more distant sailing and to learn boat systems, etc than buying something in semi-decent shape and bringing her to life/shine makes better sense as 1) you can usually then afford a bigger boat, 2) you learn stuff you'd pay someone to teach you, 3) you will feel more confident out there many miles away from Seatow knowing that you can fix it yourself on the spot or that it doesn't really matter and can wait until you arrive to port.

The only issue I see in taking the 2nd approach is that newbies often overpay for TLC boats. In the past 20 years the market was and for the foreseeable future will be a buyer's market no matter what the brokers or glossy mags tell us. And in this market only pristine Bristol condition boats can fetch anything even close to the advertised price. Everything else is pretty much can and should be had for fraction of that. No matter what the sellers feel their boats should be worth.

As far as "sailing right away" vs. working on a boat, here in New England we have about 1-1.5 months on the ends of the off season when it's too cold to sail or the docks/moorings are not open yet, but it's not too cold to work on your boat, especially with the help of the cover and a heater. For me spending the weekends during this time working on a boat is not a chore since I wold not work on weekends most of this time anyway and it gives me the needed psychological boost to endure our winter. If I had to work off the cost of a new or even newish boat instead of puttering around it I would be in much worse shape mentally. Not to mention getting the much needed exercise.
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