Production Mono's - Any to avoid?

[MJH]

Originally Posted by UFO

So after searching for a cat for my family to live on and seeing quite a few I have come to the conclusion that I should go with a mono-hull - Budget has been spanked by a sh*t housing market (Perth Australia) and by the Aussie Dollar collapsing - I am looking for a VAT paid boat in Europe.


Looking for a Blue Water Cruiser 48-54' with a minimum of 3 Cabins that is a quality build and on the easier side to short hand - Up to around USD$300K.



Should I avoid any of the following for build/quality reasons:


Bavaria
Moody
Beneteau
Jeaneau
Hanse
Dufour


Also any recommendations for quality boats to look at would be appreciated

I'm not sure you are on the correct track to solve the challenge before you.

You are looking for a "live-aboard" for your family (size unspecified) and considering production boats that are generally built for folks that live on them a much shorter time. Plus you don't seem to be very concerned about the boat's sailing quality, just that it be a quality built and can be short handed. I don't know what the Australian housing market has to do with your selection except perhaps a poor price for selling your existing home.

My Internet search revealed that there are only 14 boats currently produced by those six manufacturers in the 48-54' range and I suspect your budget won't buy any of them once taxes and outfitting is considered.

I can only recommend a pain staking boat search to see what is available to meet your requirements on the used market that is within your budget. Narrow your search into a handful and then dig deeper into the pluses and minuses of those models.

Good Luck.

~ ~ _/) ~ ~ MJH

[Fbfisher]

Given his stated budget of $300K for 48’-54’ boat, he’s buying a used boat as there are no new boats of that size for that price.

It is interesting that the boat industry is unlike the auto industry in that there are no long term reliability reviews. There are no “top 10 most/least reliable” lists. There is no equivalent of JD Power that evaluates reliability over a specified period of time.

As a result, all one can hope for in asking the question of the OP, is a bunch of subjective responses informed by varied experience, which is largely useless, because for every opinion there is a counter argument.

Just once I’d like to see an OP come back to the forum and say “based on what I’ve read here, I chose this boat.” Never seen it, likely never will.

Cheers!

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by FabioC

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

One additional consideration that has not been mentioned in the thread yet is the quality of the rigging, the hardware, the systems, the sails, etc. on the boat, in addition to the soundness of the hull. My impression is that these elements in all popular production boats are done on the cheap. To make any production boat truly seaworthy, significant improvements/changes in these elements are necessary. The quality of what comes from the factory is adequate for general use, like inshore cruising or low-key racing, but improvements are probably desirable when it comes to crossing oceans safely.

Which has already been carefully mentioned in Dale's posts about his boat. He mentioned comparing deck hardware. Quite well, too. Compare the travelers on Bs (for example) vs. Cs and you'll see: same size boats the Cs travelers are beefier and much wider, allowing you to actually use them as a traveler!

[Fbfisher]

Originally Posted by Stu Jackson

Which has already been carefully mentioned in Dale's posts about his boat. He mentioned comparing deck hardware. Quite well, too. Compare the travelers on Bs (for example) vs. Cs and you'll see: same size boats the Cs travelers are beefier and much wider, allowing you to actually use them as a traveler!

And here we go...I’ve not experienced any problem using the traveler on my Beneteau 423, seems plenty robust regardless of the conditions. Given that I race the boat weekly, the traveler is used quite often on several points of sail. Never a problem, works great!

See how easily one opinion can be refuted by another, thus making all opinions useless.

Cheers!

[FabioC]

The traveler probably not the best example...
My boat does not even have a traveler, she has a "German" mainsheet with the rings, that are starting to be prevalent in today's production boats.
Personally, I find the German mainsheet a far cry from a traveler in terms of ability to fine tune the shape of the mainsail, but that is a totally different topic of discussion.

[Cheechako]

Once a boat is maybe 8 years old, it all depends on the boat, so dont be afraid to buy older. It looks like you are into the modern boats, but I would also consider:
Hylas
Passport
Halberg Rassey
Tashiba
Taswell
Panda
...anything built by Ta Shing

[Fbfisher]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Once a boat is maybe 8 years old, it all depends on the boat, so dont be afraid to buy older. It looks like you are into the modern boats, but I would consider:
Hylas
Passport
Halberg Rassey

With a $300K budget for 48’-54’?!?! Show me some examples please.

Cheers!

[grahamj]

Originally Posted by Stu Jackson

Compare the travelers on Bs (for example) vs. Cs and you'll see: same size boats the Cs travelers are beefier and much wider, allowing you to actually use them as a traveler!

Perhaps that might be true for plus 40ft boats but having bought a 25ft C, B and Hunter in the last three years I cannot agree. There is no comparison. The C and H fittings I replaced because they weren't up to it. The B fittings were fit for purpose. And that's before you look at the standing rigging.

It is clear that the C and H were built to a price in a very competitive market. the B not so much. Maybe the B's built in the USA are different.

[Dr. D]

For any of these boats, examine the layout of the cockpit and cabins closely. We bought our Beneteau Oceanis 35.1 last year exactly for the layout. Both my wife and I are older, but we can get around the boat easily because of the layout. Also, I find single handling the boat much easier with the open cockpit (two wheels all the way aft in the cockpit) than a traditional cockpit.



Mind you, I am not recommending our model for you; much too small. But how the boat is set up may be more important day-to-day than some other factors.



I know a couple who bought a Hanse because the wife saw the forward cabin and realized she would be sleeping in a nearly normal bed and said, "We are buying this one."

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by Fbfisher

With a $300K budget for 48’-54’?!?! Show me some examples please.

Cheers!

yeah, might be tough, especially your location... but searching takes time...
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/199...owse%20listing
https://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/49191

[B23iL23]

Check out Patrick Laine (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEZ..._EEDDBQ/videos). he's in his 60's (I think) and sails his almost stock Bavaria 40 from France to UK/Ireland/Shetland/Iceland/Faroes/Azores and all single handed.


Any boat properly prepared and with a good skipper can sail anywhere.

[boatpoker]

Don't buy one built by Ikea ..... oops, I mean Hanse.

[Eder]

Originally Posted by Fbfisher

And here we go...I’ve not experienced any problem using the traveler on my Beneteau 423, seems plenty robust regardless of the conditions. Given that I race the boat weekly, the traveler is used quite often on several points of sail. Never a problem, works great!

See how easily one opinion can be refuted by another, thus making all opinions useless.

Cheers!

My IP has a very robust traveler...after about 12,000 nautical miles...mostly blue water, I've never used it.

[Jim Cate]

My IP has a very robust traveler...after about 12,000 nautical miles...mostly blue water, I've never used it.

Which, of course, is a comment on your sailing skills and methods and not about the hardware at all'

Or is it a case of the hardware being so badly designed that it is unusable?

Jim

[daletournier]

My boat has alot of good garhauer stuff on it, quite heavily speced BUT when they first come out the traveller was a little under speced. Garhauer then made a much stronger unit to replace the original.

When I purchased my boat it had the original, I spent 3k and imported the heavier stronger unit and fitted it myself. Would the original of been OK? Maybe, BUT I've been caught out before and made mistakes and seen the load that the rig and associated parts have to handle.

It's only when your 1000nm off shore and get smashed that you truly appreciate having heavy duty stuff, I do not regret putting on my new beaut big meaty traveller.... and I use it.

When you get caught out you don't want to be worrying is my rig etc upto the task.