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Old 05-03-2016, 07:33   #106
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Originally Posted by Jhubb_99 View Post
Considering a larger outboard. I have an opportunity to by a used Yamaha 25hp 4 stroke, 160lbs. Any thoughts on if the transom of the Tartan 27 is capable of holding that weight?
OK, I did just by chance come across this image of a Columbia 29 stern with a pretty big engine on it. No awards for beauty, that's for sure...., but plenty of power I bet....
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Old 05-03-2016, 07:57   #107
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Originally Posted by Jhubb_99 View Post
Considering a larger outboard. I have an opportunity to by a used Yamaha 25hp 4 stroke, 160lbs. Any thoughts on if the transom of the Tartan 27 is capable of holding that weight?
The 2003-ish 15hp 4 stroke Yamaha I had on my first Vega was quite large and comical off the back of the transom, not to mention unnecessary for the conditions I found myself (Pacific coast). I was actively seeking a 9.9 or smaller to replace it. With proper reinforcement (mine had aluminum rails backed by wood sheet) strength should not be a problem.
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Old 09-04-2016, 07:17   #108
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

I did a conversion/mod to our boat a number of years ago. Diesel came out. Old engine compartment now houses 480 amp hrs. of batteries that are charged with solar panels. Boat is perfectly in trim with weight of batteries (diesel out batteries in). Net we lost about 100 pounds. Gained the extra battery storage and an additional 30 gallon tank for water.

Built a custom engine well/compartment in the aft cockpit area. Hung a 15 hp outboard. Engine pivots about 45 degrees port and starboard. So acts like a "stern thruster." Engine and controls are internal to the cockpit, not hung externally on the transom. Excellent for close in maneuvering. We average a bit better than 4 knots at half throttle. So there is plenty of reserve power. Reach hull speed at far less than full throttle. If I were to replace the motor today I would choose a 9.9hp motor.

Boat is an Able 32. 12,500 pounds. Engine pivots up clear of water. The prop has never cavitated up to this point in time. Old aperture has been filled. Bottom is totally clean. Huge improvement to the sailing qualities of the boat.....no question.

I built two small lockers to house two small fuel tanks. Standard red plastic outboard tanks....3.5 gal. Two jerry cans at the rail bring us up to 17 gallons total. Can always add two more jerry cans. Fuel economy has been fine.

In terms of pro and con............?? It has all been pretty much in the pro column. Truthfully. I would do it again in a heartbeat. The only major con would be the fact that we now carry gasoline on board. But we are careful in terms of storage. All storage is outside in easily hand carried tanks and well drained.

But I rationalize this "con" this way........ Unless you are powering your dinghy with a Torqueedo or an LP gas engine, then you are most likely using a gasoline outboard. My point here is that most all of us are carrying gasoline aboard anyway. Some safer than others. I would guess that 98% of us have a jerry can or two strapped to the rail...........right?

So instead of 3 types of fuel.....(Diesel, Gas, and Propane) we carry only two. Gasoline and Alcohol for an Origo stove.

I consulted with James Baldwin a bit. Our solution was very much in line with his past work. I agree with much of his philosophy and approach to a good cruising boat. Simple and easily maintained. So I give him all of the credit he deserves.

This solution may not be for everyone. But it has worked well for us. In terms of storage, sailing performance, maneuvering under power, maintenance and convenience it has been far better than our old diesel. Thus far anyway.

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Old 09-04-2016, 22:26   #109
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

Quite a difference between a decently engineered outboard setup and just throwing a motor on a corner of a transom.

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Old 07-06-2016, 13:48   #110
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

For those that have an outboard on their boats how deep do you have your cavitation plate below the water? How often does the prop come out of the water at that depth?

I am a bay sailer and my Volvo's high pressure fuel pump died on me again. Will be pulling it and putting an outboard on the center of my transom. The mount itself has 15" of throw. I could have set it up so that the engine is completely out of the water vertically (no tilt) but the cavitation plate would only be about an inch under the surface and I think deeper would be better.

I will be installing a Suzuki DF9.9BTX. Compared to most 9.9s it has twice the charging capacity (12amp), an actual oil filter, a big 4 blade 10" diameter 5 pitch prop, fuel injection and about 60% more displacement as it shares the same block as the 15 and 20hp Suzuki outboards. The displacement should mean it has more low end power than other units. Only difference between it and the 15 and 20 is programming and a restrictor plate that would limit top end power. Added benefit of the fuel injection is you can tie its computer into a NMEA2000 network to get engine data (tach, temp, fuel consumption and such) on a MFD.

Shawn
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Old 07-06-2016, 14:19   #111
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Originally Posted by Shawn67 View Post
For those that have an outboard on their boats how deep do you have your cavitation plate below the water? How often does the prop come out of the water at that depth?

I am a bay sailer and my Volvo's high pressure fuel pump died on me again. Will be pulling it and putting an outboard on the center of my transom. The mount itself has 15" of throw. I could have set it up so that the engine is completely out of the water vertically (no tilt) but the cavitation plate would only be about an inch under the surface and I think deeper would be better.

I will be installing a Suzuki DF9.9BTX. Compared to most 9.9s it has twice the charging capacity (12amp), an actual oil filter, a big 4 blade 10" diameter 5 pitch prop, fuel injection and about 60% more displacement as it shares the same block as the 15 and 20hp Suzuki outboards. The displacement should mean it has more low end power than other units. Only difference between it and the 15 and 20 is programming and a restrictor plate that would limit top end power. Added benefit of the fuel injection is you can tie its computer into a NMEA2000 network to get engine data (tach, temp, fuel consumption and such) on a MFD.

Shawn
In your case I'd recommend something custom made. You'll have to engineer it yourself, and then find a good local metal fabrication shop to prepare all the pieces to put together. Your Saber has a pretty vertical stern, the trick is to have lever arms long enough to lower the engine fully to the correct depth and raise it completely out of the water. And you'll need a way to hoist it easily. In my case my pushpit is strong enough to support old mainsheet blocks so I can hoist and lower the engine pretty easily. If your pushpit is not up to it, you may need to add supporting stanchions back there. If you look at my album I have a couple of shots of my set-up like that, it works well for me. The major con is the ugliness of an engine hanging out there, but I sure like the sleek, prop-less, through-hull-less and stuffing box-less hull.
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Old 07-06-2016, 14:22   #112
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

Most important, does the proposed outboard have a 25 inch lower unit.
I have found that 4+ inches below the waterline is mandatory in reverse,
useful in forward.
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Old 07-06-2016, 14:31   #113
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

"“ the trick is to have lever arms long enough to lower the engine fully to the correct depth and raise it completely out of the water. “

I can certainly get it deeper with what I have but it means that to get it fully out of the water I will also need to tilt the engine. With my type of sailing that isn’t a big deal and the engine has power tilt on the remote control so it is easy to do. I have seen some really nice looking sliding setups to raise and lower an outboard on a car type system.

“The major con is the ugliness of an engine hanging out there, but I sure like the sleek, prop-less, through-hull-less and stuffing box-less hull.”

Agreed. And not having to try and stuff my 6’5” self into cockpit lockers, folded in half, trying to change out impellers or adjusting the stuffing box will be nice too.

Shawn
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Old 07-06-2016, 14:37   #114
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

The Suzuki DF9.9BTX has the 25" shaft. Good luck getting that out of the water without tilting the motor. But you are in luck, the BTX has power tilt. You are already using a mount with 15 inches of travel (which is pretty much max). And I suspect you are using a Garelick, which is a pretty beefy mount. Pull up on the mount and hit the button for the power tilt. Problem solved. I would adjust the mount so that in the full up position and with full tilt, the prop is maybe 3-6 inches out of the water. If it drags a little while sailing in rough seas, no big deal if the motor is in neutral. The prop on my diesel spins like a top. Nice outboard by the way! With remote shift, throttle and electric start, they don't make a nicer outboard for sailboats. And as you mentioned, a larger than average alternator and hookup to NMEA2000 is icing on the cake. Hope it works for you.
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Old 07-06-2016, 14:38   #115
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Originally Posted by Scaramanga F25 View Post
Most important, does the proposed outboard have a 25 inch lower unit.
I have found that 4+ inches below the waterline is mandatory in reverse,
useful in forward.
Yes, 25" lower unit. From the cavitation plate to the bottom of the skeg is around 14" (as far as I can tell) which is a bit bigger than most other 9.9s.

That dimension is what threw me off a little in getting the engine deeper while still keeping it fully out of the water. The mount I have gives 15" of throw.

I can certainly do a combination of the mount and tilt if needed to get the depth I want/need. Will need to space the mount out from the transom a little though to allow the engine to fully tilt in its fully upright position.

Shawn
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Old 07-06-2016, 15:21   #116
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

Seems like a good set up. I would get the cavitation plate 6"
deep making tilting mandatory. You might also consider stowing your fuel tanke below and running the feeder line through the transom
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Old 07-06-2016, 15:28   #117
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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. You are already using a mount with 15 inches of travel (which is pretty much max). And I suspect you are using a Garelick, which is a pretty beefy mount. Pull up on the mount and hit the button for the power tilt. Problem solved. I would adjust the mount so that in the full up position and with full tilt, the prop is maybe 3-6 inches out of the water. If it drags a little while sailing in rough seas, no big deal if the motor is in neutral. The prop on my diesel spins like a top. Nice outboard by the way! With remote shift, throttle and electric start, they don't make a nicer outboard for sailboats. And as you mentioned, a larger than average alternator and hookup to NMEA2000 is icing on the cake. Hope it works for you.
Yes, one of the big Garelick 4 stroke mounts. The thing is very solid. I have a solar panel on my rear pulpit which is an additional dimension to watch out for. If I set it up to tilt with the mount fully up I either have to move the solar panel or drop the Garelick mount about 7" down (engine grows about 7" taller as it tilts) which I can do. That should put the cavitation plate about 8" underwater and with the engine fully up and tilted it should still be completely out of the water. I haven't found exact diagrams for the raised height of the skeg on the 25" shaft when tilted.

To tilt when fully up I have to add about a 2.5" spacer between the mount and the transom. Was thinking about HDPE for that.

I am hoping the Suzuki is a nice engine. I have their 2.5hp and it is a nice little engine. The 9.9 checks all the right boxes for a sailboat and Suzuki is apparently the only company that allows shipping of remote models.

Shawn
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Old 07-06-2016, 15:31   #118
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Seems like a good set up. I would get the cavitation plate 6"
deep making tilting mandatory. You might also consider stowing your fuel tanke below and running the feeder line through the transom
Thanks, I am planning on having the tank down below with a Racor filter inline. I did that with a Tohatsu 6hp Sailpro on a previous boat and never had an issue with clogged jets on it.

Shawn
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Old 07-06-2016, 16:13   #119
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

We are using the Garelich 15" travel 4 cycle mount with a 6 HP Tohatsu extra long (25") shaft. We lower the engine enough to get the prop about 10" under water. So far we haven't had any problem when the boat pitches. With the engine tilted up we can't raise the mount to the top notch as then the shift lever interferes with tilting the engine.. And we are using spacer blocks to get the mount vertical. The springs on the Garelich are just right for the 60 lb Tohatsu but you'll need a 2:1 pulley on the stern pulpit to raise the 100 lb Suzuki
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Old 17-06-2016, 08:39   #120
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

just my 2 cents .
about a year ago i decided to go that route and removal my sometimes faulty inboard and install a 15HP xls 25" outboard in a bracket .with a remote control in order to fully tested last winter/spring i sail from fort lauderdale to key biscayne ,Bimini,and all the way to the Exumas (island hoping)for a month
conclusion :absolutely wonderfull ,so many advantages like noise ,easy of maintenance ,and 0 complaints ,i believed in this size boat they outperform inboard diesel
disclaimers:even thought i have an electronic charger I used a 100 w solar panel for in house ,including fridge
I have to modified the bracket for best performance and to avoid cavitation
so a bit of customization to each boat will go a long way
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